Come to the Holiday Party! Except for White People

[Derec]

View attachment 44945

These days, the color chart is the other way around ...

 

[Jarhyn]

There were so many ways to have a party that excluded disrespectful assholes, from setting a Kwanzaa party as bait to throw out anyone who "disrupts" the party, to having ANYONE else throw the party you wanted and checking out of the unfun one, to just being selective over who gets invitations...

This was handled so poorly.

 

[JohnG]

Kinda odd that it's been going on for 10 years with no complaints until now. Why now?

Maybe because some fool let the cat out the bag when inadvertently emailing the invite to whitey.

anyway, good for Wu for being honest about her racism.

Yes it seems like she sent out invites to unintended recipients.

I assume those recipients really really wanted to go but were sad because they weren't invited and now they have nothing to do. Tragic.

 

[thebeave]

View attachment 44945

These days, the color chart is the other way around ...

I know. That's what I meant to say in my post with that chart, but looking back at it now, it is was clumsily worded.

 

[thebeave]

I'm very light skinned for an indian. My brother is very dark skinned. We have the same parents. He gets in, I don't?

Unless one of you is an elected official in Boston, neither of you will.

It's a holiday gathering of people who have some things in common. "Elected officials who aren't white, in a place dominated by white folks, like Boston".

But it's just a party, Wu isn't handing out pay raises or anything important like that.

The optics are bad, but that's the biggest problem. That's not enough for me to care about. Why a Californian would find it an issue is beyond me. Unless they're looking for reasons to bitch about politicians they don't like.
Tom

The article came up in my news feed, like a lot of news articles about happenings in other states. You seem to jump into threads fairly frequently and then write to complain about how the subject matter doesn't interest you. You can always just skedaddle if you don't like the topic. Its what most people do. On the other hand, maybe I should try it and drop by the Poetry thread (for the first time ever) and announce to everyone there that I think poetry is boring and then leave. Nah.

 

[marc]

Without details of why this might be a problem, sounds a lot like people complaining about 'Black History Month', saying why isn't there a white history month, ignoring that pretty much all of history taught in the country centers around white people. Or maybe like a meme that I can't find now where group A is large and excludes group B, so group B creates a space for themselves, and group A complains that they are not included and forces their way into the new space.

 

[southernhybrid]

I told my closest Black friend, who hates the term, "people of color" that I'm not white, I'm beige with speckles. She refers to herself as Black and hates any other term to describe herself. I'm quite sure that she wouldn't like any party that excludes anyone based on the color of their skin, so even though I don't know the details of why this party is exclusionary, I don't think it helps race relationships to do this.

I know some of you don't like the intellectual, linguist John McWhorter, who is Black and ofter writes interesting articles about race and racism. I read one recently where he explained that he thinks, a lot of folks are infantilizing black people by over reacting to little things, especially historical terms that had different meanings in the past etc. He feels that many times, Black people are being made to feel like victims, when they aren't at all victims. He worries that this type of treatment will prevent children from being able to handle real problems, when they reach adulthood. Sure, some are victims of extreme racism, like the two lovely women who sued Rudy and won. To treat someone differently due to the color of their skin is wrong, but that includes hatred of anyone based on their ethnicity or skin color.

I read recently how a very wealthy white guy has been giving a lot of money to help Black children etc. and he's been criticized as trying to be a "white savior". I think this has gotten a bit crazy. The man has given to other causes to help the poor and I doubt he even thinks about the skin color of those who he helps. He's just trying to share a lot of his wealth, which I think he made through successful investing. It's gotten crazy.

I like McWhorter too. I think the guy you're referring to is "MrBeast" on youtube. He is extremely rich from his youtube fame. Apparently, he funded the building of 100 water wells in Africa. I haven't done a deep dive into the story, but he has gotten a lot of flak from those on the far left who think he's a "white savior". I think also some of it is the usual, "I hate anybody rich" attitude that seems to be so trendy these days. Oddly enough, the people who are using the wells and blacks in this country are supportive and grateful for him and appalled at the attitude of those who have critisized what he did. Here is the link:

I built 100 wells

Thanks. That is probably the same guy I heard about. As you've said, It wasn't those who received the help who complained and I doubt they perceived the wealthy white guy as their white savior. They simply appreciated that now they have clean water. I think the same guy was criticized for helping Black children who had visual issues get help too. Is it better to let those children be unable to read due to visual problems? It's nobody's business if someone is happy to receive help from someone who is wealthy just happens to have a different skin color. Without this guy's help, the poor Africans wouldn't have clean water and the kids with visual problems would never be able to be good readers. That's all that should matter.

And, while the party in Boston isn't a big thing, wouldn't it be better to have their white peers join in a holiday celebration, instead of acting as if the minorities are too fragile to be around their white peers? This is the type of thing that McWhother points out in his editorials. He feels that doing things like this implies that Black folks are too fragile to stand up for themselves when necessary. As a Black person himself, he certainly understands racism. I enjoy reading his opinion pieces because he's good at pointing out the hypocrisy of those who might mean well, but end up doing more harm than good. But yeah. The party was an insignificant thing. I just reread the little article and it said that there had been some infighting in the council based on race. So, imo, it would have been a good change to include everyone and try to get along and stop using race as an issue by those on either side of the "color chart". We're all humans and diversity should be celebrated, not used as an excuse to separate people. Sadly, we're a long way from reaching that point.

 

[TV and credit cards]

Without details of why this might be a problem, sounds a lot like people complaining about 'Black History Month', saying why isn't there a white history month, ignoring that pretty much all of history taught in the country centers around white people. Or maybe like a meme that I can't find now where group A is large and excludes group B, so group B creates a space for themselves, and group A complains that they are not included and forces their way into the new space.

You're comparing a annual observance of Black culture and achievement to that of a holiday party, a time of family, friends, and togetherness (likely drunkenness and embarrassment)?

 

[Harry Bosch]

Without details of why this might be a problem, sounds a lot like people complaining about 'Black History Month', saying why isn't there a white history month, ignoring that pretty much all of history taught in the country centers around white people. Or maybe like a meme that I can't find now where group A is large and excludes group B, so group B creates a space for themselves, and group A complains that they are not included and forces their way into the new space.

It just seems so silly and unbecoming. Again, can I attend if I'm lighter skinned? Is it verbotten for me to bring my white wife? Can I bring my children who are Asian? Having cultural events is fun and can be inclusionary. We attend a yearly powwow that is a blast. And everyone is invited. Probably at least 40% are white people.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

A lot of people make fun of Quanza and other "non-white" holidays of the season. So, I wonder if the original reason was to create a safe space. In any case, it comes across as unnecessary and can only create drama for white people and thoughts of white victimhood once they hear about it. This then creates problems outside the space generated by the party. So it sounds like a very counter-productive idea.

 

[Harry Bosch]

A lot of people make fun of Quanza and other "non-white" holidays of the season. So, I wonder if the original reason was to create a safe space. In any case, it comes across as unnecessary and can only create drama for white people and thoughts of white victimhood once they hear about it. This then creates problems outside the space generated by the party. So it sounds like a very counter-productive idea.

Having cultural events are fun. They also connect people and educate children. We go to two powwows a year and attend. We celebrate Chinese New Year and attend Asian camps and get togethers. Took my wife to the Dayonna 500 two years ago to celebrate white people culture (inside joke!). But I wouldn't go to any of these events if they all of a sudden decided to reject anyone who isn't the right "color".

 

[thebeave]

^^ good post. Although, I'm white and have never been to the Daytona 500 or had much interest in it. I feel like I'm letting my people down.

 

[TomC]

The article came up in my news feed, like a lot of news articles about happenings in other states. You seem to jump into threads fairly frequently and then write to complain about how the subject matter doesn't interest you.

And you found it worth starting a thread about.

My point this. A Bostonian holiday party is a complete nothingburger to me. A Left Coast conservative brought it up. To me the OP smells like hypocritical whataboutism nonsense. Rather like people who complain, "We straight white Christian males are the only people it's okay to discriminate against!"
That's the part of this topic I find worth discussing.
Tom

 

[Politesse]

Education guidelines in places like California and Seattle do include things like "ethnic studies" in math education

Translation: a non-binding sample curriculum suggested some ways math education might incorporate ethnic studies into the existing (and rigorous) standard for math outcomes in secondary education.

 

[Politesse]

For what it's worth, if the description of this event is accurate, I think it is inappropriate and unwise. I do not agree that it is indicative of some national trend as suggested, nor do I see it as some sort of existential threat even for Bostonians. Just, you know, inappropriate. The semi-official status of the event makes it worse, and they should have known better.

 

[ZiprHead]

I told my closest Black friend, who hates the term, "people of color" that I'm not white, I'm beige with speckles. She refers to herself as Black and hates any other term to describe herself. I'm quite sure that she wouldn't like any party that excludes anyone based on the color of their skin, so even though I don't know the details of why this party is exclusionary, I don't think it helps race relationships to do this.

I know some of you don't like the intellectual, linguist John McWhorter, who is Black and ofter writes interesting articles about race and racism. I read one recently where he explained that he thinks, a lot of folks are infantilizing black people by over reacting to little things, especially historical terms that had different meanings in the past etc. He feels that many times, Black people are being made to feel like victims, when they aren't at all victims. He worries that this type of treatment will prevent children from being able to handle real problems, when they reach adulthood. Sure, some are victims of extreme racism, like the two lovely women who sued Rudy and won. To treat someone differently due to the color of their skin is wrong, but that includes hatred of anyone based on their ethnicity or skin color.

I read recently how a very wealthy white guy has been giving a lot of money to help Black children etc. and he's been criticized as trying to be a "white savior". I think this has gotten a bit crazy. The man has given to other causes to help the poor and I doubt he even thinks about the skin color of those who he helps. He's just trying to share a lot of his wealth, which I think he made through successful investing. It's gotten crazy.

I like McWhorter too. I think the guy you're referring to is "MrBeast" on youtube. He is extremely rich from his youtube fame. Apparently, he funded the building of 100 water wells in Africa. I haven't done a deep dive into the story, but he has gotten a lot of flak from those on the far left who think he's a "white savior". I think also some of it is the usual, "I hate anybody rich" attitude that seems to be so trendy these days. Oddly enough, the people who are using the wells and blacks in this country are supportive and grateful for him and appalled at the attitude of those who have critisized what he did. Here is the link:

I built 100 wells

Thanks. That is probably the same guy I heard about. As you've said, It wasn't those who received the help who complained and I doubt they perceived the wealthy white guy as their white savior. They simply appreciated that now they have clean water. I think the same guy was criticized for helping Black children who had visual issues get help too. Is it better to let those children be unable to read due to visual problems? It's nobody's business if someone is happy to receive help from someone who is wealthy just happens to have a different skin color. Without this guy's help, the poor Africans wouldn't have clean water and the kids with visual problems would never be able to be good readers. That's all that should matter.

And, while the party in Boston isn't a big thing, wouldn't it be better to have their white peers join in a holiday celebration, instead of acting as if the minorities are too fragile to be around their white peers? This is the type of thing that McWhother points out in his editorials. He feels that doing things like this implies that Black folks are too fragile to stand up for themselves when necessary. As a Black person himself, he certainly understands racism. I enjoy reading his opinion pieces because he's good at pointing out the hypocrisy of those who might mean well, but end up doing more harm than good. But yeah. The party was an insignificant thing. I just reread the little article and it said that there had been some infighting in the council based on race. So, imo, it would have been a good change to include everyone and try to get along and stop using race as an issue by those on either side of the "color chart". We're all humans and diversity should be celebrated, not used as an excuse to separate people. Sadly, we're a long way from reaching that point.

Bill Maher speaks about Mr. Beast.

 

[southernhybrid]

I probably heard about Mr. Beast on Bill Maher, who despite not personally liking these days, I still enjoy watching his show and listening to some of the diverse viewpoints which don't always agree with my own. I think it's important to listen and read the opinions of those who see things from a different perspective.

Anyway..I wanted to add the recent article that was written by John McWhorter that I had been thinking about in an earlier post. I take his views seriously because I think he understands what it's like being Black more than the white people who sometimes criticize his viewpoints. So, I'll give the article for anyone interested in reading his viewpoint.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/13/...e_code=1.G00._V0g.5qB7Cp0tmP9q&smid=url-share

In the congressional hearing, the presidents made clear that Jewish students should be protected when hate speech is “directed and severe, pervasive” (in the words of Ms. Magill) or when the speech “becomes conduct” (Claudine Gay of Harvard).
But the tacit idea is that when it comes to issues related to race — and, specifically, Black students — then free speech considerations become an abstraction. Where Black students are concerned, we are to forget whether the offense is directed, as even the indirect is treated as evil; we are to forget the difference between speech and conduct, as mere utterance is grounds for aggrieved condemnation.
It seems to me that, in debates over free speech, Jews are seen in some quarters as white and therefore need no protection from outright hostility. But racism is America’s original sin, and thus we are to treat all and any intimation of it on university campuses as a kind of kryptonite, even if that means treating Black students as pathological cases rather than human beings with basic resilience who understand proportion and degree.

This is certainly a double standard imposed on Jewish students, as my colleagues Bret Stephens and David French, among others, have argued. However, we must also consider the imposition of this double standard upon young Black people. To assume they can’t handle anything unpleasant infantilizes bright, serious students preparing for life in the real world.
Both expectations are offenses to human dignity, and universities must seek a middle ground. The answer is neither the crudeness of allowing all speech to pass as “free” nor the clamping down on any utterance that rubs a student the wrong way.

Sometimes Black students must be protected not only from words, but words that sound like other words. In 2020, Greg Patton was suspended from teaching a class in communications at the University of Southern California. The reason was that one of his lectures included noting that in Mandarin, a hesitation term is “nèi ge,” which means “that …” and has nothing to do, of course, with the N-word. Several Black students said they felt injured by experiencing this word in the class.​

I have no idea why the above showed up in large print.


There's some more interesting points that he makes to back up his opinion. I personally think it's good to be strong enough to deal with insults. In fact, as a female who has had to deal with and learned to stand up to obnoxious, arrogant male doctors when I was working, as well as plenty of sexist speech from others, I wish that all young people, regardless of race or gender etc, would learn to stand up for themselves and not allow others to impact their self esteem. I think that's at least part of what the opinion piece is promoting.

 

[Derec]

Without details of why this might be a problem, sounds a lot like people complaining about 'Black History Month', saying why isn't there a white history month, ignoring that pretty much all of history taught in the country centers around white people.

Maybe it did 100 years ago, but not today. BHM may have had some utility when it first appeared, and even then it was just a band aid, but these days it's just an exercise in segregating history. Same goes for so-called HBCUs. Necessary when they were founded, but these days they just feed racial separation.

Or maybe like a meme that I can't find now where group A is large and excludes group B, so group B creates a space for themselves, and group A complains that they are not included and forces their way into the new space.

What even are you babbling about? Non-white elected officials are not excluded anywhere in Boston. There is no justification for excluding white people.

 

[Derec]

A lot of people make fun of Quanza and other "non-white" holidays of the season.

Quanza is not being ridiculed for being "non-white". It is ridiculed for being a synthetic holiday made up as part of black radicalism of the 60s/70s. The inventor was a black separatist named Ronald McKinley Everett (alias Maulana Karenga) who spent time in prison for false imprisonment and torture.
Also, wtf, holidays like Christmas are not "white holidays". They are celebrated all over the world.

So, I wonder if the original reason was to create a safe space.

You can come up with any excuse you wish, it is still segregation and racial discrimination.

So it sounds like a very counter-productive idea.

We agree there. The whole racial politics of the last 50 years is very counterproductive. From "minority only" holiday parties to the very idea of identity politics, racial reparations or discriminating by race in admissions and hiring under the guise of "affirmative action". US took the wrong turn at Albuquerque in the 70s and we will not find the right way until we stop electing people like Wu who are stuck in that mindset.

 

[Derec]

^^ good post. Although, I'm white and have never been to the Daytona 500 or had much interest in it. I feel like I'm letting my people down.

I never went to a Nascar race, but I did go to 24 Hours of Daytona once. We camped in the infield. It was fun.