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Democrats 2020

Anyone notice that Biden has risen a lot in the SC polls since Clyburn endorsed him yesterday? I don't think that Biden is any less intelligent
mentally deficient than Bernie. They are both obviously past their prime imo. Biden gave an excellent interview yesterday, that apparently inspired his black supporters, because as of today, the last poll I read had Bernie at 1 percent among black voters in SC. Of course, all of these polls are all over the place so I don't place too much value on them, but it looks as if this race has a way to go before we crown King Bernie.

If any of the Democrats beat Trump, I have no doubt that they will appoint competent advisors and cabinet members, unlike Trump. So, while I would prefer a younger candidate, I'll take an older one who works well with others. If the primary race isn't settled by the time I vote in late March, I will vote for the person who I believe has the best chance of beating Trump. So far, I don't see Bernie as being that person. He might be able to do it, but, I have my doubts.

I don't care how you define me, I am a life long progressive, but I'm no longer what was once considered a radical. I'm a realist. I just want the horrid, incompetent man out of the WH.

But, here's a question for the Bernie supporters. Who do you think would be a good match with Bernie as the VP candidate? And, why do you think that person will help achieve a Sanders victory? I would think it should be someone middle aged, but more towards the center. This might be a way to attract voters who aren't as far to the left as Sanders. Bernie has got to move toward the middle if he wants to unite people and bring in more voters. So far, his promise of a huge voter turnout hasn't materialized according to the statistics I've read. How does he change that?

Pence probably helped Trump motivate the evangelicals to vote for him. Pence is an incompetent idiot imo, but he's a dedicated Trump sycophant. Democrats usually don't like sycophants very much, so I think whoever becomes the nominee needs to choose someone who has some differences with the candidate but is willing to work together with the candidate.
 
southernhybrid said:
But, here's a question for the Bernie supporters. Who do you think would be a good match with Bernie as the VP candidate? And, why do you think that person will help achieve a Sanders victory? I would think it should be someone middle aged, but more towards the center. This might be a way to attract voters who aren't as far to the left as Sanders. Bernie has got to move toward the middle if he wants to unite people and bring in more voters. So far, his promise of a huge voter turnout hasn't materialized according to the statistics I've read. How does he change that?
Click to expand...

Bernie has made it this far by being uncompromising in his ideological agenda. But he is pretty old, so all that his base of supporters want from a VP is someone with the same positions as him, who is willing to fight for them with the same zeal, but much younger. We do not want to dilute his ticket. We don't need that to win. My preference would be Nina Turner.
 
PyramidHead said:
southernhybrid said:
But, here's a question for the Bernie supporters. Who do you think would be a good match with Bernie as the VP candidate? And, why do you think that person will help achieve a Sanders victory? I would think it should be someone middle aged, but more towards the center. This might be a way to attract voters who aren't as far to the left as Sanders. Bernie has got to move toward the middle if he wants to unite people and bring in more voters. So far, his promise of a huge voter turnout hasn't materialized according to the statistics I've read. How does he change that?
Click to expand...

Bernie has made it this far by being uncompromising in his ideological agenda. But he is pretty old, so all that his base of supporters want from a VP is someone with the same positions as him, who is willing to fight for them with the same zeal, but much younger. We do not want to dilute his ticket. We don't need that to win.
Click to expand...
Mr. Sanders' base is insufficient for him to win. If Mr. Sanders gets the nomination and his VP pick is a clone of Mr. Sanders, that will turn off some potential voters. I would seriously consider not voting for him in that case.
 
southernhybrid said:
Anyone notice that Biden has risen a lot in the SC polls since Clyburn endorsed him yesterday? I don't think that Biden is any less intelligent
mentally deficient than Bernie. They are both obviously past their prime imo. Biden gave an excellent interview yesterday, that apparently inspired his black supporters, because as of today, the last poll I read had Bernie at 1 percent among black voters in SC. Of course, all of these polls are all over the place so I don't place too much value on them, but it looks as if this race has a way to go before we crown King Bernie.
Click to expand...

Biden's rise started several days before the debate. I think undecideds were breaking for him. The Clyburn endorsement obviously helped. I'm paying equal attention to polling in CA and TX, the largest Super Tuesday states. There's been nothing in the past few days, but Sanders is currently significantly ahead in CA and slightly ahead in TX and is competitive almost everywhere else.

If any of the Democrats beat Trump, I have no doubt that they will appoint competent advisors and cabinet members, unlike Trump. So, while I would prefer a younger candidate, I'll take an older one who works well with others. If the primary race isn't settled by the time I vote in late March, I will vote for the person who I believe has the best chance of beating Trump. So far, I don't see Bernie as being that person. He might be able to do it, but, I have my doubts.
Click to expand...

Recent national polling shows Sanders performing better against Trump than the rest of the Democrat field. The spread isn't huge, but I don't recall any national polling (which I think is mostly useless to deconstruct right now) showing Sanders among the weaker performers. Putative electability is a chimera - impossible to intelligently address. Too many variables, both controllable and random. Primary voters shouldn't be playing 3D chess. They should vote for whomever aligns with their views.

I don't care how you define me, I am a life long progressive, but I'm no longer what was once considered a radical. I'm a realist. I just want the horrid, incompetent man out of the WH.
Click to expand...

I think people react too much to Trump based on optics, and that the economic and societal trends I'd wish to reverse have been heading in the wrong direction for decades. Trump was the consequence of those trends not being addressed prior to 2016. I happen to believe he's making them worse, but people are too quick to dismiss the factors that created Trump.

But, here's a question for the Bernie supporters. Who do you think would be a good match with Bernie as the VP candidate? And, why do you think that person will help achieve a Sanders victory? I would think it should be someone middle aged, but more towards the center. This might be a way to attract voters who aren't as far to the left as Sanders. Bernie has got to move toward the middle if he wants to unite people and bring in more voters. So far, his promise of a huge voter turnout hasn't materialized according to the statistics I've read. How does he change that?
Click to expand...

In 2016, Clinton didn't reach out to progressives, she picked Tim Kaine, another moderate/centrist.

Agree someone younger, someone female, beyond that not sure. Sanders gets painted into a Left/Far Left corner, but in reality his platform is pretty centrist judged by international standards. My personal choice would be Warren, as hedge against Sander's age and someone committed to his platform, strong on details, and who would energize the progressive base and I would be comfortable with as President down the road (or even fairly immediately considering his age). This voter turnout caveat appears to be real, judging from the NYT article I read recently. But we've had 2 caucus states and it's not so easy to commit to showing up for several hours. I think also there's some extreme political fatigue and perhaps resignation out there - we've just seen Trump get exonerated by a process that was corrupted in his favor by the Senate. Let's judge excitement/turnout after Super Tuesday.

Pence probably helped Trump motivate the evangelicals to vote for him. Pence is an incompetent idiot imo, but he's a dedicated Trump sycophant. Democrats usually don't like sycophants very much, so I think whoever becomes the nominee needs to choose someone who has some differences with the candidate but is willing to work together with the candidate.
Click to expand...

I personally think Sanders would have an almost impossibly hard road to election victory no matter who he were to chose as running mate. But these are good questions. Another is how would Sanders attempt to implement his agenda given a hostile Congress and massive lobbying effort from corporations? I've thought about this a lot during the Obama years, because his attempt at real healthcare reform was thwarted by elements in his own party (Lieberman and Bayh) who had family ties to the industry. Obama jettisoned his base when in office and played the inside game, but his victories were scant, hard-won, and are being eroded and wiped out by Trump. Sanders has hinted at a different approach and the need to keep his base engaged in the fight beyond inauguration, but I'm not sure what form that approach would take.
 
laughing dog said:
PyramidHead said:
southernhybrid said:
But, here's a question for the Bernie supporters. Who do you think would be a good match with Bernie as the VP candidate? And, why do you think that person will help achieve a Sanders victory? I would think it should be someone middle aged, but more towards the center. This might be a way to attract voters who aren't as far to the left as Sanders. Bernie has got to move toward the middle if he wants to unite people and bring in more voters. So far, his promise of a huge voter turnout hasn't materialized according to the statistics I've read. How does he change that?
Click to expand...

Bernie has made it this far by being uncompromising in his ideological agenda. But he is pretty old, so all that his base of supporters want from a VP is someone with the same positions as him, who is willing to fight for them with the same zeal, but much younger. We do not want to dilute his ticket. We don't need that to win.
Click to expand...
Mr. Sanders' base is insufficient for him to win. If Mr. Sanders gets the nomination and his VP pick is a clone of Mr. Sanders, that will turn off some potential voters. I would seriously consider not voting for him in that case.
Click to expand...
That's what all the people who voted for the Iraq war, predicted a Hillary landslide, and think the United States revolves around their priorities wants us to believe. So far, they have been wrong about all those things, and wrong about how well Bernie would be doing in this race, so I'm gonna hazard that they are also wrong about who he should pick for VP. We are not going to lose any sleep over alienating people who don't support Sanders or his policy goals.
 
laughing dog said:
PyramidHead said:
southernhybrid said:
But, here's a question for the Bernie supporters. Who do you think would be a good match with Bernie as the VP candidate? And, why do you think that person will help achieve a Sanders victory? I would think it should be someone middle aged, but more towards the center. This might be a way to attract voters who aren't as far to the left as Sanders. Bernie has got to move toward the middle if he wants to unite people and bring in more voters. So far, his promise of a huge voter turnout hasn't materialized according to the statistics I've read. How does he change that?
Click to expand...

Bernie has made it this far by being uncompromising in his ideological agenda. But he is pretty old, so all that his base of supporters want from a VP is someone with the same positions as him, who is willing to fight for them with the same zeal, but much younger. We do not want to dilute his ticket. We don't need that to win.
Click to expand...
Mr. Sanders' base is insufficient for him to win. If Mr. Sanders gets the nomination and his VP pick is a clone of Mr. Sanders, that will turn off some potential voters. I would seriously consider not voting for him in that case.
Click to expand...

Everyone's base is insufficient right now. Sanders base is just marginally less insufficient, while he remains the frontrunner.

The fact that Sanders is running against the Democrat establishment right now paints him in a corner. It's an interesting question of how he would seek to widen his appeal were he to win, and the MSM would certainly hammer that topic, but I'm not seeing many easy options open to him. I don't see him courting rich donors, or pivoting away from UHC or toning down other elements of his platform. It's a little easier for his opponents to reach out because they've walked a line he hasn't. I think it would actually be up to moderates to move towards him, and some would and others wouldn't. And some who say they wouldn't now, would later.
 
Real Clear Politics has Sanders ahead in the primaries by 11.2%
Against Trump, Sanders leads by 4.4%

We have 7 months to election day, so there is a lot of time for Trump to screw up more, and lose. His mental acuity seems to be slipping. trump either has to go full bore on his attacks on Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, ACA, CHPS or walk all of his cuts to those programs back.

To be sure, I would like to see Sanders leading Trump by 10%, but I suspect Sanders can indeed win in the end.

In Texas, Trump leads Sanders by 4.5%.
In Florida, Sanders leads by 0.3%, a tie.

But we can expect adjustments after the primaries. Florida's primaries are on March 17.
 
I think his VP should be a feisty older black woman who knows how to kick ass and take names on Capitol Hill. Like, a Bernie type but with minority bonus points to soothe the nerves of liberals. Is Gwen Moore available?
 
Jason Harvestdancer said:
Analysts have said that the best chance for the Democrats is an economic downturn before the election. Looks like the Democrat might win because of the flu.
Click to expand...

Not flu. Coronavirus and Influenza virus are not closely related.
But you may be right. If this triggers a wider recession that is still going on in November, Trump is likely toast. Economy is pretty much all he has been running so far.
 
Jason Harvestdancer said:
Analysts have said that the best chance for the Democrats is an economic downturn before the election. Looks like the Democrat might win because of the flu.
Click to expand...

This virus is bad for Trump, no doubt. It will spare all the younger voters, Sanders base, and convince everyone else of the urgent need to give everyone access to healthcare without fearing crippling bills. Plus the dumbass has already told everyone it’s No Big Deal and appointed a Praying Czar to make it go away, after firing or cutting the budget of every agency or team we need to manage the crisis.
 
Jason Harvestdancer said:
Analysts have said that the best chance for the Democrats is an economic downturn before the election. Looks like the Democrat might win because of the flu.
Click to expand...

Our president has already informed the American public, the market downturn is not just due to the virus but the host of liberals and socialists the Democrats are putting forward as possible nominees. So, as usual, Trump is out in front of this thing. Further, since it would appear that small children are much more resistant to the Covid-19 virus, Trump has proposed that only small children be allowed to vote in the upcoming election.
 
A vaccine is only a matter of a few months away, as Israeli scientists say one should be ready for testing within weeks.

Agree, that this virus has the potential to undo all the good work done to bring, no, drag the US economy to it's present state from The Appeaser In Chief's wasted two terms.

But I'm still of the opinion, no matter what, Americans will not put a commo in the WH.
 
TV and credit cards said:
Jason Harvestdancer said:
Analysts have said that the best chance for the Democrats is an economic downturn before the election. Looks like the Democrat might win because of the flu.
Click to expand...

Our president has already informed the American public, the market downturn is not just due to the virus but the host of liberals and socialists the Democrats are putting forward as possible nominees. So, as usual, Trump is out in front of this thing. Further, since it would appear that small children are much more resistant to the Covid-19 virus, Trump has proposed that only small children be allowed to vote in the upcoming election.
Click to expand...

After a high level cabinet meeting, the president walked back his suggestion that “only small children should be allowed to vote in the upcoming election”. It has been pointed out by Special Advisor to the President, Kellyanne Conway that Bernie rhymes with Ernie and children like that, while Trump sounds like a fart.
Kellyanne Conway has been subsequently fired. In a statement, the president said: “She gave bad advice, very bad. Usually the worst advice. And she’s not “special”. There’s nothing special about her. I’m special, not her.”
 
Derec said:
Jason Harvestdancer said:
Analysts have said that the best chance for the Democrats is an economic downturn before the election. Looks like the Democrat might win because of the flu.
Click to expand...
Not flu. Coronavirus and Influenza virus are not closely related.
But you may be right. If this triggers a wider recession that is still going on in November, Trump is likely toast. Economy is pretty much all he has been running so far.
Click to expand...
Or even worse, if his administration continues to mismanage its response to the virus outbreak.

Candidates lay out their mottos and the biggest misconceptions about them
  • Joe Biden said his motto is, "When you get knocked down, get up, and everyone is entitled to be treated with dignity no matter what or who they are." He went on to say that he's committed to putting a black woman on the Supreme Court. On the biggest misconception, Biden said, "I have more hair than I think I do."
  • Michael Bloomberg joked that a misconception about him is that he's "6 feet tall." On his motto, the former New York Mayor was direct, "I've trained for this job for a long time and when I get it I'm going to do something, rather than just talk about it."
  • Pete Buttigieg said people think "I'm not passionate." The former South Bend, Indiana, mayor went on to say that he seeks to "live by the teachings that say if you would be a leader, you must first be a servant."
  • Bernie Sanders said the biggest misconception about him is that his ideas are "radical." He went on to cite a quote from Nelson Mandela as a motto he lives by, saying, "Everything is impossible until it happens."
  • Elizabeth Warren said one misconception about her "is that I don't eat very much." She added, "In fact, I eat all the time." On her motto, Warren quoted Bible Scripture: "In as much as ye have done it unto one of the least of my brethren, ye have done it unto me."
  • Amy Klobuchar said the biggest misconception about her is that "I'm boring because I'm not." She added that her motto is "that politics is about improving people's lives."
  • Tom Steyer said one misconception about him is that "somehow I'm defined by business success and money." On his personal motto, he said, "Every day, I write a cross on my hand to remind myself to tell the truth and do what's right, no matter what."
Click to expand...
PB likely paraphrases Matt 20:26 and Mark 10:43 - It must not be this way among you! Instead whoever wants to be great among you must be your servant (NET)

EW quoted Matt 25:40 - And the king will answer them, ‘I tell you the truth, just as you did it for one of the least of these brothers or sisters[c] of mine, you did it for me.’ (NET) But she used the King James Version: And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
 
 
lpetrich said:
Elizabeth Warren on Twitter: "My motto ties in directly to Matthew 25: Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
It’s about how we treat other people and lift them up. That is why I am in this fight. #DemDebate" / Twitter

I doubt that she'll ever be tweeting 1 Timothy 2:12 anytime soon - But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man. She must remain quiet

Gospel of Matthew's message rings loudly for some 2020 Dems

Quasi-secular-humanist do-gooderism.

Most Americans don't see 2020 Democratic candidates as very religious | Pew Research Center

As if it would be much better if they said "I'm just following God's orders."
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I suspect that most Americans take "religious" to mean "radically conservative". Friendly people don't tend to be described as "religious" even if they are monks; it connotes something more aggressive in popular speech than just having religion. People often describe themselves to me as "not very religious", when upon further questioning they prove to have plenty of religious beliefs, what they mean is that they don't go to church very often or try to coerce their neighbors into going with them.
 
angelo said:
A vaccine is only a matter of a few months away, as Israeli scientists say one should be ready for testing within weeks.
Click to expand...

From the presser, the testing phase sounds like 3-4 months at least. We are likely talking September before they have a vaccine ready to roll out.

Agree, that this virus has the potential to undo all the good work done to bring, no, drag the US economy to it's present state from The Appeaser In Chief's wasted two terms.
Click to expand...

Can you point to any economic indices (unemployment, wage rises] that moved dramatically in the right direction in the aftermath of Trump taking office in 2017? All the evidence I've seen is for a continuation of trends established during Obama's 2nd term, and that's at best. The unemployment rate has actually slowed slightly.

But I'm still of the opinion, no matter what, Americans will not put a commo in the WH.
Click to expand...

Well fortunately, Sanders isn't a commo, he's a demo socialo in the euro stylo.

But to each their own. I never thought Americans would elect a white supremo fraudo and serial adultero with a string of bankros to his namo, who ran as a populo but cut taxes for the oligarcho.
 
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