Democrats 2020

[Harry Bosch]

Why do you think that the democratic establishment is against Bernie? Either way, the person who wins the democratic primary will be the one who earns the most votes. There's no conspiracy against Bernie!

Not votes, delegates.

But the delegates align with the votes. HRC got more votes, hence she got more delegates than Bernie in 2016 in almost an exact same ratio. There is no conspiracy...

 

[PyramidHead]

Why do you think that the democratic establishment is against Bernie? Either way, the person who wins the democratic primary will be the one who earns the most votes. There's no conspiracy against Bernie!

Not votes, delegates.

But the delegates align with the votes. HRC got more votes, hence she got more delegates than Bernie in 2016 in almost an exact same ratio. There is no conspiracy...

I didn't say anything about 2016 or HRC, I just corrected you about the winner being the one with the most votes, since that's not the system used to select a nominee. Delegates can select whoever they wish, and publicly pledge to select whoever they wish before the primaries are even over, which could clearly influence voting behavior. There are also many other mechanisms that a party can use to drown out someone who isn't in the pockets of their biggest donors, of which the bundled donations upon Beto's announcement are just one example. I'm not saying there's anything illegal going on, just that it's pretty clear who the Democratic establishment represents and who Bernie represents, and those groups have very little overlap.

 

[PyramidHead]

Finally some good news:



I love the idea of a person literally saying to everyone "don't vote for me, but get me on the same stage as the other candidates so I can point out how terrible and irredeemable most of them are and make the decent, redeemable ones even better." He also already has better positions than every other contender right now

 

[lpetrich]

So he has become a Democrat again. He was a Democrat for a long time but became a Libertarian in 2008 and tried to get the Libertarian Party's nomination for Presidential candidate that year. He failed, and he is now returning to politics.

BTW, his last name is accented on the second syllable, not on the first one, as one might expect.

 

[PyramidHead]

So he has become a Democrat again. He was a Democrat for a long time but became a Libertarian in 2008 and tried to get the Libertarian Party's nomination for Presidential candidate that year. He failed, and he is now returning to politics.

BTW, his last name is accented on the second syllable, not on the first one, as one might expect.

He's only running as a Dem to get on the same stage as the Dems, which is honestly fine by me if that's what the rules are. He is literally the only one to make the connection about pre-Trump liberal centrism being an important enabling condition of Trump himself, and the only one who seems to remember that the current lineup of progressives were yesterday's homophobes, warmongers, authoritarians, and literal Republicans

 

[Terrell]

So he has become a Democrat again. He was a Democrat for a long time but became a Libertarian in 2008 and tried to get the Libertarian Party's nomination for Presidential candidate that year. He failed, and he is now returning to politics.

BTW, his last name is accented on the second syllable, not on the first one, as one might expect.

He's only running as a Dem to get on the same stage as the Dems, which is honestly fine by me if that's what the rules are. He is literally the only one to make the connection about pre-Trump liberal centrism being an important enabling condition of Trump himself, and the only one who seems to remember that the current lineup of progressives were yesterday's homophobes, warmongers, authoritarians, and literal Republicans

I'm okay with that, as long as he doesn't run 3rd party if he loses the nomination. Not expecting it doesn't necessarily mean you won't get it. Also Tulsi Gabbard (D-HI) is also openly against regime change wars. I could see a potential split of votes between him & her.

 

[lpetrich]

Beto's Announcement Shows Triumph of Secular Democrats - The Atlantic - "Instead of invoking God, O’Rourke and most other Democratic contenders identify religion as a source of division."

"Until recently, farewells that invoke God were standard fare for Democratic and Republican candidates alike." Bill Clinton in 1992 and 1996, Al Gore in 1999, John Kerry in 2003, Barack Obama in 2004, Hillary Clinton in 2015. In his Presidential-campaign announcement speech of 2007, BO didn't end it with God, he began it with "Giving all praise and honor to God for bringing us here today."

O’Rourke exemplifies a new normal. None of the other major white progressive candidates—Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, or Kirsten Gillibrand—invoked God in their presidential announcements either. (Amy Klobuchar, who is running as a comparative moderate, did.)

Previous Democrats had viewed religion as unifying. Bill Clinton in 1992: “There is no them; there’s only us. One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”, Barack Obama in 2004: We worship an awesome God in the blue states.” More recently, however, they view it as a source of division. BOR: “people allowed no difference, however great or however small, to stand between them and divide us. Whether it was religion or gender or geography or income, we put our labels and our differences aside.”, EW: “we come from different backgrounds. Different religions.”, BS: “ending religious bigotry.”

It’s not hard to understand why. For starters, the percentage of white Democrats who express no religious affiliation has skyrocketed. According to unpublished data tabulated for me last year by the Public Religion Research Institute (PRRI), 8 percent of white Democrats expressed no religious affiliation in 1990. By 2016, the figure was 33 percent. In 1990, white self-described liberals were 39 points more likely to describe themselves as Protestant than as religiously unaffiliated. By 2016, religiously unaffiliated beat Protestant by nine points.

Also, Republicans used to be more ecumenical about religion, like including a prayer by a Muslim leader back in 2000. But that has obviously changed, with the pResident's demonizing of Muslims and other Republicans seemingly unwilling to object to that.

According to a 2016 Pew Research Center poll, while a small plurality of Democrats thinks politicians talk about religion too much, Republicans overwhelmingly think politicians talk about it too little.

... But the Democratic base isn’t overwhelmingly secular; it’s partly secular and partly religious. Republicans, by contrast, are overwhelmingly religious.

...
That’s partly because of African Americans. While many white Democrats want politicians to speak about religion less, black Democrats overwhelmingly want them to speak about it more.

...
All of which may help Kamala Harris and Cory Booker. It’s no coincidence that Harris ended her campaign-announcement speech with the words “God bless you, and God bless the United States of America,” and that Booker ended his speech at the 2016 Democratic convention by declaring, “God bless America.” In his campaign video, a bystander calls out, “2020!” To which Booker responds, “Amen!”

... In their appetite for public professions of faith, black Democrats and white Republicans are similar. It’s white liberals who stand out.

When I see this "God is an American" official piety, I think: are they running for President or are they running for High Priest?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There is something about Beto that screams Martin Trudeau.

So he has become a Democrat again. He was a Democrat for a long time but became a Libertarian in 2008 and tried to get the Libertarian Party's nomination for Presidential candidate that year. He failed, and he is now returning to politics.

BTW, his last name is accented on the second syllable, not on the first one, as one might expect.

He's only running as a Dem to get on the same stage as the Dems, which is honestly fine by me if that's what the rules are. He is literally the only one to make the connection about pre-Trump liberal centrism being an important enabling condition of Trump himself, and the only one who seems to remember that the current lineup of progressives were yesterday's homophobes, warmongers, authoritarians, and literal Republicans

I'm okay with that, as long as he doesn't run 3rd party if he loses the nomination. Not expecting it doesn't necessarily mean you won't get it. Also Tulsi Gabbard (D-HI) is also openly against regime change wars. I could see a potential split of votes between him & her.

Today on "What President Has Run on Regime Change", we discuss which Presidential nominees in the last 40 years, ran on a platform of "regime change" in other nations. Our first guest is President George W. Bush, who ran a campaign against "regime change". So, Mr. President, how'd that work?

George W. Bush: Well, to be fair, when you run the state of Texas, you don't have any desire to change the leaders of other nations. But once you become the President, and you have a juggernaut military at your disposal, it really becomes hard not to play god.

 

[lpetrich]

There is something about Beto that screams Martin Trudeau.

What do you mean?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There is something about Beto that screams Martin Trudeau.

What do you mean?

All charismatic but not much else. Beto was in the House for three terms. He's young. And he's charismatic. This doesn't qualify someone to be President. Giving nice speeches isn't the basis for being President.

That he is even being considered scares me. Trump has upset the system so badly, someone like Beto is considered an early front-runner, because people think "he can beat Trump", despite clearly not having enough experience for the actual position. Barack Obama should be about as low in experience one can be, when running for office. He benefited from being a Lawyer who specialized in Constitutional Law, so that helped deal with his lack of "Executive" experience.

And why in the heck did I say "Martin Trudeau" when I meant "Justin Trudeau"?!

 

[lpetrich]

So Beto O'Rourke and Justin Trudeau are political bimbos? Along with being the more usual sort of male bimbo?

 

[Harry Bosch]

So he has become a Democrat again. He was a Democrat for a long time but became a Libertarian in 2008 and tried to get the Libertarian Party's nomination for Presidential candidate that year. He failed, and he is now returning to politics.

BTW, his last name is accented on the second syllable, not on the first one, as one might expect.

He's only running as a Dem to get on the same stage as the Dems, which is honestly fine by me if that's what the rules are. He is literally the only one to make the connection about pre-Trump liberal centrism being an important enabling condition of Trump himself, and the only one who seems to remember that the current lineup of progressives were yesterday's homophobes, warmongers, authoritarians, and literal Republicans

What people were in the past doesn't bother me in the least. In fact, were you not earlier a capitalist pig like myself? I may be wrong but I think that you became a socialist in the last 6 months or so. In fact, I don't trust people who have never had the introspection to make major changes in their life.

 

[PyramidHead]

So he has become a Democrat again. He was a Democrat for a long time but became a Libertarian in 2008 and tried to get the Libertarian Party's nomination for Presidential candidate that year. He failed, and he is now returning to politics.

BTW, his last name is accented on the second syllable, not on the first one, as one might expect.

He's only running as a Dem to get on the same stage as the Dems, which is honestly fine by me if that's what the rules are. He is literally the only one to make the connection about pre-Trump liberal centrism being an important enabling condition of Trump himself, and the only one who seems to remember that the current lineup of progressives were yesterday's homophobes, warmongers, authoritarians, and literal Republicans

What people were in the past doesn't bother me in the least. In fact, were you not earlier a capitalist pig like myself? I may be wrong but I think that you became a socialist in the last 6 months or so. In fact, I don't trust people who have never had the introspection to make major changes in their life.

I'm not running for President though, and my radicalization didn't miraculously coincide with announcing my candidacy. For every big policy mistake the United States has made, there were people at the time who were forward-thinking enough to realize they were mistakes. I think we should cherish those people, and favor them over the ones who only changed their tune when the zeitgeist started to move. And I'm definitely not a member of the first category by any stretch, but I sure as he'll want a President who is.

 

[ZiprHead]

MSNBC is reporting that Biden is about to announce and that he may have already chosen Stacy Abrams as his running mate.

 

[southernhybrid]

MSNBC is reporting that Biden is about to announce and that he may have already chosen Stacy Abrams as his running mate.

I know but I don't want to get my hopes up until I find out if it's true. This rumor has been going around locally for the last two weeks. But, I have no idea if Stacey wants to run for VP. I'm on her email list but the only thing she's been working on lately is getting a movement started to make it easier for all citizens to vote.

 

[PyramidHead]

Stacey Abrams is alright.

But let's hold Biden's feet to the fire over his arguing against integrating school buses in the 1970's if he's going to go there. And his support for mass incarceration of black people in the 80's and 90's. And his continual references to black criminals as sociopathic predators. And his glowing fondness for his white supremacist friends. If he chooses Abrams, it will make me feel slightly better about the prospect of Biden winning and then immediately dying in office, but it will also put a huge spotlight on his awful record on issues of race.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Stacey Abrams is alright.

But let's hold Biden's feet to the fire over his arguing against integrating school buses in the 1970's if he's going to go there. And his support for mass incarceration of black people in the 80's and 90's. And his continual references to black criminals as sociopathic predators. And his glowing fondness for his white supremacist friends. If he chooses Abrams, it will make me feel slightly better about the prospect of Biden winning and then immediately dying in office, but it will also put a huge spotlight on his awful record on issues of race.

Not that I'm a huge Biden supporter. But I've become more skeptical over the years. Do you have some links regarding the above?

 

[Derec]

So Beto O'Rourke and Justin Trudeau are political bimbos? Along with being the more usual sort of male bimbo?

Mimbos if you will.

 

[Derec]

And his support for mass incarceration of black people in the 80's and 90's.

[Citation needed] that he supported incarcerating black people specifically.

And his continual references to black criminals as sociopathic predators.

[Citation needed] that he referred to black criminals specifically as "sociopathic predators" as opposed to (violent) criminals regardless or race. You are playing the same bullshit as with Hillary and superpredators.

And his glowing fondness for his white supremacist friends.

If he chooses Abrams, it will make me feel slightly better about the prospect of Biden winning and then immediately dying in office, but it will also put a huge spotlight on his awful record on issues of race.

Choosing a running mate at this junction is kind of insane. At least with the Cruz-Fiorina ticket it was done late in the process as a sort of Hail Mary pass because Trump was about to secure the nomination. Biden is attempting a Hail Mary in the first snap of the first quarter of the first game of the preseason. Really fucking weird strategy, like Biden himself. So I guess it fits.

 

[PyramidHead]

Stacey Abrams is alright.

But let's hold Biden's feet to the fire over his arguing against integrating school buses in the 1970's if he's going to go there. And his support for mass incarceration of black people in the 80's and 90's. And his continual references to black criminals as sociopathic predators. And his glowing fondness for his white supremacist friends. If he chooses Abrams, it will make me feel slightly better about the prospect of Biden winning and then immediately dying in office, but it will also put a huge spotlight on his awful record on issues of race.

Not that I'm a huge Biden supporter. But I've become more skeptical over the years. Do you have some links regarding the above?

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019...ustice-democratic-primary-2020-explained.html