Europe submits voluntarily

[Warpoet]

Ipse dixit

Lorenum Normalis

 

[DrZoidberg]

The Islamic fundamentalist world is not a fun world to inhabit. I think the allure of freedom, no-strings-sex and drunken debauchery is too strong for Islamic fundamentalism to survive in the long run.

I think that this is completely wrong. Intoxicated debauchery and no-strings sex are major selling points of Islamic fundamentalism. Alcohol is banned, but it's far from the only intoxicant in the world, and eschewing it is an excellent bonding mechanism to separate 'us' from 'them'.

A major barrier to sex for young men is that women are allowed to say 'piss off, loser', and even marrying one doesn't guarantee you sex on demand - but in fundamentalism it does (this is a big driver for Christian fundamentalists too).

And most importantly, people don't want or like freedom. Freedom is fucking terrifying, particularly to people who are not very bright. What they want is rules; a solid framework of simple instructions that will save them from the risk of having to make a decision, and of possibly getting it wrong.

Freedom is not for the faint-hearted; and that's most people. Freedom requires bravery and intelligence, and the rewards are small. Most people would rather be told what to do - they want a father figure who instructs and provides. A king, or a god, fits the bill perfectly.

Fundamentalists, like drug addicts, don't engage in destructive behaviour because they are stupid; they do it because it relieves them from the stress of having to function in a complex and uncaring society. Freedom is what they are trying to escape from.

I don't disagree with any of this. The problem arises when the not-so-bright in need of strict guidance rub up against the bright who want freedom. The bright will have their way. I mean... they're the bright.

In Medieval Europe this worked great because there was no mass or social media, film and photography. The nobles could behave in whatever way they wanted. The bright commoners could find work at court. There was no shortage of prostitutes. But in today's world with social media the nobility will get caught.

One example is the Swedish king. A couple of year ago a journalist decided to go... oh, fuck it... I'm going to print this. He just wrote what everybody in the know knew already. I guess, everybody knew. He fucked as many hot girls as humanly possible. He behaved like an utter swine. He's not really an adult. He never had to grow up, so didn't. To him life is just a long party. Once all this was out in the open it was impossible to keep the ultra-thin veneer of our king as a role model for anything. Let alone a leader.

This is going to happen increasingly in our world. The drug fuelled debauchery the elites are up to will increasingly leak out. Well... what's the point of being rich if you can't bang hot chicks? Or being a rich woman. I know several rich ladies who regularly get their dose of young athletic men.

The elites are not going to tolerate fundamentalism. And since they're in charge... that's what's going to happen. That's what I think.

Evidence: Trump is president of USA. Loads of fundy Christian voted for captain pussy-grabber. It is going to happen. It is happening in the Muslim world.

This is getting ranty. But last weekend I went to a wedding. It was a bunch of hedonistic business type people assembled. I talked to a representative of the Indonesian elite. She owned a hotel chain. Social media is leading to the "decadent lifestyles" of the wealthy to leak out to the poor peasant public. This is leading to the elite having to behave in the way they've all these years pretended they do. They've got all the money. They're starting to push back. They're going to win. But right now it's increasingly looking bad. But it's still all the people in power vs those who don't have any.

 

[repoman]

Hear, hear!

 

[whichphilosophy]

Ipse dixit

Lorenum Normalis

What does that mean Standard, regular what?

 

[whichphilosophy]

I think that this is completely wrong. Intoxicated debauchery and no-strings sex are major selling points of Islamic fundamentalism. Alcohol is banned, but it's far from the only intoxicant in the world, and eschewing it is an excellent bonding mechanism to separate 'us' from 'them'.

A major barrier to sex for young men is that women are allowed to say 'piss off, loser', and even marrying one doesn't guarantee you sex on demand - but in fundamentalism it does (this is a big driver for Christian fundamentalists too).

And most importantly, people don't want or like freedom. Freedom is fucking terrifying, particularly to people who are not very bright. What they want is rules; a solid framework of simple instructions that will save them from the risk of having to make a decision, and of possibly getting it wrong.

Freedom is not for the faint-hearted; and that's most people. Freedom requires bravery and intelligence, and the rewards are small. Most people would rather be told what to do - they want a father figure who instructs and provides. A king, or a god, fits the bill perfectly.

Fundamentalists, like drug addicts, don't engage in destructive behaviour because they are stupid; they do it because it relieves them from the stress of having to function in a complex and uncaring society. Freedom is what they are trying to escape from.

I don't disagree with any of this. The problem arises when the not-so-bright in need of strict guidance rub up against the bright who want freedom. The bright will have their way. I mean... they're the bright.

In Medieval Europe this worked great because there was no mass or social media, film and photography. The nobles could behave in whatever way they wanted. The bright commoners could find work at court. There was no shortage of prostitutes. But in today's world with social media the nobility will get caught.

One example is the Swedish king. A couple of year ago a journalist decided to go... oh, fuck it... I'm going to print this. He just wrote what everybody in the know knew already. I guess, everybody knew. He fucked as many hot girls as humanly possible. He behaved like an utter swine. He's not really an adult. He never had to grow up, so didn't. To him life is just a long party. Once all this was out in the open it was impossible to keep the ultra-thin veneer of our king as a role model for anything. Let alone a leader.

This is going to happen increasingly in our world. The drug fuelled debauchery the elites are up to will increasingly leak out. Well... what's the point of being rich if you can't bang hot chicks? Or being a rich woman. I know several rich ladies who regularly get their dose of young athletic men.

The elites are not going to tolerate fundamentalism. And since they're in charge... that's what's going to happen. That's what I think.

Evidence: Trump is president of USA. Loads of fundy Christian voted for captain pussy-grabber. It is going to happen. It is happening in the Muslim world.

This is getting ranty. But last weekend I went to a wedding. It was a bunch of hedonistic business type people assembled. I talked to a representative of the Indonesian elite. She owned a hotel chain. Social media is leading to the "decadent lifestyles" of the wealthy to leak out to the poor peasant public. This is leading to the elite having to behave in the way they've all these years pretended they do. They've got all the money. They're starting to push back. They're going to win. But right now it's increasingly looking bad. But it's still all the people in power vs those who don't have any.

It costs £3,000 per year to settle Middle Eastern refugees in the Middle East and £30,000 to settle them in the UK.

We are also at least 2 million houses short. in the UK and packing more people in every year. In fact someone earning less than £50,000 per year in London and with a family will find it difficult to even buy a house.

If the UK wants to house a net of 300,000 refugees each year, building 120,000 houses a year or sometimes a little more is not going to solve the problem when there are already many in the UK who are staying at friends, homeless in shelters or not even listed.

 

[DrZoidberg]

I don't disagree with any of this. The problem arises when the not-so-bright in need of strict guidance rub up against the bright who want freedom. The bright will have their way. I mean... they're the bright.

In Medieval Europe this worked great because there was no mass or social media, film and photography. The nobles could behave in whatever way they wanted. The bright commoners could find work at court. There was no shortage of prostitutes. But in today's world with social media the nobility will get caught.

One example is the Swedish king. A couple of year ago a journalist decided to go... oh, fuck it... I'm going to print this. He just wrote what everybody in the know knew already. I guess, everybody knew. He fucked as many hot girls as humanly possible. He behaved like an utter swine. He's not really an adult. He never had to grow up, so didn't. To him life is just a long party. Once all this was out in the open it was impossible to keep the ultra-thin veneer of our king as a role model for anything. Let alone a leader.

This is going to happen increasingly in our world. The drug fuelled debauchery the elites are up to will increasingly leak out. Well... what's the point of being rich if you can't bang hot chicks? Or being a rich woman. I know several rich ladies who regularly get their dose of young athletic men.

The elites are not going to tolerate fundamentalism. And since they're in charge... that's what's going to happen. That's what I think.

Evidence: Trump is president of USA. Loads of fundy Christian voted for captain pussy-grabber. It is going to happen. It is happening in the Muslim world.

This is getting ranty. But last weekend I went to a wedding. It was a bunch of hedonistic business type people assembled. I talked to a representative of the Indonesian elite. She owned a hotel chain. Social media is leading to the "decadent lifestyles" of the wealthy to leak out to the poor peasant public. This is leading to the elite having to behave in the way they've all these years pretended they do. They've got all the money. They're starting to push back. They're going to win. But right now it's increasingly looking bad. But it's still all the people in power vs those who don't have any.

It costs £3,000 per year to settle Middle Eastern refugees in the Middle East and £30,000 to settle them in the UK.

We are also at least 2 million houses short. in the UK and packing more people in every year. In fact someone earning less than £50,000 per year in London and with a family will find it difficult to even buy a house.

If the UK wants to house a net of 300,000 refugees each year, building 120,000 houses a year or sometimes a little more is not going to solve the problem when there are already many in the UK who are staying at friends, homeless in shelters or not even listed.

But housing a refugee in a camp is just a net loss for everybody. Taking a Syrian from Syria and plonking him in a European economy means that after peace comes around we're now speeding up the build up of Syria. As well a strengthening of that European economy. Sweden has benefited immensely of having plenty of well trained Bosnian expats who are familiar with both cultures and speak both languages very well. Sweden has had a chronic shortage of programmers since the 80'ies. Everybody won.

The problem with the UK housing shortage is that everybody in the UK wants to live in a house. Even inside central London. Just stop doing that and the problem is solved. The problem with building houses in Europe is never economic or practical. It's only got to do with politics. People have paid a lot for their houses, are in debt over their ears, and the last thing they want is that the value of their own home goes down. Which will happen if lots of apartment blocks start shooting up.

Just putting Syrians in local camps is short sighted, and a bad deal for everybody. There's zero synergistic effects available. And once the war is over repatriation is just another added cost for no possible added value.

 

[repoman]

yeah a lot a religions and hierarchies are just ways to have a lot of access to sexual partners for the people at the top.

Trump is our King Chimp.

This is why I think that cuck is an interesting insult. It makes no claims of needing to be a good person, but only of the reality that it is your duty to maximize your access to sex at the expense of competitors - to not be a cuck yourself.

So it is not about muslims are worse, but that we should expel them for genetic reasons. Sounds like a good idea. Hypocrisy in the pursuit of mating access is the highest virtue.

At least that is what a troll would say.

At any rate, it is gonna get real interesting when we run low of fossil fuels and other resources to see how this latent tribalism shakes out.

 

[whichphilosophy]

It costs £3,000 per year to settle Middle Eastern refugees in the Middle East and £30,000 to settle them in the UK.

We are also at least 2 million houses short. in the UK and packing more people in every year. In fact someone earning less than £50,000 per year in London and with a family will find it difficult to even buy a house.

If the UK wants to house a net of 300,000 refugees each year, building 120,000 houses a year or sometimes a little more is not going to solve the problem when there are already many in the UK who are staying at friends, homeless in shelters or not even listed.

But housing a refugee in a camp is just a net loss for everybody. Taking a Syrian from Syria and plonking him in a European economy means that after peace comes around we're now speeding up the build up of Syria. As well a strengthening of that European economy. Sweden has benefited immensely of having plenty of well trained Bosnian expats who are familiar with both cultures and speak both languages very well. Sweden has had a chronic shortage of programmers since the 80'ies. Everybody won.

The problem with the UK housing shortage is that everybody in the UK wants to live in a house. Even inside central London. Just stop doing that and the problem is solved. The problem with building houses in Europe is never economic or practical. It's only got to do with politics. People have paid a lot for their houses, are in debt over their ears, and the last thing they want is that the value of their own home goes down. Which will happen if lots of apartment blocks start shooting up.

Just putting Syrians in local camps is short sighted, and a bad deal for everybody. There's zero synergistic effects available. And once the war is over repatriation is just another added cost for no possible added value.

Obviously these would need to be evaluated long term. However, investment in affordable housing seems costly but most people will then pay rent and in some cases even buy them. It will create jobs during this period so workers are paid for working and not for not working. This means they will pay their own rent and not rely on government subsidies.

At the moment some flats are so overcrowded people have no choice but to sleep on top of each other or sleep standing up.

I think our long neglected targets for affordable house construction needs to be the key objective. Even what we once called higher income employees also look at government housing.

When I started working in London, even a shop worker at the 'Co-op' supermarekt could rent a one bedroom flat. Studios are a new thing. Housing prices may continue to fall but they are still huge in most of the UK

 

[whichphilosophy]

yeah a lot a religions and hierarchies are just ways to have a lot of access to sexual partners for the people at the top.

Trump is our King Chimp.

This is why I think that cuck is an interesting insult. It makes no claims of needing to be a good person, but only of the reality that it is your duty to maximize your access to sex at the expense of competitors - to not be a cuck yourself.

So it is not about muslims are worse, but that we should expel them for genetic reasons. Sounds like a good idea. Hypocrisy in the pursuit of mating access is the highest virtue.

At least that is what a troll would say.

I thought he was an Orangutan. He was voted in and those who disagree should focus on the next election and try and win. It seems the minute he was elected, left wing and Jihadi groups have been trying to remove him. Likeable or not that's not a healthy direction for a relative democracy to move.

If it works on Trump every election will be followed by the same pattern of behaviour and possible destruction.

Even some Democrats are using the word resistance. Is this resistance to a democratic process??

 

[Philos]

We are also at least 2 million houses short. in the UK and packing more people in every year. In fact someone earning less than £50,000 per year in London and with a family will find it difficult to even buy a house.

wp,

I will agree with your theme.

Near us there are some quite expensive newbuilds in a dockside setting. Walking around on a sunny evening we can see into the houses and apartments. Jesus! There isn't enough space in there to swing a hamster. I've been credibly informed that the contractors have specially downsized furniture made for the showhouses to trick buyer's perceptions.

Don't want to go all Ayn Randish, but living in a large Georgian property, I have room sizes that current folks can't even dream of below at least £750,000 and that is in out of town areas. The ceilings are more that twice my height, and our kitchen is the size of a modern lounge/kitchen/diner all on its own.

Yes, the baby boomers had it good, and many are sitting at the top of the property ladder, with the rungs cut away below them. Our daughter lives in a caravan.

A.

 

[whichphilosophy]

We are also at least 2 million houses short. in the UK and packing more people in every year. In fact someone earning less than £50,000 per year in London and with a family will find it difficult to even buy a house.

wp,

I will agree with your theme.

Near us there are some quite expensive newbuilds in a dockside setting. Walking around on a sunny evening we can see into the houses and apartments. Jesus! There isn't enough space in there to swing a hamster. I've been credibly informed that the contractors have specially downsized furniture made for the showhouses to trick buyer's perceptions.

Don't want to go all Ayn Randish, but living in a large Georgian property, I have room sizes that current folks can't even dream of below at least £750,000 and that is in out of town areas. The ceilings are more that twice my height, and our kitchen is the size of a modern lounge/kitchen/diner all on its own.

Yes, the baby boomers had it good, and many are sitting at the top of the property ladder, with the rungs cut away below them. Our daughter lives in a caravan.

A.

You mean she managed to find a caravan? If she leaves, she would cause a stampede.
The UK is building less houses than it did in the 1920s. I'll dig that one shortly.
Both Labour and Tory failed to take action this issue.

Not only that but some people living in Council houses are secretly subletting as they have another property. In the aftermath of the Glenfield avoidable tragedy it seems there were illegal immigrants and illegal tenants. So added to the housing problem illegal subletting (a pretty much open secret) is making things worse for those looking.

What I am looking at while I am in the UK is to try and purchase a small plot of land (but usually this is by auction) and then get a 2 bed built for £150,000. However this is easier said than done. Good private builders are harder to find than land

 

[angelo]

Nah, I've just gotten a bit tired of calling you the standard names, e.g. moron, dipshit, fuckwit, asshat. All perfectly valid though, so you can take your pick.

Typical of leftard loonies such as yourself wanting to hang anyone who dares to differ, or wanting to preserve Western Culture from idiots such as yourself!

 

[DrZoidberg]

Nah, I've just gotten a bit tired of calling you the standard names, e.g. moron, dipshit, fuckwit, asshat. All perfectly valid though, so you can take your pick.

Typical of leftard loonies such as yourself wanting to hang anyone who dares to differ, or wanting to preserve Western Culture from idiots such as yourself!

Can you give an example of western culture that you're worried might disappear?

 

[angelo]

Typical of leftard loonies such as yourself wanting to hang anyone who dares to differ, or wanting to preserve Western Culture from idiots such as yourself!

Readily available to anyone who cares to look.

 

[angelo]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/23/66m-migrants-waiting-cross-europe-africa-report/

 

[DrZoidberg]

Typical of leftard loonies such as yourself wanting to hang anyone who dares to differ, or wanting to preserve Western Culture from idiots such as yourself!

Readily available to anyone who cares to look.

So are you worried that "leftard loonies" might disappear?

 

[DrZoidberg]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/23/66m-migrants-waiting-cross-europe-africa-report/

There's lots of African countries who finally have gotten their act together. The first thing that happens is that there's a population explosion. This is a pattern that has been true for every other country on the planet. Africa is the last

Europe peaked at 1880. Sub-Saharan Africa at 1990. That's born vs dead. The demographic gap. But catching up "ie a Tiger economy" is much easier than being a trail blazer. Which means that the demographic gap will close quicker. Morocco peaked around 1960. In 2010 they reached the same level as Europe.

With IT technology the sub-Saharan will develop even faster. Botswana, for instance, has right now the worlds most advanced smart phone services. We're importing innovations from them right now.

So we can predict with good confidence that we've right now reached the peak of African migrants to Europe. In 20 years, max, they will be gone from Europe. And Africa will be struggling with find enough staff for their companies. Probably sooner. Nairobi today is very similar to any modern Western city. If you stay downtown it's identical. Expats are flooding in to start companies.

If you don't believe me, check the numbers yourself.

http://www.gapminder.org

So relax about the hysteria about African migrants. This is just a phase. They'll soon be gone.

 

[LordKiran]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/23/66m-migrants-waiting-cross-europe-africa-report/

There's lots of African countries who finally have gotten their act together. The first thing that happens is that there's a population explosion. This is a pattern that has been true for every other country on the planet. Africa is the last

Europe peaked at 1880. Sub-Saharan Africa at 1990. That's born vs dead. The demographic gap. But catching up "ie a Tiger economy" is much easier than being a trail blazer. Which means that the demographic gap will close quicker. Morocco peaked around 1960. In 2010 they reached the same level as Europe.

With IT technology the sub-Saharan will develop even faster. Botswana, for instance, has right now the worlds most advanced smart phone services. We're importing innovations from them right now.

So we can predict with good confidence that we've right now reached the peak of African migrants to Europe. In 20 years, max, they will be gone from Europe. And Africa will be struggling with find enough staff for their companies. Probably sooner. Nairobi today is very similar to any modern Western city. If you stay downtown it's identical. Expats are flooding in to start companies.

If you don't believe me, check the numbers yourself.

http://www.gapminder.org

So relax about the hysteria about African migrants. This is just a phase. They'll soon be gone.

Unless Global Warming ends up being really bad in which case expect them to migrate north by the hundreds of millions!

 

[DrZoidberg]

There's lots of African countries who finally have gotten their act together. The first thing that happens is that there's a population explosion. This is a pattern that has been true for every other country on the planet. Africa is the last

Europe peaked at 1880. Sub-Saharan Africa at 1990. That's born vs dead. The demographic gap. But catching up "ie a Tiger economy" is much easier than being a trail blazer. Which means that the demographic gap will close quicker. Morocco peaked around 1960. In 2010 they reached the same level as Europe.

With IT technology the sub-Saharan will develop even faster. Botswana, for instance, has right now the worlds most advanced smart phone services. We're importing innovations from them right now.

So we can predict with good confidence that we've right now reached the peak of African migrants to Europe. In 20 years, max, they will be gone from Europe. And Africa will be struggling with find enough staff for their companies. Probably sooner. Nairobi today is very similar to any modern Western city. If you stay downtown it's identical. Expats are flooding in to start companies.

If you don't believe me, check the numbers yourself.

http://www.gapminder.org

So relax about the hysteria about African migrants. This is just a phase. They'll soon be gone.

Unless Global Warming ends up being really bad in which case expect them to migrate north by the hundreds of millions!

Hm... really? The inlands will become dryer. Africa has coasts as well. Why wouldn't people just move there? Sea levels are expected to rise about 1 meter by 2100. That's bad news for Holland, Bangladesh and the Solomon islands... but pretty chill for the rest of us.

Exactly how food production will be impacted is anyone's guess. We don't know what will happen. It will be cloudier, warmer and we'll have more CO2. I find it hard to imagine that clever farmers won't find a way to tweak that. As long as we're eating meat, I'd say it's a non-issue. If humanity would switch to an all vegetarian diet we could feed 60 000 000 000, no problem.

While global warming is a shitty situation, there's no point exaggerating the problems. Global warming will hit Europe as much as everywhere else. People can migrate there just as well. Canada and Russia will start getting prime real estate in the arctic. People can start living on the antarctic.

Humans have a way of coping. Our biggest threat has always ever been other humans.

 

[angelo]

Typical of leftard loonies such as yourself wanting to hang anyone who dares to differ, or wanting to preserve Western Culture from idiots such as yourself!

Readily available to anyone who cares to look.

So are you worried that "leftard loonies" might disappear?

I fucked up the reply/post. That was meant as a reply to Warpoet.