Everybody Outta the Pool! (or The More Things Change, the More They Stay the Same)

[AthenaAwakened]

Arguing the officer behaved badly is a different argument than everyone is racist. Everyone not need be racist for an officer to behave badly.

We need not push the narrative that this friendly and well behaved group of youngsters looking to have a nice refreshing swim encountered an inexplicably racist HOA policy which smacks of the historical segregation of pools, were assaulted by a racist security guards, called racist names by white suburban moms before being assaulted by said white suburban moms, who then called the racist police because of racism. Then when the racist police got there the immediately began rounding up the black people because racism and that one so damn near lost his racist mind due to the proximity of black people that he started doing pratfalls and barrel rolls on the ground and whipping his gun around, because you know everything everywhere is racism. All the time.

The only nonracist person these sweet young well behaved children encountered is that evil black witness who said this wasn't racism and he only gets off on the technicality that he can't be racist because he's black.

- - - Updated - - -

The HOA rules are irrelevant.

The lead up to the arrival of the police is irrelevant.

I think it is all relevant as it applies to the context of the events. A number of things could have been done to prevent what happened. I keep hearing about how the teens should have listened to the cops. I saw a lot of kids sitting down as per the officer's orders (why they even needed to sit, I don't know). Why did the Police even need to be involved?

And I think the officer's reaction was appropriate... assuming this was a riot. It was a riot, right?

No bikers were shot so more of a brouhaha.

Who said everyone was racist?

Everyone is clearly not racist because the one neighbor is black.

But is it your claim that the white women by the pool, the security guards, the people who called the police, the white women involved in the physical brouhaha, the cop who pulled the gun, and the other cops, were not all racists?

No.

So they are all racist then? I lack the ability many people here have to look into the hearts of people in youtube videos and online news stories and see what motivates them so I need help on this one.

Are they all racist? We all are, dear. They are racist, you are racist, I am racist, "All god's children are racist." And sexist, and classist, and any other -ist that is evidenced in society. Our institutions are racist, and sexist, and classist, and every other -ist. They are created by us and those who came before us so how could they be otherwise?

But you already knew that. So the asking seems superfluous.

 

[credoconsolans]

The HOA rules are irrelevant.

The lead up to the arrival of the police is irrelevant.

It is relevant when considering the credibility of some of the participants.

In one brief interview the mother was caught in one outright lie, one lie of omission and a less than admirable attitude toward respecting rules.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I think so. People are afraid of large groups of rowdy teens too.

And cops have a very real reason to fear a bunch of people coming at them in response to what they did to someone. Such situations tend to turn violent.

I think the big difference here is in how people reacted when the cops confronted them.

Loren, we know that you believe that a cop should be allowed to shoot a nearby child who has the flu. You don't need to continue letting us know that you think the cop has the right commit acts of egregious force.

 

[fromderinside]

And cops have a very real reason to fear a bunch of people coming at them in response to what they did to someone. Such situations tend to turn violent.

I think the big difference here is in how people reacted when the cops confronted them.

Loren, we know that you believe that a cop should be allowed to shoot a nearby child who has the flu. You don't need to continue letting us know that you think the cop has the right commit acts of egregious force.

Actually though even the perp cop doesn't agree. He resigned. His Chief thinks he screwed up big time and rather than be fired the maneuver man resigned.

 

[Smoker]

The best part of this whole video is at the 5 second mark when the cop tripped, fell, and rolled out of it. I was like...wait, you mean there is more to this video than this piece of gold?

Clearly he had a slight overdose of his prescription Hero Pills before taking this call.

You know what I'm thinking? Inter-department MMA tournament. Must make it to the semi-finals in order to keep your job. There are too many pussies in this country who think a gun and a badge is all they need to become badasses.

I don't think he accidentally tripped and rolled out of it. It looks to me like an intentional commando roll that he has probably been practicing in his backyard for a long time and decided to apply in the heat of the moment so everybody would see how hardcore he is. That dickhead was apparently some kind of martial arts teacher on the side. Most Texas cops are dicks. They've been fucking with me my whole life, and I'm a normal looking white guy. I can only imagine how bad people of other skin color are treated by them.

 

[RavenSky]

I think so. People are afraid of large groups of rowdy teens too.

And cops have a very real reason to fear a bunch of people coming at them in response to what they did to someone. Such situations tend to turn violent.

I think the big difference here is in how people reacted when the cops confronted them.

OK Sean Toon

 

[dismal]

Arguing the officer behaved badly is a different argument than everyone is racist. Everyone not need be racist for an officer to behave badly.

We need not push the narrative that this friendly and well behaved group of youngsters looking to have a nice refreshing swim encountered an inexplicably racist HOA policy which smacks of the historical segregation of pools, were assaulted by a racist security guards, called racist names by white suburban moms before being assaulted by said white suburban moms, who then called the racist police because of racism. Then when the racist police got there the immediately began rounding up the black people because racism and that one so damn near lost his racist mind due to the proximity of black people that he started doing pratfalls and barrel rolls on the ground and whipping his gun around, because you know everything everywhere is racism. All the time.

The only nonracist person these sweet young well behaved children encountered is that evil black witness who said this wasn't racism and he only gets off on the technicality that he can't be racist because he's black.

- - - Updated - - -

The HOA rules are irrelevant.

The lead up to the arrival of the police is irrelevant.

I think it is all relevant as it applies to the context of the events. A number of things could have been done to prevent what happened. I keep hearing about how the teens should have listened to the cops. I saw a lot of kids sitting down as per the officer's orders (why they even needed to sit, I don't know). Why did the Police even need to be involved?

And I think the officer's reaction was appropriate... assuming this was a riot. It was a riot, right?

No bikers were shot so more of a brouhaha.

Who said everyone was racist?

Everyone is clearly not racist because the one neighbor is black.

But is it your claim that the white women by the pool, the security guards, the people who called the police, the white women involved in the physical brouhaha, the cop who pulled the gun, and the other cops, were not all racists?

No.

So they are all racist then? I lack the ability many people here have to look into the hearts of people in youtube videos and online news stories and see what motivates them so I need help on this one.

Are they all racist? We all are, dear. They are racist, you are racist, I am racist, "All god's children are racist." And sexist, and classist, and any other -ist that is evidenced in society. Our institutions are racist, and sexist, and classist, and every other -ist. They are created by us and those who came before us so how could they be otherwise?

But you already knew that. So the asking seems superfluous.

But if all of us are racist all the time, which I can actually accept to some degree if our current definition of "racism" is that we perceive race and are affected by our preconceptions of race, why do we (or some of us) attribute racist motives to this brouhaha and not other events?

When a plane crashes we don't blame gravity.

Are we moving toward a belief that when anything bad happens to a black person it's because racism? Because bad things happen to people of other races too.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

When a plane crashes we don't blame gravity.

I do.

Repeal. The. Law.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

When a plane crashes we don't blame gravity.

I do.

Repeal. The. Law.

Skwerl has a point. And we do fly despite gravity. And we take precautions not to crash. And we find crashing a bad thing.

We are born in a world where the natural state is to be earthbound for life, and yet we CHOOSE to fly. Being born in the conditions of racism doesn't mean we have to accept it as a limiting principle of life and never do better.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Arguing the officer behaved badly is a different argument than everyone is racist. Everyone not need be racist for an officer to behave badly.

We need not push the narrative that this friendly and well behaved group of youngsters looking to have a nice refreshing swim encountered an inexplicably racist HOA policy which smacks of the historical segregation of pools, were assaulted by a racist security guards, called racist names by white suburban moms before being assaulted by said white suburban moms, who then called the racist police because of racism. Then when the racist police got there the immediately began rounding up the black people because racism and that one so damn near lost his racist mind due to the proximity of black people that he started doing pratfalls and barrel rolls on the ground and whipping his gun around, because you know everything everywhere is racism. All the time.

The only nonracist person these sweet young well behaved children encountered is that evil black witness who said this wasn't racism and he only gets off on the technicality that he can't be racist because he's black.

- - - Updated - - -

The HOA rules are irrelevant.

The lead up to the arrival of the police is irrelevant.

I think it is all relevant as it applies to the context of the events. A number of things could have been done to prevent what happened. I keep hearing about how the teens should have listened to the cops. I saw a lot of kids sitting down as per the officer's orders (why they even needed to sit, I don't know). Why did the Police even need to be involved?

And I think the officer's reaction was appropriate... assuming this was a riot. It was a riot, right?

No bikers were shot so more of a brouhaha.

Who said everyone was racist?

Everyone is clearly not racist because the one neighbor is black.

But is it your claim that the white women by the pool, the security guards, the people who called the police, the white women involved in the physical brouhaha, the cop who pulled the gun, and the other cops, were not all racists?

No.

So they are all racist then? I lack the ability many people here have to look into the hearts of people in youtube videos and online news stories and see what motivates them so I need help on this one.

Are they all racist? We all are, dear. They are racist, you are racist, I am racist, "All god's children are racist." And sexist, and classist, and any other -ist that is evidenced in society. Our institutions are racist, and sexist, and classist, and every other -ist. They are created by us and those who came before us so how could they be otherwise?

But you already knew that. So the asking seems superfluous.

But if all of us are racist all the time, which I can actually accept to some degree if our current definition of "racism" is that we perceive race and are affected by our preconceptions of race, why do we (or some of us) attribute racist motives to this brouhaha and not other events?

When a plane crashes we don't blame gravity.

Are we moving toward a belief that when anything bad happens to a black person it's because racism?

Where has anyone said that?

Because bad things happen to people of other races too.

Everybody dies. Some people die in car wrecks. We don't deny car wrecks simply because every dies somehow anyway. Instead we enact rules of the road, design safer cars, and encourage people to drive defensively,

 

[Bacillus anthracis]

I know the area.

It's a mixed race area.

The pool is private and part of the HOA.

The HOA requires that if you want a party on their premises, you have to sign up for it and get approval. There are all kinds of rules and legal responsibilities.

The pool is not part of that. You have to get separate permission to use the pool for a party.

I know because I once planned a party in an HOA right down the street from there.

The HOA allows its members to bring guests to the pool. Limit of two per member.

1) The HOA says they were unaware there was a party to be taking place on their property

2) The pool was not part of the original party. Some of the party members or party crashers (apparently it was advertised on Facebook, meaning anyone could show up), started jumping the fence and getting in the pool area. Members started passing their pool cards to their friends through the fences so they could get in. Some of the members took offense to this and an ugly argument got started that escalated. People ran to join, the security guard, overwhelmed, called the cops to break up the fight and rowdy partiers.

3) The cop asked the girl - you can see this in the video - to disperse 7 times. She did not.

4) Mother was asked why people at the party were breaking the HOA rules. She replied, "Everyone does it." As if that's a good reason to break rules yourself.

The cop was afraid of being overrun. He didn't pull his gun on the girl, he pulled it on the people rushing him to help her.

Could the cop have handled this better? You bet.

Should the kids have obeyed the cop? You bet.

Hey now. No need to be sensible.

The cop was over-zealous. But when he got rushed, he was within his authority to pull his gun. He was surrounded by half a dozen people, with two males coming towards him. What in the fuck gave them the idea to think that was okay to do?

When the cops give you an opportunity to leave, you fucking leave. Get in your car and drive away, walk away, get on your bike, catch a sky-hook ride from the CIA. Whatever. What you do't do is stick around, scream, and rush at them.

As a kid me and my friends and our crowd in general got chased from backyard parties several times a year by the cops. When the cops showed up, everyone dispersed as quickly as possible. We had this crazy idea that we didn't want to get arrested when getting arrested was 100% avoidable.

I don't like cops--I fucking detest them for the most part. But that doesn't mean that my good sense leaves me if I have to deal with them.

I'm a parent. My youngest watched this thing with me on the news, aghast at the police officer's handling of the situation. I told her that if she was ever in the same situation, "Just leave or get as far away as you can." And that's what the parents of every kid in this video should be telling their own kids. Every single one of those kids could have simply walked off.

Again, the tubby-ninja cop handled the thing poorly to begin with, but dammit, if I saw my kid acting like that I could only ask her what the hell she thought was going to happen. And as a parent, I'd be embarrassed.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

I know the area.

It's a mixed race area.

The pool is private and part of the HOA.

The HOA requires that if you want a party on their premises, you have to sign up for it and get approval. There are all kinds of rules and legal responsibilities.

The pool is not part of that. You have to get separate permission to use the pool for a party.

I know because I once planned a party in an HOA right down the street from there.

The HOA allows its members to bring guests to the pool. Limit of two per member.

1) The HOA says they were unaware there was a party to be taking place on their property

2) The pool was not part of the original party. Some of the party members or party crashers (apparently it was advertised on Facebook, meaning anyone could show up), started jumping the fence and getting in the pool area. Members started passing their pool cards to their friends through the fences so they could get in. Some of the members took offense to this and an ugly argument got started that escalated. People ran to join, the security guard, overwhelmed, called the cops to break up the fight and rowdy partiers.

3) The cop asked the girl - you can see this in the video - to disperse 7 times. She did not.

4) Mother was asked why people at the party were breaking the HOA rules. She replied, "Everyone does it." As if that's a good reason to break rules yourself.

The cop was afraid of being overrun. He didn't pull his gun on the girl, he pulled it on the people rushing him to help her.

Could the cop have handled this better? You bet.

Should the kids have obeyed the cop? You bet.

Hey now. No need to be sensible.

The cop was over-zealous. But when he got rushed, he was within his authority to pull his gun. He was surrounded by half a dozen people, with two males coming towards him. What in the fuck gave them the idea to think that was okay to do?

When the cops give you an opportunity to leave, you fucking leave. Get in your car and drive away, walk away, get on your bike, catch a sky-hook ride from the CIA. Whatever. What you do't do is stick around, scream, and rush at them.

As a kid me and my friends and our crowd in general got chased from backyard parties several times a year by the cops. When the cops showed up, everyone dispersed as quickly as possible. We had this crazy idea that we didn't want to get arrested when getting arrested was 100% avoidable.

I don't like cops--I fucking detest them for the most part. But that doesn't mean that my good sense leaves me if I have to deal with them.

I'm a parent. My youngest watched this thing with me on the news, aghast at the police officer's handling of the situation. I told her that if she was ever in the same situation, "Just leave or get as far away as you can." And that's what the parents of every kid in this video should be telling their own kids. Every single one of those kids could have simply walked off.

Again, the tubby-ninja cop handled the thing poorly to begin with, but dammit, if I saw my kid acting like that I could only ask her what the hell she thought was going to happen. And as a parent, I'd be embarrassed.

As a parent I would be enraged at someone hurting my child, but that's just me.

Now if I were the cop's parent, then I would be mortified.

 

[Bacillus anthracis]

Loren, we know that you believe that a cop should be allowed to shoot a nearby child who has the flu. You don't need to continue letting us know that you think the cop has the right commit acts of egregious force.

Actually though even the perp cop doesn't agree. He resigned. His Chief thinks he screwed up big time and rather than be fired the maneuver man resigned.

He resigned because he was going to get fired. The facts of the situation didn't matter. The cop shop and the cop knew that there was no sense in arguing anything. Right or wrong, they wanted to quell the controversy as soon as possible before any kind of hearing could take place during which the cop would have a chance to explain his actions. Due process just took a thumb in the eye.

That's serious shit to consider. Even the worst criminals are afforded due process, but this cop wasn't. I'm guessing he was forced out before he could have a hearing due to the media situation, and that by resigning he may have saved some part of a pension or something similar whereas an eventual firing may have denied him benefits. If I'm an attorney in that area, I'd want to have a good sit-down with the guy and get his version of events.

Again, I have no sympathy for cops when they whine about how hard their job is; and cop culture, with all its militarism and us against them mentality disgusts me. But this wasn't a situation so grossly abusive and so obviously oppressive, that the guy didn't deserve a fair hearing. As a matter of fact, there is no such situation where the denial of due process exists based on on a video. At least not in the U.S.

 

[prideandfall]

But this wasn't a situation so grossly abusive and so obviously oppressive, that the guy didn't deserve a fair hearing. As a matter of fact, there is no such situation where the denial of due process exists based on on a video. At least not in the U.S.

i disagree with this completely on 2 counts:
1. it's not about being abusive and/or oppressive, that isn't the only criteria by which one can (or should) judge the actions of a cop - they are public servants, instruments of the collective will of society, and i don't give a flying fuck if a teenaged girl refused to disperse 7 times or 7,000 times, and if her other pool-party friends rushed up to her or not; there is no excuse for the cop to have pulled his weapon, period, end of discussion.

2. fair hearing for what? you don't go to court for being a dipshit at work and getting fired over it.
he got sacked for being a dipshit who sucks at his job, it's not like a grand jury inquest is required to ascertain the legality of sacking some dipshit for sucking at their job.

 

[Axulus]

Are they all racist? We all are, dear. They are racist, you are racist, I am racist, "All god's children are racist." And sexist, and classist, and any other -ist that is evidenced in society. Our institutions are racist, and sexist, and classist, and every other -ist. They are created by us and those who came before us so how could they be otherwise?

But you already knew that. So the asking seems superfluous.

But isn't the whole debate on whether this was akin to a "white's only" pool, and the racist HOA residents called in the cops to kick out the dirty blacks for dare stepping foot in their pool, who then came in and used excessive force in a racist manner to get those blacks the heck outta there?

Isn't that they way the incident was presented in the OP article?

 

[prideandfall]

Are they all racist? We all are, dear. They are racist, you are racist, I am racist, "All god's children are racist." And sexist, and classist, and any other -ist that is evidenced in society. Our institutions are racist, and sexist, and classist, and every other -ist. They are created by us and those who came before us so how could they be otherwise?

But you already knew that. So the asking seems superfluous.

But isn't the whole debate on whether this was akin to a "white's only" pool, and the racist HOA residents called in the cops to kick out the dirty blacks for dare stepping foot in their pool, who then came in and used excessive force in a racist manner to get those blacks the heck outta there?

Isn't that they way the incident was presented in the OP article?

i don't think so at all - but i do think that if the exact same scenario had happened and instead of being rowdy black teens it had been rowdy white teens, the incident would have gone in a very different manner.
i suppose you can argue if you want to that this isn't so, but quite frankly doing so would be you being full of shit.

 

[Axulus]

But isn't the whole debate on whether this was akin to a "white's only" pool, and the racist HOA residents called in the cops to kick out the dirty blacks for dare stepping foot in their pool, who then came in and used excessive force in a racist manner to get those blacks the heck outta there?

Isn't that they way the incident was presented in the OP article?

i don't think so at all - but i do think that if the exact same scenario had happened and instead of being rowdy black teens it had been rowdy white teens, the incident would have gone in a very different manner.
i suppose you can argue if you want to that this isn't so, but quite frankly doing so would be you being full of shit.

Then the black residents/witnesses who insist it had nothing to do with racism are also full of shit. You must be a racist.

 

[dismal]

i don't think so at all - but i do think that if the exact same scenario had happened and instead of being rowdy black teens it had been rowdy white teens, the incident would have gone in a very different manner.
i suppose you can argue if you want to that this isn't so, but quite frankly doing so would be you being full of shit.

Then the black residents/witnesses who insist it had nothing to do with racism are also full of shit. You must be a racist.

In this thread we are all racists. Even the black people.

*edit

Sorry, Black people.

 

[ksen]

i don't think so at all - but i do think that if the exact same scenario had happened and instead of being rowdy black teens it had been rowdy white teens, the incident would have gone in a very different manner.
i suppose you can argue if you want to that this isn't so, but quite frankly doing so would be you being full of shit.

Then the black residents/witnesses who insist it had nothing to do with racism are also full of shit. You must be a racist.

There were white residents claiming it had to do with racism. And white trumps black on believability.

 

[TSwizzle]

OH FFS !!

A Florida principal lost his job for defending the Texas cop who waved his gun at swimsuit-clad teens during a pool party raid.

The Miami-Dade school district dismissed Alberto Iber from his job at North Miami Senior High School Wednesday for comments he made on Facebook, officials told the Miami Herald.

News

A heretic has been burned at the stake for the heinous crime of blasphemy.