Explaining Privilege: It may not be what you think.

[AthenaAwakened]

Privilege is not something you keep in a barrel like pickles and you just reach your hand in when you need some. It is more like you are a fish and privilege is the water you swim in.

An Example of privilege is:

I get to get lost in strange buildings because I don't have to remember how I get into places. I can walk. I can take more than one route. I can go into a building on a ramp and come out using steps. Any exit will get me out.

A person in a wheelchair cannot do these things. They have to remember how they get into places because that is often the only way they can get out. They have to pay attention to where exit signs are and if they are handicap accessible. They have to know how wide hallways are and if all or only some bathrooms are accessible to them. Things the able bodied don't have to think about.

That's how privilege works. It is the gift of not having to think about certain things. It is the gift of freedom from certain concerns, concerns members of other groups must always consider. It is the gift of having the world automatically fit me.

And privilege comes in more than one size, more than one flavor. And most people have privileges in one area and lack privilege in others. So they find themselves fighting what hinders them and not thinking about what hinders others.

You are not to blame for the privileges you have or have not. These things were set up before you were born. But if you can't find in your heart to empathize with others who lack your privilege, do not wish to truly investigate what privilege is, and want to attack not privilege but the people who lack it ...

That's on you.

 

[Worldtraveller]

Good explanation. I anticipate the usual suspects coming here to deny privilege even exists, or ignoring this thread altogether.

What I don't understand, is why it seems worth the effort to deny such an obvious and demonstrable thing exists. It's not my fault I'm a white guy, so why pretend that doesn't come with some inherent privilege?

I mean, I try to use that privilege when I can to help those without that privilege, but this isn't a zero sum game.

 

[laughing dog]

I can only guess how tiring and stressful it is for those without some of these advantages to deal with on a daily basis.

 

[Politesse]

Truth. My mother was in a wheelchair for a long time while I was growing up, and though the reason was awful, and I'm grateful for the early lesson in seeing the world as it really is. To wit, not very accessible, even when someone angrily insists that it is. Much the time, "wheelchair accessible routes" are a long, twisting tour of the back corridors of some building, or a long steep ramp that that a motorized would struggle to ascend but a manual better be piloted by a friend or an Olympian endurance weightlifter. One time we had to cross a long stretch of seemingly open tarmac at an airport, the door we were supposed to be heading for on the other side not obvious til we got there. Another time, someone called security on us because my mother, now liberated from the chair but still with limited mobility, was using a handicap elevator. Many people think that if they can't see an obvious disability, the person isn't "really disabled".


And when I was old enough, I was quicker to realize that race equality, LGBT inclusion, and so forth were (whether quietly or just blatantly) much the same way - angry concessions that often punished those who dared to claim them. It made me more humble, and a better person, and it scares me to think that if I hadn't been born as a closeted bisexual with a cripple for a mother, the cocoon of my other privileges could easily have blinded me to ever noticing any of this until too late in life. If you have a certain skin color in this country, the highway that leads to false centrism is wide and well-camouflaged.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

You are not to blame for the privileges you have or have not.

I bet idiots are not going to read this part and still get mad.

 

[James Brown]

Straight White Male: The Lowest Difficulty Setting There Is

 

[Emily Lake]

Good explanation. I anticipate the usual suspects coming here to deny privilege even exists, or ignoring this thread altogether.

What I don't understand, is why it seems worth the effort to deny such an obvious and demonstrable thing exists. It's not my fault I'm a white guy, so why pretend that doesn't come with some inherent privilege?

I mean, I try to use that privilege when I can to help those without that privilege, but this isn't a zero sum game.

I honestly think a lot of it has to do with the term coined for this phenomenon. There were pre-existing meanings of the word "privilege", which implied a silver spoon upbringing and having everything handed to one. Privileges were special gifts only handed out to a few.

So when it gets used to describe a very wide swath of people, it's very difficult to communicate a new and nuanced meaning of the term for that. It's a fairly instinctual response - it's one I struggled with when I first ran across it. My reaction was defensive, because I grew up poor and struggling, and it's taken a lot of work and effort to get where I am, and I resented being told (in my eyes) that I didn't deserve what I had accomplished because it was all just the magical gift of some privilege. It took a lot of patience on the part of other people, and a lot of research on my own, to get a better grasp of it.

I genuinely think that if a brand new word had been coined for this, there would have been a lot less pushback and objection.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

I genuinely think that if a brand new word had been coined for this, there would have been a lot less pushback and objection.

Or maybe some people just whine too much.

 

[Emily Lake]

Straight White Male: The Lowest Difficulty Setting There Is

Excellent atticle!

This means that the default behaviors for almost all the non-player characters in the game are easier on you than they would be otherwise. The default barriers for completions of quests are lower. Your leveling-up thresholds come more quickly. You automatically gain entry to some parts of the map that others have to work for. The game is easier to play, automatically, and when you need help, by default it’s easier to get.

Fantastic analogy

I also liked the follow-ups to the comments, particularly this one:

12. You wrote the article and pointed out the straight white men live life on the lowest difficulty setting. Okay, fine. What do I/we do next?

Well, that’s up to you, isn’t it? What I’m doing is pointing out a thing. What you do with that thing is your decision.

That said, here’s what I do: recognize it, and work to make it so the more difficult settings in life becomes closer to the one I get to run through life on — by making those less difficult, mind you, not making mine more so.

I've tried to make that point to people over the years. The point is not to take privilege away, or to punish people who have privilege. The objective is to extend that privilege to everyone else.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Good explanation. I anticipate the usual suspects coming here to deny privilege even exists, or ignoring this thread altogether.

What I don't understand, is why it seems worth the effort to deny such an obvious and demonstrable thing exists. It's not my fault I'm a white guy, so why pretend that doesn't come with some inherent privilege?

I mean, I try to use that privilege when I can to help those without that privilege, but this isn't a zero sum game.

Differences exist. Duh! The problem with these arguments is that it's just the disparate outcome argument in different clothes. Disparate outcome does not prove discrimination, it only suggests areas to check for discrimination.

 

[repoman]

Excellent atticle!


Fantastic analogy

I also liked the follow-ups to the comments, particularly this one:

12. You wrote the article and pointed out the straight white men live life on the lowest difficulty setting. Okay, fine. What do I/we do next?

Well, that’s up to you, isn’t it? What I’m doing is pointing out a thing. What you do with that thing is your decision.

That said, here’s what I do: recognize it, and work to make it so the more difficult settings in life becomes closer to the one I get to run through life on — by making those less difficult, mind you, not making mine more so.

I've tried to make that point to people over the years. The point is not to take privilege away, or to punish people who have privilege. The objective is to extend that privilege to everyone else.

would your brother (if you had one) have qualified for this?

https://gcs.civilservice.gov.uk/career/progress-your-career/internship/

 

[Trausti]

Good explanation. I anticipate the usual suspects coming here to deny privilege even exists, or ignoring this thread altogether.

What I don't understand, is why it seems worth the effort to deny such an obvious and demonstrable thing exists. It's not my fault I'm a white guy, so why pretend that doesn't come with some inherent privilege?

I mean, I try to use that privilege when I can to help those without that privilege, but this isn't a zero sum game.

Differences exist. Duh! The problem with these arguments is that it's just the disparate outcome argument in different clothes. Disparate outcome does not prove discrimination, it only suggests areas to check for discrimination.

It’s the racism of the gaps.

 

[Rhea]

I've tried to make that point to people over the years. The point is not to take privilege away, or to punish people who have privilege. The objective is to extend that privilege to everyone else.

would your brother (if you had one) have qualified for this?

She said she grew up poor. So “economically disadvantaged” would probably fit, wouldn’t it?


It’s interesting watching the perennial terror. There must NEVER be a SINGLE INSTANCE of a minority having it easier. They can handle “just as hard” (though they’ll always consider it too much, in the end), but they cannot handle a single caseof a minority actually getting the privilege that the white men have always had.

It’s an interesting outlook that they do indeed consider it that the white men are losing something rather than seeing that all the rest are finally gaining what the white men have always had.

It’s very interesting. We’ve talked about this topic here for 20 years now, and not once have these posters ever realized that it has been harder all this time for everyone else. They are simply blind to it. No analogy, no anecdote, no statistics, no trend has ever overcome the sensation that people are trying to TAKE from them.


Fascinating.

 

[steve_bank]

Sounds like you are describing human civilization going back to the first civilizations.

Should the state be all things to all people all the time regardless of the issue, and is it even possible?

I speak as one who 5 years ago had heart failure resulting in mob9lity limitations. I walk well enough with a cane to get around the city on public transit. I was in a wheel chair for a while. It may sound cliché, but it was eye opening for me.

What pisses me off are the for rent electric bikes and scooters users leave in the middle of sidewalks.

You are not directly invoking race but I assume it is what you are t6alking about.

You are hard pressed to say to whites in Appalachia and in depressed coal areas that they are priviledged.

Ever here wqhites use the term white trash or trailer trash for other whites?

IMO 'privilege' as is now the PC term is something you work for, no one can hand that to you. White immigrants went through the process. It was a long struggle for Irish and Italian. I know thyat from experience growing up in the NYC are in the 50s/60s. In the day Italians made an issue on the recurring portrayal of Italians on TV and in movies as being criminal thugs. They seceded in forcing changes in the original Godfather movie.


On NPR there was a discussion about a black women from Africa living in England who had a film role about a black American activist. The woman on NPR was furious it was not played by an American black, She also complained immigrant Nigerian women in Ca were rising faster than native born blacks, the actress being from Nigeria.

I worked for an engineering company started by Iranian immigrants. They came over with nothing, went to school, got experience, and started a company. They made their own privilege's. Nothing was handed to them.

In the 60s I dated an Italian girl with immigrant parents. Her father started a successful sausage company in the face of bias. An Italian uncle married into my family and it was a long time before my father and uncles accepted him.

 

[laughing dog]

Good explanation. I anticipate the usual suspects coming here to deny privilege even exists, or ignoring this thread altogether.

What I don't understand, is why it seems worth the effort to deny such an obvious and demonstrable thing exists. It's not my fault I'm a white guy, so why pretend that doesn't come with some inherent privilege?

I mean, I try to use that privilege when I can to help those without that privilege, but this isn't a zero sum game.

Differences exist. Duh! The problem with these arguments is that it's just the disparate outcome argument in different clothes. Disparate outcome does not prove discrimination, it only suggests areas to check for discrimination.

Wrong thread - no one is discussing discrimination in this thread.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Sounds like you are describing human civilization going back to the first civilizations.

Should the state be all things to all people all the time regardless of the issue, and is it even possible?

I speak as one who 5 years ago had heart failure resulting in mob9lity limitations. I walk well enough with a cane to get around the city on public transit. I was in a wheel chair for a while. It may sound cliché, but it was eye opening for me.

What pisses me off are the for rent electric bikes and scooters users leave in the middle of sidewalks.

You are not directly invoking race but I assume it is what you are t6alking about.

You are hard pressed to say to whites in Appalachia and in depressed coal areas that they are priviledged.

Ever here wqhites use the term white trash or trailer trash for other whites?

IMO 'privilege' as is now the PC term is something you work for, no one can hand that to you. White immigrants went through the process. It was a long struggle for Irish and Italian. I know thyat from experience growing up in the NYC are in the 50s/60s. In the day Italians made an issue on the recurring portrayal of Italians on TV and in movies as being criminal thugs. They seceded in forcing changes in the original Godfather movie.


On NPR there was a discussion about a black women from Africa living in England who had a film role about a black American activist. The woman on NPR was furious it was not played by an American black, She also complained immigrant Nigerian women in Ca were rising faster than native born blacks, the actress being from Nigeria.

I worked for an engineering company started by Iranian immigrants. They came over with nothing, went to school, got experience, and started a company. They made their own privilege's. Nothing was handed to them.

In the 60s I dated an Italian girl with immigrant parents. Her father started a successful sausage company in the face of bias. An Italian uncle married into my family and it was a long time before my father and uncles accepted him.

I think you should take this wonderful post and give it its own thread. In its own thread, it will be relevant and on topic.

Really really excellent post. Seriously just gorgeous.

 

[Trausti]

So is there an objective and reproducible test for privilege or is it all feels?

 

[Politesse]

So is there an objective and reproducible test for privilege or is it all feels?

There are many quantifiable metrics thereof. employment rate, differential salaries, college admissions, likelihood of a home or student loan, geographic access to key vocational markets, access to fresh fruits and vegetables, the list goes on and on.

 

[Derec]

Privilege is not something you keep in a barrel like pickles and you just reach your hand in when you need some. It is more like you are a fish and privilege is the water you swim in.

An Example of privilege is:

I get to get lost in strange buildings because I don't have to remember how I get into places. I can walk. I can take more than one route. I can go into a building on a ramp and come out using steps. Any exit will get me out.

A person in a wheelchair cannot do these things. They have to remember how they get into places because that is often the only way they can get out. They have to pay attention to where exit signs are and if they are handicap accessible. They have to know how wide hallways are and if all or only some bathrooms are accessible to them. Things the able bodied don't have to think about.

No, it is not. This is a difference in ability. Privilege is about formal and informal treatment by society, especially when it occurs for no good reason.
And yes, I know you will say how accessible a building is is a product of society. But imagine trying to navigate the natural world instead of man-made buildings! The difference in accessibility of even pre-ADA buildings compared to say having to go cross-country is colossal. So that's not a good analogy at all.

Example in the area that you really want to talk about - skin color.

Ability to synthesize vitamin D efficiently even at higher latitudes is not privilege. Neither is the ability to more effectively protect one's skin from photodamage in lower latitudes and/or higher altitudes.

But things like Jim Crow Laws in the past or so-called "Affirmative Action" or "n-word privilege" are examples of privilege.

Or another, perhaps a bit silly, example: penis size.
Having a small or large penis is difference in natural endowment. It's not privilege in itself.
But societal stereotypes about dick size are about how people are treated in society and thus are an example of privilege, because generally (but not always, of course) being thought of as having a big dick is seen as a good thing.

 

[Derec]

Good explanation. I anticipate the usual suspects coming here to deny privilege even exists, or ignoring this thread altogether.

It exists but it is very different than the way the likes of Athena are preaching. Racial preferences in education and employment are an example of privileges. As as things like "n-word privilege". Hell, the wrd "privilege" is right in the phrase in that one!