Fraud in Minnesomalia

[pood]

With all due respect, skin color and gender seem to matter a great deal to you.

Wrong. I think people should be treated equally by law regardless of race and gender.

My point is culture. Somalia has a largely Islamist culture, which means that most Somalis are incompatible with western culture. And yet, our country indiscriminately let a lot of Somalis in.
Or look at Islamists who have taken over cities like Hamtramck and Dearborn in Michigan.

We’ve been down this road before. Your claptrap is insufferable.

My grandmother lived in Hamtramck and my father grew up there. “Islamists” have not taken over Hamtramck or Dearborn. They simply live there for the most part as law-abiding citizens, like most people. There are criminals among them just as among every group, most prominently white men like the convicted felon in the White House. Bizarrely, your first link is an article about how Hamtramck’s Muslim mayor endorsed your hero, Trump. So what are you bitching about?

 

[Derec]

You see, ladies and gentlemen, in Minnesota — and America as a whole — white men do not commit fraud or any other kind of crime

Of course not! But Gov. Knucklehead et al were motivated to look the other way because of whose these fraudsters were.

(well, except for the convicted felon in the White House I suppose).

So let’s clutch our pearls and get out the smelling salts and label all Somali immigrants as “garbage,” cheerled by the piece of garbage in the White House and someone who started a thread called Minnesomalia and then has the unmitigated goddamned gall to ask, “Is everything about skin color with you?”

Trump is as usual going way too far. That does not mean that there is not something very rotten in the State of Minnesota or that our immigration system has been functioning well, especially when it comes to letting in large quantities of poorly vetted mass migrants from places like Somalia.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

So it's just a story.

Way to deliberately misconstrue what is written. You are learning wrong lessons from laughing dog.

If you didn't mean what you wrote, then explain yourself. Don't use ad homs to substitute your thesis. What word did you want to use instead but chose not to do so? Was it "fact?" Why did you deliberately choose not to use that word?

 

[pood]

It is so revealing that someone who denies bigotry or racism blithely speaks of dark-skinned people of a different faith “taking over” an American city. Hamtramck used to be a densely populated Polish enclave. Did immigrant Poles take it over? Or was it OK because thery were white and mostly Catholic? And yet I can assure you that in the 19th and early 20th century Polish immigrants were smeared as Polacks and German immigrants were Krauts and Italians were Dagos and on and on, and Catholicism was discriminated against, a theme of the movie Gangs of New York. Good ol’ Derec knows nothing about anything.

 

[pood]

So Hamtramck has a Muslim mayor. Soon, NYC, where I live, will have one too,

So fucking what?

I will judge Mamdani on his performance, not on his ethnicity, skin color, religious faith or place of birth.

Obviously this is beyond Derec.

 

[pood]

I also was very impressed how Mamdani visited the Orange Turd in the Oval Office and turned him into a fawning little bitch. Mamdani strikes me as a born leader.

 

[bilby]

If close associations mean guilt, we can throw Trump in prison for being bros with Epstein.

We can and should throw someone convicted of 34 felonies in prison on his own accord.

Seriously?

This entire thread is you taking your very tired racist hobbyhorse for a long trot.

This is the pot calling the kettle black on a hitherto unprecedented scale.

 

[bilby]

I think people should be treated equally by law regardless of race and gender.

"Ils y doivent travailler devant la majestueuse égalité des lois, qui interdit au riche comme au pauvre de coucher sous les ponts, de mendier dans les rues et de voler du pain." - Anatole France

Equal treatment in law is not the same thing as fairness, and legality and morality are frequently opposed to each other.

 

[bilby]

And yet, our country indiscriminately let a lot of Somalis in.

US Immigration law does NOT let people in indiscriminately.

The US is a very difficult country to get into legally, and the granting of visas is a highly discriminating program.

Somalis who were "let in" to the US had to demonstrate their eligibility under US law.

Your above-quoted statement is absolutely and completely wrong in fact, and has all the indications of being a deliberate lie. I presume you were duped into believing it by one of the many vocal liars about immigration who have become popular in recent years.

 

[pood]

---

All about modern Hamtramck, from the Detroit Free Press:

And its schools, government and neighborhoods were integrated decades before those of the surrounding communities. The Polish immigrants in the region were initially treated so terribly, Kowalski said, that once they took power, they welcomed everyone else to town — Ukrainians, Albanians, Bosnians and especially Black people.

“We were treated the second worst,” Kowalski said. “The only people considered below us were the Black people. So when they came to Hamtramck, they weren’t treated like they were in other places. That’s why Hamtramck was so welcoming.” The city elected the first Black leaders of the region, hired the first Black police officers and detectives, employed the first Black city workers and teachers.

And:

Still, Hamtramck was better than Bangladesh for the Bengalis who began arriving here in the 1980s and resurrected the city’s worst neighborhoods on the eastern border with Detroit. It was far better than their impoverished homeland for the Yemenis who joined them in droves and boosted the city’s population by more than a quarter in just a decade. And it’s been a lifesaver for the recent wave of Ukrainians and Afghans fleeing their battle-ravaged homelands. Add a smattering of immigrants from dozens of other nationalities who now live here in crowded contrast, and Hamtramck now essentially is — for better or worse — the world in two square miles.

“The dynamics here are really amazing,” Kowalski said. He turned his car down Conant, unofficially renamed Bangladesh Avenue long ago for its profusion of Bengali storefronts. “Look at the people walking. You’ll see turbans, you’ll see babushkas, you’ll see hijabs, everything. This town is exploding, the population is rising, we’re getting everybody here. And let me tell you, it’s wonderful to see. And 99% of the people I encounter are really nice, good, solid people.”

And yes, not everything comports with what I or others would like, but:

“I have total faith in the next generation of young people, and I know the young Muslim kids are going to break out of this conservative bullshit,” the 71-year-old said. “It’ll only be a matter of time. I already see Yemeni kids playing air guitar in the middle of the Hamtramck festival. The Bengali girls are taking American clothes to the high school and changing at school. It was the same thing I did. I was a hippie and my mom and dad would not let me wear bell-bottoms, so I took the bell-bottoms to school and I put them on there. And the Bengali girls are taking their traditional dress clothes off and putting on jeans and a T-shirt.”

Kowalski has heard people criticize the newcomers for being slow to adapt. They used to do that about the Poles a century ago, he said. The first generation usually sticks to its ways. But then, as now, he believes, their kids are the ones who will inevitably bring about that change.

Bold mine.

And:

Hamtramck might be the most conflicted small town in the country. By all accounts, it’s also one of the most civil.

“People are friendly here, even those who we disagree with,” Ghalib said. “I’ve never seen any violent actions from anyone. We can disagree on stuff, but let’s be peaceful.”

And:

“The street where we live, we got white, Black, Yemeni, Bengali; everybody living very peacefully,” said resident Anwar Hassan, 46, the owner of Remas Restaurant, which serves dishes from Yemen, his homeland. “We go to the neighbors, the non-Muslims, and we give them Ramadan dishes. Even, sometimes during holidays, we will give gifts to the kids, like at Christmas. Everybody respects each other at Christmas, at New Year’s. We celebrate, not religiously, but they still celebrate the vibe, the fireworks, the joy. People are being off for a few days and everybody has a good time.”

And:

“In the public arena, people will tear each other apart,” said Charles Sercombe, the last remaining reporter at the town’s last newspaper, the Hamtramck Review. “But in the neighborhoods, everyone usually gets along. It’s a matter of survival. You hear everything — the arguments, the lovemaking, because they’re living on top of each other. You get along with your Bangladeshi neighbor, with your Yemeni neighbors; there’s no clash there. Usually your neighbors are really fascinating to get to know. It’s like an oasis, and that’s what makes the city so charming. Why can’t it be like this everywhere, you know?”

Poor little Derec. So clueless. So bigoted. So insular. So pathetic.

But just look at that St. Florian church! Stood in awe of it so many times as a kid when we were visiting my Polish grandma, who lived and died in Hamtramck.

And so, Derec, the next time you want to pontificate on the “Islamists” who have “taken over” Hamtramck — a place I know you have never been — I suggest you shove your babble straight up your sorry, putrid little ass.

 

[laughing dog]

No one has claimed ALL or even MOST Somalis are involved. Your assumption is most telling.

I did not assume that. You said that Somalis are a relatively small percentage of MN population. I countered that it is telling that Somalis are so prominently involved in MN fraud despite relatively small numbers. That does not imply that they are all involved in fraud, just that they are disproportionately involved in fraud.

Their “prominence” is due solely to the braying of the Trump administration.

Their numbers do not suggest that at all, as I pointed out. 60K out of 5.5 to 5.9 million is too small to be a bloc.

I disagree, but my other point about DFL not wanting to appear racist/xenophobic/islamophobic still stands. That also explains things like Moriarty not wanting to imprison a Somali serial rapist.

Your unfounded suspicions reveal more about you than reality,

That happened last year and the only reason you know about it is Pam Bondi’s carrying Trump’s racist ravings.

The sweetheart deal by Mary Moriarty and her Ilk was last year.
I know about it because the feds taking over the case just happened a few days ago. [

Is serial rapists going to prison bad now because the Trump administration is doing it? Is it "racist" to not exempt Somali serial rapists from prison like your girl Moriarty did?

WTF are you raving about? Moriarty is not my anything. Nor did I even imply sending rapists to prison was bad.

 

[laughing dog]

I hope those hobby horses are well-padded.

Says the Ilk who has to bring Trump into every thread, no matter what it is about.

You’re raving again.

 

[laughing dog]

You see, ladies and gentlemen, in Minnesota — and America as a whole — white men do not commit fraud or any other kind of crime

Of course not! But Gov. Knucklehead et al were motivated to look the other way because of whose these fraudsters were.

That is the unsubstantiated claim. Repetition does not substantiate it.

 

[Toni]

Hiding behind pedantry fools no one.

Unlike you, I am not trying to fool anybody. And the distinction I am making is not pedantic either.

The issue is that Somalia has a culture incompatible with the West. Vast majority of the population are Islamists.
Mass migration from places like that (same goes for, say, Afghanistan more recently) allows for no sufficient vetting and you let a lot of people in who have no business immigrating into the West.

Does that mean all Somalis are incompatible with western culture? Of course not! That would be bigoted (still not racist though) because it generalizes. But our immigration system as it has been run for decades has been letting in a lot of Islamists, criminals and other incompatible mass migrants.
We need to be more selective when it comes to immigration.

How is Somali culture ‘incompatible with the West?’ I’m sincerely interested.

 

[Toni]

You see, ladies and gentlemen, in Minnesota — and America as a whole — white men do not commit fraud or any other kind of crime

Of course not! But Gov. Knucklehead et al were motivated to look the other way because of whose these fraudsters were.

(well, except for the convicted felon in the White House I suppose).

So let’s clutch our pearls and get out the smelling salts and label all Somali immigrants as “garbage,” cheerled by the piece of garbage in the White House and someone who started a thread called Minnesomalia and then has the unmitigated goddamned gall to ask, “Is everything about skin color with you?”

Trump is as usual going way too far. That does not mean that there is not something very rotten in the State of Minnesota or that our immigration system has been functioning well, especially when it comes to letting in large quantities of poorly vetted mass migrants from places like Somalia.

Did you not see my post pointing out that the person behind the massive fraud in Minnesota is a white American woman?

It is not difficult to understand how a fraud program took off in a ( insert type) community, particularly an immigrant minority as people were learning to adapt to a new culture, new language, new social norms while holding onto their culture. Even more so as the Somali diaspora was fleeing civil war and violence. Immigrants are often the target of fraud and wage theft and other crimes because they are not as familiar with the laws and customs.

It just happened that the fraud was brought into this community: mostly poor, mostly heavily impacted by the pandemic without a lot of opportunity to have built any kind of savings to tide them over as unemployment grew. Like most people, they wanted to provide for their families. And like many immigrants, thought of the US as a land filled with lots of money.

Right now, because it suits Trump to thump hard on his twin hobby horses: racism and anti immigration, we know about the fraud in Minnesota—which came out of pandemic relief set up by well known fraudster, Mr. Donald J Trump himself.

As linked above there was a great deal of fraud arising out of the various pandemic relief funds, across this country.

Somalis in Minnesota just serve Trump’s narrative and give him an opportunity to denigrate a political rival who called him weird.

I also believe that this will be used as a pretext to send in ICE and to attempt to deploy military.

 

[laughing dog]

So it's just a story.

Way to deliberately misconstrue what is written. You are learning wrong lessons from laughing dog.

Your literally wrote “the story “. And until someone comes up with evidence to substantiate the allegation, it is a story, no matter how much you wish it true.

 

[TSwizzle]

I just wanted to add some info that I didn’t have before: The person who was executive director of Feeding Our Future in the Minnesota fraud case is a white woman.

She and her co-conspirator were convicted in March of this year.

Her co conspirator just happens to be her Somali boyfriend .

 

[thebeave]

There is a whole, separate thread about the Minnesota fraud. Why are we posting about that in this thread?

 

[Toni]

I just wanted to add some info that I didn’t have before: The person who was executive director of Feeding Our Future in the Minnesota fraud case is a white woman.

She and her co-conspirator were convicted in March of this year.

Her co conspirator just happens to be her Somali boyfriend .

He wasn’t her boyfriend.

 

[Toni]

There is a whole, separate thread about the Minnesota fraud. Why are we posting about that in this thread?

You’re correct. My fault. I meant to post in the Minnesota fraud thread but must have had two threads open.

My apologies. If mods think it is important and not too much trouble, maybe the posts could be moved to the appropriate thread?

Again, apologies.