Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel

[Loren Pechtel]

Do you expect a news organization to not publish such statements?
Sounds like you do not want a news organization, you want a propaganda machine.

I expect them to not just parrot statements made by Hamas uncritically.

I expect news outlets to report what people say, not what their readers and listeners prefer to read and hear.

That would be good. Unfortunately, it has little connection to reality anymore. A news organization that actually did this would alienate too many readers and soon be out of business.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Diplomacy involves Iran, not Hamas.

Exactly--but note that they have never even been willing to talk. That's why there is no diplomatic solution and thus why blaming Israel for not finding a diplomatic solution is nonsense.

 

[Politesse]

Look at the total tonnage of ordnance expended on Gaza, a very small area. Palestinians had no where to go, shooting fish in a barrel. If the bombing campaign was not genocide I do not know what is.

Actually the total tonnage of ordnance dropped is a strong argument against this being a genocide. We have >100,000t of bombs vs. ~70k dead. Less than one dead Gazan (including the combatants) per ton of ordnance dropped. If there had been an attempt to obliterate the population, the death count would have been much, much bigger.
Note also that the age/sex breakdown of fatalities show that the dead are mostly military-aged males.
View attachment 52442
Analysis and graph are my own, using Hamas Health Ministry's list from this September.

Why do you keep presenting unpleasant facts?! You keep saying there is no solution, but there must be a solution. Blame the Jews!

Literally no one has said "blame the Jews" except for you. But it's fascinating how close such a vile sentence is to your lips. Something you want to confess?

 

[pood]

I wonder what will save the next batch of Israeli civilians kidnapped by Gazan militants.
The clear lesson is that violent Muslim supremacists can kidnap civilians and their supporters, like you, will rally to their cause!
Tom

More than 10,800 posts into this thread, not one of them in support of Muslim supremacists, and you can say ^this^ with a straight face?

Really something, ain’t it? TomC and Dr. Zoid’s filthy trash.

 

[pood]

“Blame the Jews.” WOW.

Add Pechtel the to trash heap.

No one is “blaming Jews” for anything. We are opposing what we see as genocidal action by the Israeli government. As we would blame any government, like that of Russia and what it’s doing in Ukraine,

But y’all already knew that.

 

[pood]

Note that a huge number of Jews, inside of Israel and out, have opposed what Netanyahu is doing in Gaza. Are all these Jews anti-Semites too?

It’s so disgusting how creeps play the anti-Semite card when they have no argument.

 

[pood]

In all the time this thread has gone on, since the start of the Gaza war, not one person here — not one — has expressed support for Hamas terrorists, and not one person here has displayed a scintilla of anti-Semitism. Yet we are constantly accused of being pro-Hamas and anti-Jew.

How filthy and vile is that?

 

[Derec]

Actually, I think that is going to be another thing in a couple years, all of the caustic dust that has been inhaled,

I am concerned about that too. I don't think the dust is particularly caustic, but it is certainly toxic, and some of it (such as asbestos) is carcinogenic.

but many of the Gazans are homeless, so I think actions for that problem exists to deal with poorly first,

Improper clearing of the rubble can mobilize the dust again. A lot of Gazans will want to repair their damaged buildings, and they will try to use material from the rubble for that purpose.

and then we can ignore the cancer and other lung related maladies that will be coming up.

That will be a major public health problem. Remember that all the smoke and dust from 9/11 created a lot of health problems. This is similar, only on a much bigger scale.

Trump is proclaiming peace already, much like how he proclaimed the end of the tensions on the Korean peninsula. All he has in his hand is a prologue, at best.

Yes. Return of the hostages is a good thing, as well as more aid entering Gaza, and the open warfare stopping. Many terrorists, including 250 serving life sentences, being released is far less good.
And of course, long term success of the ceasefire will depend entirely on Hamas' willingness to disarm and give up power. And right now, they do not seem very eager to do either.

 

[pood]

And of course, long term success of the ceasefire will depend entirely on Hamas' willingness to disarm and give up power. And right now, they do not seem very eager to do either.

So what was the point of all this carnage?

 

[pood]

Israel, by its actions, has created several new generations of people to attack it. Do people really not understand this?

 

[ZiprHead]

Do you expect a news organization to not publish such statements?
Sounds like you do not want a news organization, you want a propaganda machine.

I expect them to not just parrot statements made by Hamas uncritically.

I expect news outlets to report what people say, not what their readers and listeners prefer to read and hear.

That would be good. Unfortunately, it has little connection to reality anymore. A news organization that actually did this would alienate too many readers and soon be out of business.

So you want journalists to be propagandists for your side but complain up and down when you feel journalists are being propagandists for the other side. And you don't see the double standard.

 

[Derec]

If we are talking diplomacy, why in the heck are you talking about Hamas.

Because they are the de facto government of Gaza, and have been ever since they kicked out PA in 2007 after the Gaza Civil War.

There is no peace with Hamas. Their entire purpose is disruption.

Indeed. That's why it took them two years of losing fighters and commanders to agree to even these very modest concessions.

If Gaza (sans Hamas) signed a peace deal with Israel, Hamas would do everything they could to screw it up... as well as assassinate anyone in Gaza that was involved with that deal.

Indeed.

Diplomacy involves Iran, not Hamas.

But the Tehran regime is also full of fanatics.

 

[pood]

So here is where we are. Both Hamas and Netanyahu’s renegade government (not Jews in general, for you slimy slanderers) are accusing the other of breaking the so-called cease fire.

So where does this go? Not just a week from now or a month from now, but ten years from now? Or 50 years from now?

You try to work it out.

Dumbasses.

Notice too that if the ceasefire should hold for a period of time, and Hamas does not give up power, it means Israel LOST THE WAR.

And if Hamas DOES figuratively give up power, it just means that the next Hamas is being born. Duh. Which is what we were trying to tell you all along,

Dumbasses.

 

[Derec]

Israel, by its actions, has created several new generations of people to attack it. Do people really not understand this?

We understand the claim, but reject it.
Hamas and related groups have, with ample help from UNRWA schools, cultivated hatred against Israel for many years. Those generations would be created even if Israel had not responded to the 10/7 massacre at all.
The only chance to end this in the future is to remove Hamas, thoroughly reform PA, and abolish UNRWA.

 

[pood]

Israel, by its actions, has created several new generations of people to attack it. Do people really not understand this?

We understand the claim, but reject it.
Hamas and related groups have, with ample help from UNRWA schools, cultivated hatred against Israel for many years. Those generations would be created even if Israel had not responded to the 10/7 massacre at all.
The only chance to end this in the future is to remove Hamas, thoroughly reform PA, and abolish UNRWA.

Yeah, enjoy your stupid little fantasy.

 

[pood]

I have already explained what I would have said after Oct. 7, here.

 

[Arctish]

Do you expect a news organization to not publish such statements?
Sounds like you do not want a news organization, you want a propaganda machine.

I expect them to not just parrot statements made by Hamas uncritically.

I expect news outlets to report what people say, not what their readers and listeners prefer to read and hear.

That would be good. Unfortunately, it has little connection to reality anymore. A news organization that actually did this would alienate too many readers and soon be out of business.

So you want journalists to be propagandists for your side but complain up and down when you feel journalists are being propagandists for the other side. And you don't see the double standard.

It's worse than that.

If someone is relying on propagandists for information then factual reporting, no matter how well sourced and documented, will appear to be propaganda for other viewpoints.

If someone is making claims based on propaganda then those claims will be unsupported by actual evidence unless that person is willing to seek out accurate information from better sources.

If someone only wants to read and hear what they already believe to be true then they will inevitably wind up with a very skewed worldview.

 

[Derec]

So here is where we are. Both Hamas and Netanyahu’s renegade government (not Jews in general, for you slimy slanderers) are accusing the other of breaking the so-called cease fire.

It is pretty clear that it was Hamas that broke the ceasefire.

So where does this go? Not just a week from now or a month from now, but ten years from now? Or 50 years from now?

Nowhere good, unless and until Hamas is gone and replaced with a government that actually wants peace. Note, PA has not been great in that regard, as they implemented the "pay for slay" program rewarding killed and imprisoned terrorists, and routinely glorify terrorism.

75 Palestinian Authority schools named after terrorists and Nazi collaborators and honoring Martyrs and Martyrdom
The Palestinian Authority Continues to Teach Hate and to Reward Terror

You try to work it out.
Dumbasses.

Who exactly are you calling "dumbasses here"?

Notice too that if the ceasefire should hold for a period of time, and Hamas does not give up power, it means Israel LOST THE WAR.

Which is why it is imperative that Hamas be disarmed and disempowered no matter what. If they can claim victory in any way, it will be bad for the future, including for ordinary Gazans, because Hamas have stated they intend to repeat 10/7 massacre over and over again until Israel is destroyed.

And if Hamas DOES figuratively give up power, it just means that the next Hamas is being born. Duh. Which is what we were trying to tell you all along,

Unless you think Palestinians are constitutionally incapable of not embracing terrorism and Islamism, that does not follow.
What is needed is a campaign like "denazification" after WWII. But for that, first Hamas needs to be removed from power.
Tolerating Hamas diisplaying power and executing dissidents is counterproductive.

Dumbasses.

The name is Dumass.

 

[pood]

Dumbasses.

Who exactly are you calling "dumbasses here"?

You and your confederacy of dunces,

 

[pood]

RFK has a book of collected speeches titled with a phrase he repeatedly used, “To Seek a Newer World.” On the night he won the California primary In 1968 and effectively wrapped up the Democratic presidential nomination he said that “compassion” would be the theme of his campaign. A few minutes later he was assassinated,

Now we have his asshole son trying to end vaccinations, And assholes defending Netanyahu.

Shoot me now.