When you keep pointing to Israeli actions to explain Hamas you are saying that 10/7 was justified and thus that all the horrors of it were justified.
Now you're being blatantly dishonest.
I have presented no argument that makes the case that the 10/7 terror attack was justified. I have said it was predictable that Hamas would use terrorism in an attempt to force Israel to make changes in policy. I said it was predictable that when Israel supported Hamas in order to weaken the PLO, that decision would eventually bite Israel in the ass. I have said it was predictable that Gazans would resent the State that built and maintains the walls surrounding them, the naval blockade that prevents aid from reaching them, and kills people on the street and children sleeping in their beds with impunity, and that the resentment makes it easier for Hamas to gather recruits.
If 10/7 is entirely because of what Israel did then it's inherently a justified action.
And when you say the response to 10/7 should be to remove the things you blame, you again are indirectly saying it's justified.
You "blame" Hamas but want no consequences, that's not really blame.
I told you long ago that I'm not going to pretend I think you're stupid or a little kid who wandered into a discussion the adults were having. And while I understand you are prone to either-or, black/white, yes/no thinking, you have been discussing issues with people who don't share your mindset long enough for you to at least grasp the concept of "better or worse".
It's not black/white, it's refusing to fall for the deceptions.
The deceptions you say happen but have no evidence actually occur?
Your claims are indistinguishable from paranoia, propaganda, and bullshit. And since you have a history of posting propaganda and bullshit, I'm going with 'not a mental illness, just a mindset' as the reason you make claims you don't even try to support.
There are things that can be done to make a situation better, and things that will make it worse. I believe we should always choose the "make things better" option.
Yes, we should be trying to make things better. The difference is that I look at it from the defense side rather than overall.
IOW, you look at it from one side only, and argue for what benefits your preferred group, not what will benefit everyone.
When you keep pointing to Israeli actions to explain Hamas you are saying that 10/7 was justified and thus that all the horrors of it were justified.
Now you're being blatantly dishonest.
I have presented no argument that makes the case that the 10/7 terror attack was justified. I have said it was predictable that Hamas would use terrorism in an attempt to force Israel to make changes in policy. I said it was predictable that when Israel supported Hamas in order to weaken the PLO, that decision would eventually bite Israel in the ass. I have said it was predictable that Gazans would resent the State that built and maintains the walls surrounding them, the naval blockade that prevents aid from reaching them, and kills people on the street and children sleeping in their beds with impunity, and that the resentment makes it easier for Hamas to gather recruits.
If 10/7 is entirely because of what Israel did then it's inherently a justified action.
And when you say the response to 10/7 should be to remove the things you blame, you again are indirectly saying it's justified.
You "blame" Hamas but want no consequences, that's not really blame.
I told you long ago that I'm not going to pretend I think you're stupid or a little kid who wandered into a discussion the adults were having. And while I understand you are prone to either-or, black/white, yes/no thinking, you have been discussing issues with people who don't share your mindset long enough for you to at least grasp the concept of "better or worse".
It's not black/white, it's refusing to fall for the deceptions.
Remember that time I said the important thing is respecting the human rights of everyone and you responded
"So Jews aren't people?" because to you, respecting the human rights of Palestinians must come at the cost of not respecting the human rights of Jews, and for some reason you think Jews have a Right to permanently remove Palestinians from the parts of Palestine Jews want to be exclusively theirs? That's your either-or, black/white thinking at work.
There are things that can be done to make a situation better, and things that will make it worse. I believe we should always choose the "make things better" option.
Yes, we should be trying to make things better. The difference is that I look at it from the defense side rather than overall.
IOW, you look at it from one side only, and your preferred course of action isn't one that benefits everyone.
By trying to minimize overall deaths you inherently fall for the bad guy killing their people. You are saving Gazan lives now at the cost of Israeli lives down the road--and I do not believe a defender is required to sacrifice their people to spare the attacker.
And here's where you reveal the racism and bigotry inherent in your one-sided argument.
You believe in the inherent evil of certain ethnic and cultural groups. Your condemnation of future Palestinians for crimes against humanity you are certain they will commit is exactly the same kind of thinking behind the slaughter of Tutsi in Rwanda, why Serbs murdered Bosnians and Croats in Srebrenica, and why Nazis killed Jews all over Europe. That's the underpinning of your "dead or fled'" arguments.
I don't share your worldview, especially the part where you judge the worth of a person based on their ancestry or the culture in which they were raised. Fuck that bigoted, racist shit. The life of a Palestinian child is not worth less than that of an Israeli child just because he/she was born on the not-Israel side of the Green Line.
If 10/7 is entirely because of what Israel did (that's a mighty big "if"), the terrorism of 10/7 is not therefore justified. I don't believe terrorism is ever justifiable. It's murder and destruction aimed at the most vulnerable and least culpable members of a society. It makes things worse, usually for people who deserve that "worse" the least.
If it's
entirely then Hamas did nothing wrong and thus it must be justified.
No.
This is an extremely important point, so please pay attention: one party to a conflict doing something heinous does not grant permission to others in that conflict to be just as heinous.
NoHolyCows has been patiently explaining this to you. I hope you learn something from them.
And honestly, Loren, you can take that "[y]ou "blame" Hamas but want no consequences" and stuff it right back up the orifice you pulled it from. Stop lying about my posts and my opinions.
That's not a rebuttal.
You say you blame Hamas but you propose to give them what they are after. And whose demands you think should be followed means a lot more than who you "blame".
Bullshit.
Hamas is not after being removed from power and having their agenda curtailed. It is not after free elections. And since you say Hamas does not like prosperity and I'm all for it for the people of Gaza, I think you're shitposting nonsense that even you don't believe.