Georgia's new guidelines for hair salons

[TSwizzle]

The figures coming from the developed nations are accurate. If a doctor suspects the patient died of COVID 19, then it is very likely an accurate assessment.

This goes back to the died with covid 19 as opposed to died from covid 19. This isn't splitting hairs, it is important. You cannot say for certain that every death attributed to covid-19 was the cause of death. Covid-19 may (or may not) have been a contributing factor, particularly in the very elderly and vulnerable (those with pre-existing health issues) but it cannot be claimed it caused death.

Indirect measures, such as excess death, corroborate and align with those figures.

Indeed, it will be interesting to see the excess death figures. Also, a by product of this lockdown has been deaths at home due to people not going to hospital for various ailments and people deferring consultations with their doctors.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[Jokodo]

Indeed, it will be interesting to see the excess death figures.

The (preliminnary) excess death figures for a lot of places are already in, you just keep ignoring them. Here's the data collected by the European mortality monitoring consortium: https://www.euromomo.eu/ Strange how the countries with extremely high excess mortality are exactly the countries particularly badly hit by COVID-19, isn't it? And we are talking, in some cases, double the expected number of deaths, nationwide.

Also, a by product of this lockdown has been deaths at home due to people not going to hospital for various ailments and people deferring consultations with their doctors.

Indeed. This has been the case everywhere where there was a stringent lockdown - in places that implemented it early enough to avoid a major outbreak, and in those that didn't alike.

If you want to get a rough idea of the number of people that have died due to this factor, you could look at countries like Denmark or Austria - their excess deaths are in the 10% region at most. Even assuming that all of those deaths are due to your factor, and none undetected COVID-19 cases, that still means that of New York's 290% or what-was-it excess deaths, 280% are directly attributable to COVID-19.

 

[Treedbear]

Watching the Governor of Alabama Kay Ivey give a coronavirus update. Encouraged to see that the consensus from the religious community is to follow the CDC's guidelines and not make opening up churches "an event" but rather a process. And after watching many updates from around the country I just realized that sign language can have an accent.

 

[ronburgundy]

Indeed, it will be interesting to see the excess death figures.

The (preliminnary) excess death figures for a lot of places are already in, you just keep ignoring them. Here's the data collected by the European mortality monitoring consortium: https://www.euromomo.eu/ Strange how the countries with extremely high excess mortality are exactly the countries particularly badly hit by COVID-19, isn't it? And we are talking, in some cases, double the expected number of deaths, nationwide.

And that is with lockdowns that massively reduce deaths by other causes including all types of accidents, violent crime, and other contagions besides COVID. Which means if those deaths weren't reduced by the lockdown, the total deaths of normal + Covid would be 3 times than normal w/o Covid.

Plus that doesn't even factor in that the COVID deaths are 1/10th (or much less) what they would have been w/o a lockdown. Sweden's deaths per capita is 10 times Finland, with the difference being no lockdown in Sweden. And Sweden's low pop density means that no lockdown was likely less harmful than it would be in more populated countries. So, countries like the US would be seeing at least 30 times (3 X 10) the deaths over normal if we hadn't had a lockdown.

Also, a by product of this lockdown has been deaths at home due to people not going to hospital for various ailments and people deferring consultations with their doctors.

Indeed. This has been the case everywhere where there was a stringent lockdown - in places that implemented it early enough to avoid a major outbreak, and in those that didn't alike.

If you want to get a rough idea of the number of people that have died due to this factor, you could look at countries like Denmark or Austria - their excess deaths are in the 10% region at most. Even assuming that all of those deaths are due to your factor, and none undetected COVID-19 cases, that still means that of New York's 290% or what-was-it excess deaths, 280% are directly attributable to COVID-19.

In addition to your good points, many of the "at home" deaths are actually people with COVID who wouldn't be hospitalized w/o a lockdown either, because they are young, healthy, and/or have mild symptoms. But b/c COVID 19 so unlike the normal flu, some of these folks are dying suddenly within hours from unusual and not understood complications like blood clots causing strokes and heart attacks in healthy 30 year olds.

As for many non-COVID cases not going to the hospital and thus leading to slow emergency rooms, that is generally a good thing. It's mostly b/c lockdowns cause a massive decline in all types of death. That's their purpose and they work. Then, as every ER nurse will attest, as good % of ER patients don't belong in the ER or hospital in the first place. People show up with minor injuries that don't require ER or often any professional medical treatment at all. Many of them wind up getting a more serious illness by going to the hospital. So, while the millionaire executives at hospitals don't like their loss in profits, lower than typical ER traffic is a generally positive thing indicating better health outcomes. And while furlough's for wage earners at hospitals (such as lab and imaging techs, receptionists, janitors, etc.) is unfortunate, but its in the same category as the non-medical economic effects.

 

[southernhybrid]

https://www.ajc.com/news/state--regional-govt--politics/poll-georgians-back-shelter-place-oppose-rollback-restrictions/I1UrChsuYwyd4BOnqSnEiL/

And roughly 62% of Georgia voters disapprove of Kemp’s decision to ease restrictions on restaurants, theaters and close-contact businesses such as barbershops and nail salons over the past week, a measure that was strongly criticized by Democratic leaders, prominent local mayors and President Donald Trump.

Maybe Kemp should have waited a few more weeks. It certainly isn't helping him politically and COVID-19 cases are still rising.

All of the government offices in my small city, about 40 miles south of ATL, are still closed. I get we need to be concerned about the economic fallout of businesses remaining closed, but somehow it seems a bit ironic that the government offices remain closed, and Kemp once again, put off our primary election until the second week of June. We still have two Senate positions to vote for as well as quite a few local positions, but voting can wait, while haircuts can't. Just sayin'.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

However, I am very skeptical of how deaths are being recorded during this current pandemic. Too many deaths are being attributed as death by covid 19 when it really isn't.

Bullshit. This is a claim you keep repeating that you've invented whole cloth. That isn't what's occurring. The death numbers are almost certainly significantly accurate, and are as likely under-counting as over-counting.

I don't think he's inventing it--this seems to be a right wing deception that he's fallen for.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The figures coming from the developed nations are accurate. If a doctor suspects the patient died of COVID 19, then it is very likely an accurate assessment.

This goes back to the died with covid 19 as opposed to died from covid 19. This isn't splitting hairs, it is important. You cannot say for certain that every death attributed to covid-19 was the cause of death. Covid-19 may (or may not) have been a contributing factor, particularly in the very elderly and vulnerable (those with pre-existing health issues) but it cannot be claimed it caused death.

Indirect measures, such as excess death, corroborate and align with those figures.

Indeed, it will be interesting to see the excess death figures. Also, a by product of this lockdown has been deaths at home due to people not going to hospital for various ailments and people deferring consultations with their doctors.

We rarely have certainty in cause of death other than in suspected criminal matters and even then it's by no means 100%.

Note that all of the conditions which make one at higher risk for Covid-19 are slow things, it's unlikely you died from them while infected. While there no doubt are a few misattributed deaths there are far more that aren't being counted because they never were diagnosed in the first place.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

https://www.ajc.com/news/state--regional-govt--politics/poll-georgians-back-shelter-place-oppose-rollback-restrictions/I1UrChsuYwyd4BOnqSnEiL/

And roughly 62% of Georgia voters disapprove of Kemp’s decision to ease restrictions on restaurants, theaters and close-contact businesses such as barbershops and nail salons over the past week, a measure that was strongly criticized by Democratic leaders, prominent local mayors and President Donald Trump.

Maybe Kemp should have waited a few more weeks. It certainly isn't helping him politically and COVID-19 cases are still rising.

All of the government offices in my small city, about 40 miles south of ATL, are still closed. I get we need to be concerned about the economic fallout of businesses remaining closed, but somehow it seems a bit ironic that the government offices remain closed, and Kemp once again, put off our primary election until the second week of June. We still have two Senate positions to vote for as well as quite a few local positions, but voting can wait, while haircuts can't. Just sayin'.

He’s doing what you’d do if you wanted to prevent November elections.

 

[SimpleDon]

I am cleaning out my Sublime Text files of posts that for various reasons that I didn't post.

I have been watching the BBC while I was writing the above post #76.

It has reminded me that we can never consider ourselves to be safe until the disease is under some kind of control around the world. This is yet another fact that I am sure that Trump is not going to embrace. He puts a great deal of faith in the US's ability to wall ourselves off from the world's problems. That his attempts to do so far haven't been very effective hasn't dimmed his enthusiasm for building walls and closing borders.

But the problems from the worldwide pandemic pale in comparison to the economic problems caused by the cure for the virus, the shutdown of the worldwide economy. The US's governing conservative/libertarian economics of free markets and free trade, the dependence on profit as the sole determinate for the economy, their rejection of government, their reverence for the the large banks and the the rest of the financial sector, and their dependence on satisfying the greed of the 1% at the costs of the 99% has poorly equipped it as a guide to recover from the COVID-19 depression.

I am not sure that Biden has the needed economics to do it either, he is a charter member of the neoliberal Washington Consensus of Austerians and his campaign manager is a health insurance and drug company lobbyist, but I am sure that he would be much, much better than Trump.

It also reminded me of how much the rest of the world has stopped looking to the US for leadership in the age of Trump.

The WHO is warning that there is no reason to believe that survivors of the disease have immunity to re-infection. Some antibody tests are fooled by antibodies for other corona viruses. This makes them worse than useless.

The insurance companies in the UK have refused to pay claims for business interruption coverage, even those that specifically mention coverage for "contagion." The insurance companies say that they could never insure for a pandemic like we have now.