Growing Up with a Black Cop

[Loren Pechtel]

One thing for sure is the police requires the assistance of the community at large to get their job done. When you break trust by not holding officers accountable for their mistakes (deliberate or not) the community becomes afraid to and/or flat out reluctant to assist. The lack of trust makes any police force (no matter what kind of fancy name you give it) ineffective.

You realize the primary driver of crime is the drug war?

Other than the obvious that both the police and community wants them gone; what does that have to do with the relationship between the police and the community they serve?

Maybe a drug truce would help create a climate of cooperation?
Just a thought.

Exactly. Ending the drug war would remove much of the driving force that's causing conflict between the police and the community.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

One thing for sure is the police requires the assistance of the community at large to get their job done. When you break trust by not holding officers accountable for their mistakes (deliberate or not) the community becomes afraid to and/or flat out reluctant to assist. The lack of trust makes any police force (no matter what kind of fancy name you give it) ineffective.

You realize the primary driver of crime is the drug war?

the primary driver of crime is poverty.

Poverty--as in the mental state, not as in a lack of money.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

the primary driver of crime is poverty

No. Crime causes poverty. It makes stores close or put up iron bars. Business investment tanks. People avoid public areas. Those who can leave, leave. Home values fall. The more public policy permits crime to fester, the more crime you get. Crime dropped during the Depression and Great Recession

Stop intentionally fooling yourself. Crime feeds off poverty. There's a reason neither the crack nor opioid epidemic effects wealthy neighborhoods as much as it does those in poverty. Just say what you really want to say out loud and cut the crap. Black people are crime and everywhere we go we bring crime with us and in turn bring poverty. Stop being a pussy and just say it.

No. The reason neither crack nor opioids effect wealthy neighborhoods much is that it's not the drugs that cause most of the problem. Rather, it's the crime caused by the need to get money to feed the addiction. (This is also why crack is considered a far bigger problem that cocaine despite being a derivative of it.) There's also the issue that as people fall down the economic ladder they move to lower cost areas--I'm reminded of a neighborhood in the city I grew up in where a local rag kept making a big issue about a cancer cluster. Health department: Yup, there's a lot of cancer there, but there's not a lot of cancer diagnosis there. Cancer is expensive, people are moving there after coming down with cancer. The rag kept at it, last I knew it was a neighborhood you shouldn't set foot in even in daylight.

 

[TomC]

That's not obvious at all.

The reason why it is not obvious to you is because you believe everyone in the community welcomes drugs and crime. You believe they are all bad people. Right right? Just say it.

Stop being such a racist.

Why are there drugs and alcohol, and all the associated problems, in a community if nobody in the community wants them?

Enough people in the community do want them to create a problem. That's the bottom line.
And you know it as well as I do.
Tom

 

[AthenaAwakened]

That's not obvious at all.

The reason why it is not obvious to you is because you believe everyone in the community welcomes drugs and crime. You believe they are all bad people. Right right? Just say it.

Stop being such a racist.

Why are there drugs and alcohol, and all the associated problems, in a community if nobody in the community wants them?

Enough people in the community do want them to create a problem. That's the bottom line.
And you know it as well as I do.
Tom

Have you ever wondered why people want drugs and alcohol?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Other than the obvious that both the police and community wants them gone; what does that have to do with the relationship between the police and the community they serve?

That's not obvious at all.

If nobody in the community wanted the drugs, there wouldn't be any. Enough people do to keep the problem going.

And for cops, it's kinda like a job security issue. Not only the actual "war on drugs". Also all the related crimes, like robbery and burglary and DUI and such. If everyone stopped abusing alcohol and other drugs we could eliminate 75% of the police force. Put more effort into "the war on corporate malfeasance" and "political corruption" and such.
Tom

I've seen the number of 50% for simply getting rid of the drug war, no other changes.

 

[TomC]

Have you ever wondered why people want drugs and alcohol?

I have a long and checkered past.

I don't wonder why. Been there, done that...

Sex and drugs...
Racism and queerphobia...

Immigration and police...

Non-theist in a hardcore Christian world...

Yes, I have wondered why people are as they are and do what they do. But they do, I know it, I've seen it happening in real time.
Tom

 

[Gospel]

That's not obvious at all.

The reason why it is not obvious to you is because you believe everyone in the community welcomes drugs and crime. You believe they are all bad people. Right right? Just say it.

Stop being such a racist.

Why are there drugs and alcohol, and all the associated problems, in a community if nobody in the community wants them?

Enough people in the community do want them to create a problem. That's the bottom line.
And you know it as well as I do.
Tom

Bullshit. Where's the data to support that claim? You do know that there are a lot more people who do nothing about the drug problem than there are people involved in them. Oh but let me guess, I ought to kneel to your gut feeling God and take your word for it.

 

[TomC]

Where's the data to support that claim

What claim?
Humans are idiots?

I ought to kneel to your gut feeling God and take your word for it.

What God?

The god I believe in doesn't even notice that you exist. Me either.
It doesn't know anything, god isn't sentient.

What are you talking about?
Nothing to do with me.
Tom

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

One thing for sure is the police requires the assistance of the community at large to get their job done. When you break trust by not holding officers accountable for their mistakes (deliberate or not) the community becomes afraid to and/or flat out reluctant to assist. The lack of trust makes any police force (no matter what kind of fancy name you give it) ineffective.

You realize the primary driver of crime is the drug war?

the primary driver of crime is poverty.

Poverty--as in the mental state, not as in a lack of money.

Poverty, as in the abandonment of the banks from investing in those areas so that they could help fund the unbuilt suburbs.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

That's not obvious at all.

The reason why it is not obvious to you is because you believe everyone in the community welcomes drugs and crime. You believe they are all bad people. Right right? Just say it.

Stop being such a racist.

Why are there drugs and alcohol, and all the associated problems, in a community if nobody in the community wants them?

Enough people in the community do want them to create a problem. That's the bottom line.
And you know it as well as I do.
Tom

Bullshit. Where's the data to support that claim? You do know that there are a lot more people who do nothing about the drug problem than there are people involved in them. Oh but let me guess, I ought to kneel to your gut feeling God and take your word for it.

I think the idea of saying the black community wants drugs would be a bit off, as nearly the entire nation loves alcohol and a decent percentage want varying levels of drugs.

 

[TomC]

I think the idea of saying the black community wants drugs would be a bit off,

Who said that?
Tom

 

[Gospel]

What claim?

If nobody in the community wanted the drugs, there wouldn't be any. Enough people do to keep the problem going.

Hmm. I guess this depends on what you mean by community. To me a community is more than just living in the same place but also having things in common. Similar to what it means to be American other than simply residing within its boarders. But I guess because I'm brown I'm supposed to considered criminals members of my community and vanish into obscurity so that only criminals have a voice in my community. Ya know, because we are one and the same and all so I get it.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Have you ever wondered why people want drugs and alcohol?

I have a long and checkered past.

I don't wonder why. Been there, done that...

Sex and drugs...
Racism and queerphobia...

Immigration and police...

Non-theist in a hardcore Christian world...

Yes, I have wondered why people are as they are and do what they do. But they do, I know it, I've seen it happening in real time.
Tom

Well, if you know the there are reasons people engage in destructive behavior, wouldn't removing those reasons be the most efficient way to remove the behavior for most people? Wouldn't those reasons be the real problem?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I think the idea of saying the black community wants drugs would be a bit off,

Who said that?
Tom

I did... it is in the quote box.

I think the idea of saying the black community wants drugs would be a bit off,

Right above the quoted text.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Well, if you know the there are reasons people engage in destructive behavior, wouldn't removing those reasons be the most efficient way to remove the behavior for most people? Wouldn't those reasons be the real problem?

Drug and alcohol abuse knows no demographic boundaries. Some people seem to be more at risk of such behaviors, it appears to be a behavior that can be passed on genetically. So to remove the reasons for engaging in such behavior would require taking the psychotic out of the primate. Human brains are just poorly designed.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Well, if you know the there are reasons people engage in destructive behavior, wouldn't removing those reasons be the most efficient way to remove the behavior for most people? Wouldn't those reasons be the real problem?

Drug and alcohol abuse knows no demographic boundaries. Some people seem to be more at risk of such behaviors, it appears to be a behavior that can be passed on genetically. So to remove the reasons for engaging in such behavior would require taking the psychotic out of the primate. Human brains are just poorly designed.

Im not proposing a magic bullet and if I was not clear, I apologize.

Substance abuse has many parents, not the least of which can be actual parents.

However, if we as a society can supply the needs outlined on the first two levels of the infamous Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs, we could possibly if not probably make life for many less needy of escape.

 

[Jarhyn]

Well, if you know the there are reasons people engage in destructive behavior, wouldn't removing those reasons be the most efficient way to remove the behavior for most people? Wouldn't those reasons be the real problem?

Drug and alcohol abuse knows no demographic boundaries. Some people seem to be more at risk of such behaviors, it appears to be a behavior that can be passed on genetically. So to remove the reasons for engaging in such behavior would require taking the psychotic out of the primate. Human brains are just poorly designed.

Im not proposing a magic bullet and if I was not clear, I apologize.

Substance abuse has many parents, not the least of which can be actual parents.

However, if we as a society can supply the needs outlined on the first two levels of the infamous Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs, we could possibly if not probably make life for many less needy of escape.

Drugs are expensive, but cheaper than not-drugs for the enjoyment they provide, and they can be enjoyed even when someone is in abjectly shitty climes.

Going for a nice walk in the park when you have a home is nice, still.

Playing a video game in your safe, clean room when you have a job is fun.

Going for a walk when you are homeless is just another opportunity to mull over the fact you don't have a home.

Playing a video game when you are unemployed or even homeless just feels garbo.

Drugs?

Those always feel good.

Most entertainments aren't entertaining when you are circling the drain without a home.

The only thing that actually helps at that point is drugs, and that doesn't help either, it's just an escape from the suck at a deep cost.

 

[Gospel]

What claim?

If nobody in the community wanted the drugs, there wouldn't be any. Enough people do to keep the problem going.

Hmm. I guess this depends on what you mean by community. To me a community is more than just living in the same place but also having things in common. Similar to what it means to be American other than simply residing within its boarders. But I guess because I'm brown I'm supposed to consider criminals members of my community and vanish into obscurity so that only criminals have a voice in my community. Ya know, because we are one and the same and all so I get it.

 

[Gospel]

Another fantastic fantasy I'm tired of folks banging on about is the delusional idea that black people are more involved in illegal drug use and sales than white people. That is complete rubbish. What's happening and has been happening for ages now is the concentration of police funding and engagement in predominantly black communities.