Has Biden Lost His Mind?

[southernhybrid]

I'm not impressed with Pete either. I think he's the opposite of the old guys. He's was the mayor of a very small city, for Pete's sake. I know he has supporters but I've not yet met one personally. My sister told me she thinks he's a "real asshole" and none of my friends like him. I think he might be good if he'd get a lot more experience. He might be good in a cabinet position, but he really has a long way to go, imo. Plus, during this extremely difficult time in our country, we need someone with far more experienced. I would prefer Warren or Klobuchar to any of these men. My original choice was Cory Booker, but only one of my black friends would even consider him. The two women aren't getting very far, so I guess we are stuck with the choice of three old guys. "What a revolting development this is"! Anyone else old enough to remember the 1950s tv show where I stole that line from? . ( always like to add some levity to political threads )

 

[Toni]

I'm not impressed with Pete either. I think he's the opposite of the old guys. He's was the mayor of a very small city, for Pete's sake. I know he has supporters but I've not yet met one personally. My sister told me she thinks he's a "real asshole" and none of my friends like him. I think he might be good if he'd get a lot more experience. He might be good in a cabinet position, but he really has a long way to go, imo. Plus, during this extremely difficult time in our country, we need someone with far more experienced. I would prefer Warren or Klobuchar to any of these men. My original choice was Cory Booker, but only one of my black friends would even consider him. The two women aren't getting very far, so I guess we are stuck with the choice of three old guys. "What a revolting development this is"! Anyone else old enough to remember the 1950s tv show where I stole that line from? . ( always like to add some levity to political threads )

I wouldn’t count out Warren for sure. Klobuchar has always been a longer shot. I also really liked Booker. From what I’ve read, the general feeling among older black voters is that we need an established white guy to beat Trump.

 

[Derec]

I wouldn’t count out Warren for sure.

Barring another Bernie heart attack, what is her path? She placed 3rd or lower in all three states that have voted so far, won zero delegates in Nevada and is unlikely to do even third in SC. Then comes Super Tuesday where she will probably win Massachusetts because she is the favorite daughter, but is not likely to do well anywhere else. And then?

Klobuchar has always been a longer shot.

On paper is a good candidate. But she failed to translate that into actual votes.

 

[Derec]

I'm not impressed with Pete either. I think he's the opposite of the old guys. He's was the mayor of a very small city, for Pete's sake.

I would not call 100k population "very small". He was the mayor of a medium sized city.

I would prefer Warren or Klobuchar to any of these men.

What a surprise that both you and Toni prefer two very different women.

My original choice was Cory Booker

What was great about him? He was kind of bleh throughout the process.

 

[Derec]

I am less and less impressed by Pete the more I hear him or read anything attributed to his writing. Part of that is that his speech patterns irritate me personally but that's not a big deal. I do think he's much closer to Republican than Democrat and that he lacks experience crucial to being any good as POTUS.

Why do you think he is close to being a Republican? And yes, he is quite inexperienced. More experienced than the current office holder and not that much less experienced than Obama was in 2008.

 

[Derec]

That's absolutely true. However, all 3 of the old white men running are in an age category with health problems that make their ability to carry out the duties as POTUS seriously questionable.

Old white (~99.9%) woman Warren is in that category too.

If you want to vote for a progressive, vote Warren.

If you want to vote for a moderate, vote Klobuchar.

Surprise, surprise, you only pick women. Both of them have fared horribly so far in the race. I know you viscerally dislike Buttigieg, but he has done much better than both of them.
And again, Warren is old too.

 

[Derec]

Biden will lose South Carolina and the primary will be over at that point, this is excellent news

Him narrowly winning SC might be the best thing to happen to Bernie. That way the moderate vote is still split.
But if Biden loses his firewall state, then the moderates/DNC will start circling the wagons around Bloomberg, with the hope hat he will be the Bernie slayer.

 

[Treedbear]

...
I would not call 100k population "very small". He was the mayor of a medium sized city.
...

I live in a city of 90,000 and the scope of mayor's responsibilities are trivial compared to what it takes to run a country.

 

[Treedbear]

I'm not impressed with Pete either. I think he's the opposite of the old guys. He's was the mayor of a very small city, for Pete's sake. I know he has supporters but I've not yet met one personally. My sister told me she thinks he's a "real asshole" and none of my friends like him. I think he might be good if he'd get a lot more experience. He might be good in a cabinet position, but he really has a long way to go, imo. Plus, during this extremely difficult time in our country, we need someone with far more experienced. I would prefer Warren or Klobuchar to any of these men. My original choice was Cory Booker, but only one of my black friends would even consider him. The two women aren't getting very far, so I guess we are stuck with the choice of three old guys. "What a revolting development this is"! Anyone else old enough to remember the 1950s tv show where I stole that line from? . ( always like to add some levity to political threads )

I wouldn’t count out Warren for sure. Klobuchar has always been a longer shot. I also really liked Booker. From what I’ve read, the general feeling among older black voters is that we need an established white guy to beat Trump.

I like Warren too as she has an incredible amount of energy, enthusiasm, drive, and perspicacity. When Bernie had his heart attack I change my support over to her. But when Bernie bounced back so vigorously it suprized everyone, me included. I think Warren's policies are almost identical to Sander's, but she doesn't have the authenticity of Sanders that is so necessary to win the general election.

 

[Toni]

That's absolutely true. However, all 3 of the old white men running are in an age category with health problems that make their ability to carry out the duties as POTUS seriously questionable.

Old white (~99.9%) woman Warren is in that category too.

Warren is younger by enough years that it matters. She also has not had any coronary events or ministrokes. And yes, she's female. She has a better life expectancy, statistically speaking. As I've written before, I do wish she were younger. Her age is a concern but not as big as the age/health concerns re: Biden, Bloomberg and Bernie.

Surprise, surprise, you only pick women. Both of them have fared horribly so far in the race. I know you viscerally dislike Buttigieg, but he has done much better than both of them.
And again, Warren is old too.

I don't think that Buttigieg has the experience or the chops to serve as POTUS. He hasn't held a national office and whatever you may think, South Bend is much more a small city than a medium sized one--it barely squeaks by on the population cut off to be called medium sized by anybody.

I also don't think he can beat Trump.

I don't choose which candidates I like by gender.

 

[Toni]

I'm not impressed with Pete either. I think he's the opposite of the old guys. He's was the mayor of a very small city, for Pete's sake. I know he has supporters but I've not yet met one personally. My sister told me she thinks he's a "real asshole" and none of my friends like him. I think he might be good if he'd get a lot more experience. He might be good in a cabinet position, but he really has a long way to go, imo. Plus, during this extremely difficult time in our country, we need someone with far more experienced. I would prefer Warren or Klobuchar to any of these men. My original choice was Cory Booker, but only one of my black friends would even consider him. The two women aren't getting very far, so I guess we are stuck with the choice of three old guys. "What a revolting development this is"! Anyone else old enough to remember the 1950s tv show where I stole that line from? . ( always like to add some levity to political threads )

I wouldn’t count out Warren for sure. Klobuchar has always been a longer shot. I also really liked Booker. From what I’ve read, the general feeling among older black voters is that we need an established white guy to beat Trump.

I like Warren too as she has an incredible amount of energy, enthusiasm, drive, and perspicacity. When Bernie had his heart attack I change my support over to her. But when Bernie bounced back so vigorously it suprized everyone, me included. I think Warren's policies are almost identical to Sander's, but she doesn't have the authenticity of Sanders that is so necessary to win the general election.

I see nothing authentic about Sanders unless you count cranky old white guy as something to be authentic about. Viscerally, I dislike him. More importantly, there is nothing about him that suggests that he could win and if he did win, that he could actually accomplish..anything except setting the stage for another GOP win in the 2024 POTUS race.

I've checked to see mean survival rates for people in his age group who have survived an MI and who have a stent placed: 3.1 years. Those are not people who work in such a highly stressful environment as POTUS. Even if I loved Sanders, I would not like his chances at surviving a full term.

Moreover, I've seen two elderly POTUS and neither fared well. Reagan's Alzheimer's was easily observable before the end of his first term. He was just better covered for and there was no internet or twitter account for him. I also don't think he was a terrible human being. Flawed as we all are: yes. A terrible president? Yes.

And then we have Trump who surely would be removed if there were a more palatable replacement than Pence (or Pelosi if Pence goes down in scandal as he well could.)

 

[Treedbear]

... I think Warren's policies are almost identical to Sander's, but she doesn't have the authenticity of Sanders that is so necessary to win the general election.

I see nothing authentic about Sanders unless you count cranky old white guy as something to be authentic about. ...

From the polls I've seen during the previous election and the broad support he has across the nation there's got to be a lot of people who do think he's authentic. That is, after all, why the other side voted for Trump and why people on both sides didn't vote for Hillary. I'm not happy about that, but Sanders certainly comes across as honest and authentic.

 

[Toni]

... I think Warren's policies are almost identical to Sander's, but she doesn't have the authenticity of Sanders that is so necessary to win the general election.

I see nothing authentic about Sanders unless you count cranky old white guy as something to be authentic about. ...

From the polls I've seen during the previous election and the broad support he has across the nation there's got to be a lot of people who do think he's authentic. That is, after all, why the other side voted for Trump and why people on both sides didn't vote for Hillary. I'm not happy about that, but Sanders certainly comes across as honest and authentic.

He doesn’t seem either authentic or honest to me. He seems much more concerned with his own POV than anything else. He seems uninterested or capable of building coalitions or crossing divides.

 

[barbos]

Old age crankiness implies authenticity. Why would anybody fake crankiness?
Sanders truly believes what he says.

 

[Derec]

He doesn’t seem either authentic or honest to me. He seems much more concerned with his own POV than anything else.

That's basically what authenticity means. He is being himself, and is not forever trying to pander like Warren for example.

He seems uninterested or capable of building coalitions or crossing divides.

That is an issue separate from authenticity or honesty.

 

[Derec]

I see nothing authentic about Sanders unless you count cranky old white guy as something to be authentic about.

Well he is an old white, may I add Jewish, guy and he is not pretending to be anything else. And what's wrong with being white and male? Or old for that matter?

Viscerally, I dislike him.

Yeah, we get that. You don't like white men.

More importantly, there is nothing about him that suggests that he could win and if he did win, that he could actually accomplish..anything except setting the stage for another GOP win in the 2024 POTUS race.

I dislike many of his policies. I especially dislike him embracing more "woke" and anti-Israel brand of progressivism since 2016. So if he wins I would be glad if he fails to implement the more controversial parts of his agenda.

I've checked to see mean survival rates for people in his age group who have survived an MI and who have a stent placed: 3.1 years. Those are not people who work in such a highly stressful environment as POTUS. Even if I loved Sanders, I would not like his chances at surviving a full term.

That is a legitimate concern. Makes Veep choice especially important. But he seems quite energetic. And your precious Warren could have a fatal or incapacitating health issue herself in the next 3 years. After all, she is elderly as well.

 

[Derec]

Warren is younger by enough years that it matters.

Just how much would it matter though? She would still be the oldest president at 1st inauguration by a year.

She also has not had any coronary events or ministrokes.

That we know of at least. Doesn't mean she could not suffer a debilitating stroke in a year say. Or really start to decline mentally in the next few years.

And yes, she's female. She has a better life expectancy, statistically speaking.

By a little bit, yes.

As I've written before, I do wish she were younger. Her age is a concern but not as big as the age/health concerns re: Biden, Bloomberg and Bernie.

On the other hand, these three have a path to victory. Warren doesn't really have a path.

I don't think that Buttigieg has the experience or the chops to serve as POTUS. He hasn't held a national office and whatever you may think, South Bend is much more a small city than a medium sized one--it barely squeaks by on the population cut off to be called medium sized by anybody.

I do not think bickering about these definitions brings much. I do think calling SB a "very small" city is an effort to be dismissive of Buttigieg more than anything else, especially when those same people think that somebody like Stacey Abrams, who was a state rep from a legislative district almost half that size, is somehow more qualified.
He was also a naval officer. But yes, he is relatively inexperienced. Too bad all the moderate governors like Bullock and Hickenlooper dropped out early. I think would make a great Veep.
How about a mayoral ticket? Bloomberg-Buttigieg. Mike and Pete. They would win in a landslide. Pete would certainly wipe the floor with Pence in the Veep debate!

I also don't think he can beat Trump.

I think he could. I think Klobuchar could do it too. I am not so sure about Warren.

I don't choose which candidates I like by gender.

Sure Jen.

 

[Xoxarle1]

I'm puzzled by Sander's rise, I figured his health scare would doom his candidacy, but he's defying the odds. My bet early on was for Warren to win, even recently she's excelled in debates, so I'm not sure I understand her fall either, but it appears to coincide with her publishing detailed plans for healthcare reform, which makes it even odder, considering this is the #1 issue to most voters.

I expected the South to doom Sanders like it did in 2016, with black voters preferring the establishment candidate again, with deep ties to the local party machine, but recent polls show Sanders narrowing the gap in SC and even drawing level in NC. He's well ahead in CA, and narrowly ahead in TX, and emerged mostly unscathed from tonight's debate. Next Tuesday could see him with a daunting lead in the delegate count.

Somehow, Sanders base is undiminished in its energy and support, he has a powerful small donor fundraising machine, he's successfully reaching out to Latino and young Black voters, and even matched Biden for moderates in Nevada.

I'm guessing here, but perhaps the AOC endorsement, more careful and wary coverage from the MSM, along with the obvious advantage of a crowded field, and a foil in Bloomberg (surely Sander's wet dream of an opponent) is moving the dial for him. Sanders is not Teflon himself, look at how he walked into that Cuba trap from 60 Minutes, but I'm thinking the issues he's running on are Teflon. How else to account for how his 6 opponents on stage with him for 2 hours tonight couldn't land a single knockout punch?

 

[J842P]

I'm puzzled by Sander's rise, I figured his health scare would doom his candidacy, but he's defying the odds. My bet early on was for Warren to win, even recently she's excelled in debates, so I'm not sure I understand her fall either, but it appears to coincide with her publishing detailed plans for healthcare reform, which makes it even odder, considering this is the #1 issue to most voters.

I expected the South to doom Sanders like it did in 2016, with black voters preferring the establishment candidate again, with deep ties to the local party machine, but recent polls show Sanders narrowing the gap in SC and even drawing level in NC. He's well ahead in CA, and narrowly ahead in TX, and emerged mostly unscathed from tonight's debate. Next Tuesday could see him with a daunting lead in the delegate count.

Somehow, Sanders base is undiminished in its energy and support, he has a powerful small donor fundraising machine, he's successfully reaching out to Latino and young Black voters, and even matched Biden for moderates in Nevada.

I'm guessing here, but perhaps the AOC endorsement, more careful and wary coverage from the MSM, along with the obvious advantage of a crowded field, and a foil in Bloomberg (surely Sander's wet dream of an opponent) is moving the dial for him. Sanders is not Teflon himself, look at how he walked into that Cuba trap from 60 Minutes, but I'm thinking the issues he's running on are Teflon. How else to account for how his 6 opponents on stage with him for 2 hours tonight couldn't land a single knockout punch?

yeah, who could have imagined that running on a popular platform that would directly help the majority of votes would be effective?

 

[J842P]

I'm puzzled by Sander's rise, I figured his health scare would doom his candidacy, but he's defying the odds. My bet early on was for Warren to win, even recently she's excelled in debates, so I'm not sure I understand her fall either, but it appears to coincide with her publishing detailed plans for healthcare reform, which makes it even odder, considering this is the #1 issue to most voters.

I expected the South to doom Sanders like it did in 2016, with black voters preferring the establishment candidate again, with deep ties to the local party machine, but recent polls show Sanders narrowing the gap in SC and even drawing level in NC. He's well ahead in CA, and narrowly ahead in TX, and emerged mostly unscathed from tonight's debate. Next Tuesday could see him with a daunting lead in the delegate count.

Somehow, Sanders base is undiminished in its energy and support, he has a powerful small donor fundraising machine, he's successfully reaching out to Latino and young Black voters, and even matched Biden for moderates in Nevada.

I'm guessing here, but perhaps the AOC endorsement, more careful and wary coverage from the MSM, along with the obvious advantage of a crowded field, and a foil in Bloomberg (surely Sander's wet dream of an opponent) is moving the dial for him. Sanders is not Teflon himself, look at how he walked into that Cuba trap from 60 Minutes, but I'm thinking the issues he's running on are Teflon. How else to account for how his 6 opponents on stage with him for 2 hours tonight couldn't land a single knockout punch?

Yeah, who could have imagined that running on a popular platform that would directly help the majority of votes would be effective?

Anyway, I don't think AOC's endorsement explains much, not because I don't think it's significant, but because, well, AOC has always been in the Bernie camp. She got her start in politics working as an organizer for his 2016 campaign. People who like AOC already liked Bernie.