How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Harry Bosch]

Russia is at it again:

Russia planning massive military offensive against Ukraine involving 175,000 troops, U.S. intelligence warns

I don't think that severe economic consequences are going to deter Russia. I know that the west has been helping Ukraine up it's defensive capability. It will be painful for Russia to invade. Perhaps invasion could be prevented if Nato moved troops directly into Ukraine. But that seems like just temping WW3.

Another option is to have the shut Russia from the Belgium-based SWIFT system of financial payments that moves money among thousands of banks around the world. This would hurt Russia great. It could cut them off half their oil export revenue and a third of their foreign trade. I've seen it reported that
Russia depends on its oil and natural gas exports for more than one-third of its federal revenues, and depends on SWIFT to make the petrodollars flow.

 

[Jarhyn]

Russia is at it again:

Russia planning massive military offensive against Ukraine involving 175,000 troops, U.S. intelligence warns

I don't think that severe economic consequences are going to deter Russia. I know that the west has been helping Ukraine up it's defensive capability. It will be painful for Russia to invade. Perhaps invasion could be prevented if Nato moved troops directly into Ukraine. But that seems like just temping WW3.

Another option is to have the shut Russia from the Belgium-based SWIFT system of financial payments that moves money among thousands of banks around the world. This would hurt Russia great. It could cut them off half their oil export revenue and a third of their foreign trade. I've seen it reported that
Russia depends on its oil and natural gas exports for more than one-third of its federal revenues, and depends on SWIFT to make the petrodollars flow.

If we cut Russia out of the global financial system, they will much more surely hit a fuck-it button. The whole model of Russian 'governance' is to be a loose cannon that nobody can disarm, for the sake of doing whatever the hell they want without meaningful challenge.

 

[Elixir]

I have no idea how "the west" should respond, because I can't understand what - if anything - Russia figures to gain by this.
My suspicion is that there is little interest in conquering and occupying Ukraine, and the whole charade is a distractive display of nationalism, by which Putin hopes to elevate his own domestic standing, which has reportedly been suffering of late.

 

[barbos]

I have no idea how "the west" should respond, because I can't understand what - if anything - Russia figures to gain by this.
My suspicion is that there is little interest in conquering and occupying Ukraine, and the whole charade is a distractive display of nationalism, by which Putin perhaps hopes to elevate his own domestic standing, which has reportedly been suffering of late.

Projecting again? No one in Russia considers it a great idea.

Putin does not need to invade anyone. All he needs is to start North Stream 2 and wait until all contracts with Ukrainian pipelines expire.
Ukraine and US, on the other hand, realize that they need some drastic shit to prevent that.

 

[Elixir]

I have no idea how "the west" should respond, because I can't understand what - if anything - Russia figures to gain by this.
My suspicion is that there is little interest in conquering and occupying Ukraine, and the whole charade is a distractive display of nationalism, by which Putin perhaps hopes to elevate his own domestic standing, which has reportedly been suffering of late.

Projecting again? No one in Russia considers it a great idea.

Putin does not need to invade anyone. All he needs is to start North Stream 2 and wait until all contracts with Ukrainian pipelines expire.
Ukraine and US on the other hand realize that they need some drastic shit to prevent that.

That explains the est. 90,000 troop buildup on the Ukranian Border. </sarcasm>
Someone in Russia obviously thinks that is a good idea.

I believe that the someone is Putin, and that he thinks it's a good idea because it takes public focus off other annoyances like Navalny and COVID.

How am I "projecting"?
I think you're just saying that there will be few people rallying for Russian imperialism, and that's believable but irrelevant.

 

[barbos]

That explains the est. 90,000 troop buildup on the Ukranian Border.

Yes, it actually explains it. Because Ukraine moved half on their of forces to the border with breakout republics. If US wants to start a war then Russia must be prepared.

 

[barbos]

I think you're just saying that there will be few people rallying for Russian imperialism, and that's believable but irrelevant.

Shit MSM feeds you about Russia are utter lies.

 

[Harry Bosch]

That explains the est. 90,000 troop buildup on the Ukranian Border.

Yes, it actually explains it. Because Ukraine moved half on their of forces to the border with breakout republics. If US wants to start a war then Russia must be prepared.

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting? Why would the US want a war in Ukraine? We are just seeking ways to defuse the situation and prevent an invasion.

I think you're just saying that there will be few people rallying for Russian imperialism, and that's believable but irrelevant.

Shit MSM feeds you about Russia are utter lies.

Are you trying to say that Russia isn't amassing troops on the Ukrainian border?

 

[barbos]

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting?

He is projecting when he suggests that It's Russia. It's Ukraine and their nazies who are desperate enough to start a war and play the victim and US is perfectly fine with that plan. After all it worked in Georgia, why not try again?

Ukraine is in deep economic shit. They need a war, not Russia.
Russia is doing fine, gas prices at all time highs, oil is too doing well.
And Ukraine is about to collapse on their own. Gas retail prices jumped 5x, Power stations shutdowns because of lack coal.
Well, there is a risk of Ukrainian Trump starting a war, that's bad.

 

[barbos]

Are you trying to say that Russia isn't amassing troops on the Ukrainian border?

I am saying that MSM forgot to inform you that Ukrainian Trump is doing the same.
And, unlike Russia, in doing so they are violating Minsk agreements.

Russian press discuss how much that supposedly leaked invasion plan looks like it was made up in Pentagon (military terms which are not used in Russia and other stuff)

 

[Harry Bosch]

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting?

He is projecting when he suggests that It's Russia. It's Ukraine and their nazies who are desperate enough to start a war and play the victim and US is perfectly fine with that plan. After all it worked in Georgia, why not try again?

Ukraine is in deep economic shit. They need a war, not Russia.
Russia is doing fine, gas prices at all time highs, oil is too doing well.
And Ukraine is about to collapse on their own. Gas retail prices jumped 5x, Power stations shutdowns because of lack coal.
Well, there is a risk of Ukrainian Trump starting a war, that's bad.

Good Heavens! Those Ukrainian Nazi meanies again! But how are they trying to start a war with Russia? Are you saying that Russian troops aren't amassing on their border? What would you say is a proper response for a country when foreign troops are amassing on their border? I think that the larger issue here is that Russia is scared. Bypassing Ukraine is the best long strategy for Ukraine. It's forcing Ukraine to organically grow their own economy and diversify away from Russia and oil profits. Oil profits are fleeting and uncertain. Russia will find this out in a year or so.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Are you trying to say that Russia isn't amassing troops on the Ukrainian border?

I am saying that MSM forgot to inform you that Ukrainian Trump is doing the same.
And, unlike Russia, in doing so they are violating Minsk agreements.

Russian press discuss how much that supposedly leaked invasion plan looks like it was made up in Pentagon (military terms which are not used in Russia and other stuff)

How is Ukraine violating the Minsk agreements? Could you please provide a reliable link to support your opinion as well?

 

[barbos]

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting?

He is projecting when he suggests that It's Russia. It's Ukraine and their nazies who are desperate enough to start a war and play the victim and US is perfectly fine with that plan. After all it worked in Georgia, why not try again?

Ukraine is in deep economic shit. They need a war, not Russia.
Russia is doing fine, gas prices at all time highs, oil is too doing well.
And Ukraine is about to collapse on their own. Gas retail prices jumped 5x, Power stations shutdowns because of lack coal.
Well, there is a risk of Ukrainian Trump starting a war, that's bad.

Good Heavens! Those Ukrainian Nazi meanies again! But how are they trying to start a war with Russia? Are you saying that Russian troops aren't amassing on their border? What would you say is a proper response for a country when foreign troops are amassing on their border? I think that the larger issue here is that Russia is scared. Bypassing Ukraine is the best long strategy for Ukraine. It's forcing Ukraine to organically grow their own economy and diversify away from Russia and oil profits. Oil profits are fleeting and uncertain. Russia will find this out in a year or so.

Do you even read what I write?
Ukraine started amassing troops for invasion of breakout republics, which is specifically forbidden by Minsk agreement. Your shitty media does not mention that at all.
Yes, fucking nazy in the fucking Ukrainian Government openly suggested hanging russians in Ukraine. Your fucking media have never reported that. I repeat, goverment critters suggested that.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting?

He is projecting when he suggests that It's Russia. It's Ukraine and their nazies who are desperate enough to start a war and play the victim and US is perfectly fine with that plan. After all it worked in Georgia, why not try again?

Ukraine is in deep economic shit. They need a war, not Russia.
Russia is doing fine, gas prices at all time highs, oil is too doing well.
And Ukraine is about to collapse on their own. Gas retail prices jumped 5x, Power stations shutdowns because of lack coal.
Well, there is a risk of Ukrainian Trump starting a war, that's bad.

Good Heavens! Those Ukrainian Nazi meanies again! But how are they trying to start a war with Russia? Are you saying that Russian troops aren't amassing on their border? What would you say is a proper response for a country when foreign troops are amassing on their border? I think that the larger issue here is that Russia is scared. Bypassing Ukraine is the best long strategy for Ukraine. It's forcing Ukraine to organically grow their own economy and diversify away from Russia and oil profits. Oil profits are fleeting and uncertain. Russia will find this out in a year or so.

Do you even read what I write?
Ukraine started amassing troops for invasion of breakout republics, which is specifically forbidden by Minsk agreement. Your shitty media does not mention that at all.
Yes, fucking nazy in the fucking Ukrainian Government openly suggested hanging russians in Ukraine. Your fucking media have never reported that. I repeat, goverment critters suggested that.

links?

 

[barbos]

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting?

He is projecting when he suggests that It's Russia. It's Ukraine and their nazies who are desperate enough to start a war and play the victim and US is perfectly fine with that plan. After all it worked in Georgia, why not try again?

Ukraine is in deep economic shit. They need a war, not Russia.
Russia is doing fine, gas prices at all time highs, oil is too doing well.
And Ukraine is about to collapse on their own. Gas retail prices jumped 5x, Power stations shutdowns because of lack coal.
Well, there is a risk of Ukrainian Trump starting a war, that's bad.

Good Heavens! Those Ukrainian Nazi meanies again! But how are they trying to start a war with Russia? Are you saying that Russian troops aren't amassing on their border? What would you say is a proper response for a country when foreign troops are amassing on their border? I think that the larger issue here is that Russia is scared. Bypassing Ukraine is the best long strategy for Ukraine. It's forcing Ukraine to organically grow their own economy and diversify away from Russia and oil profits. Oil profits are fleeting and uncertain. Russia will find this out in a year or so.

Do you even read what I write?
Ukraine started amassing troops for invasion of breakout republics, which is specifically forbidden by Minsk agreement. Your shitty media does not mention that at all.
Yes, fucking nazy in the fucking Ukrainian Government openly suggested hanging russians in Ukraine. Your fucking media have never reported that. I repeat, goverment critters suggested that.

links?

CNN links?
Sorry, don't have ones. It's common knowledge and accepted truth in Russia/Ukraine which is avoided by western media. No one denies it, it's just avoided.
Ukraine is an original Trumpistan.


And why are you so surprised? US supported terrorists in Afganistan and Syria, why is it so surprising that they would support nazies?

 

[Harry Bosch]

Your posts to Elixir don't make sense to me. Where is the projecting?

He is projecting when he suggests that It's Russia. It's Ukraine and their nazies who are desperate enough to start a war and play the victim and US is perfectly fine with that plan. After all it worked in Georgia, why not try again?

Ukraine is in deep economic shit. They need a war, not Russia.
Russia is doing fine, gas prices at all time highs, oil is too doing well.
And Ukraine is about to collapse on their own. Gas retail prices jumped 5x, Power stations shutdowns because of lack coal.
Well, there is a risk of Ukrainian Trump starting a war, that's bad.

Good Heavens! Those Ukrainian Nazi meanies again! But how are they trying to start a war with Russia? Are you saying that Russian troops aren't amassing on their border? What would you say is a proper response for a country when foreign troops are amassing on their border? I think that the larger issue here is that Russia is scared. Bypassing Ukraine is the best long strategy for Ukraine. It's forcing Ukraine to organically grow their own economy and diversify away from Russia and oil profits. Oil profits are fleeting and uncertain. Russia will find this out in a year or so.

Do you even read what I write?
Ukraine started amassing troops for invasion of breakout republics, which is specifically forbidden by Minsk agreement. Your shitty media does not mention that at all.
Yes, fucking nazy in the fucking Ukrainian Government openly suggested hanging russians in Ukraine. Your fucking media have never reported that. I repeat, goverment critters suggested that.

links?

CNN links?
Sorry, don't have ones. It's common knowledge and accepted truth in Russia/Ukraine which is avoided by western media. No one denies it, it's just avoided.
Ukraine is an original Trumpistan.


And why are you so surprised? US supported terrorists in Afganistan and Syria, why is it so surprising that they would support nazies?

If you are correct, and Russia is truly afraid of tiny Ukraine invading Russia, the the world should fully unite against Russia. A powerful country with nukes that is so paranoid of a tiny military with little offensive power is too great a risk to world security.

 

[barbos]

If you are correct, and Russia is truly afraid of tiny Ukraine invading Russia, the the world should fully unite against Russia. A powerful country with nukes that is so paranoid of a tiny military with little offensive power is too great a risk to world security.

Well, technically Eastern Ukraine is not Russia..... yet. But I see nothing wrong with russian forces being proactive and preparing for Ukrainian/American provocations. Just to show Ukraine that Russia will protect status-quo.
As for Ukraine invading actual Russia, you will be laughing but such ideas are very popular in Ukraine. They are seriously making territorial claims on as far as Siberia.
I am not kidding. Ukraine is a country where Capitol rioters won.

 

[SigmatheZeta]

If Europe were to move to defend their own territory, then I would support my country giving them military assistance. If they were to cut off Putin's balls and staple them to his forehead, then I would not say anything about it.

 

[barbos]

Reminded me a story which old lady which got infected with Covid along with me told me recently.
She recovered by the way. Anyway, she is a russian but originally from Ukraine and has a bunch of relatives there including sister or cousin. She regularly skypes with them.
And she was once talking with one of her grand-something no older than 7 I think. And he said he wants to kill russians. Go figure. Of course she told him that she herself is russian. Kids just repeat shit the hear.

 

[barbos]

If Europe were to move to defend their own territory, then I would support my country giving them military assistance. If they were to cut off Putin's balls and staple them to his forehead, then I would not say anything about it.

You are a victim of anti-russian propaganda.
And what do you call Europe here?