January 6 Hearings Live

[lpetrich]

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "Today, we uncovered that the FBI has no protocol to address members of law enforcement belonging to white supremacist organizations.

Just this year, more than 30 active or retired police officers joined the Jan. 6th attack. We must eliminate violent extremism in law enforcement. (vid link)" / Twitter
Fifth columnists in the ranks.

 

[Elixir]

This was my fear at the end of his Presidency. But he didn't pardon them.

He didn’t even know all their names, and it would have looked even worse than it did, if he had just pardoned the terrorist leaders he did know.

So, as the prosecution keeps working up the pyramid, they're going to start finding elected officials that were party to the insurrection.
Which the 14th Amendment makes them ineligible to serve in tjose electdd positions.
A pardon does not make the crime go away. Accepting a pardon actually acknowledges you're guilty. You just avoid prison.

If, say, Cawthorn is found to be lapel-pin deep in the overthrow, is challenged to prevent his candidacy based on that, does a pardon affect the challenge?
Legally, that is. Not in a 'trumpists take over and nothing matters' scenario.

We need to recruit some much higher priced lawyers to this forum.

 

[Elixir]

Indeed, the Nixon Southern strategy got him the White House. But it has polarized us ever since then And authoritarianism has creeped in. I recall predicting that Reagan would lead to a revolution in this country. A friend shook his head and said he never would believe that could happen in the US. He thought I meant during his administration, and I said,no, like in 40 years. I just didn’t like what they were saying in the neocon circles. The heritage foundation talked about what they’d like to see from Reagan, and I remember being deeply disturbed by its proposals.

But in 84 I voted for him, and Bush in 88. The key concerns at that time was the Arms debate vis a vis the Soviet Union. Everyone thought we were losing to them, and as a junior military officer at the time, I bought into it. Mondale’s big issue was a so called nuclear freeze. But that was a pointless issue. The threat of the Soviet Union was always well contained and war was never particularly close. Both sides were wrong. We talked with their leaders and worked out our disagreements and then suddenly they collapsed like a house of cards.

I supported Bush in Gulf War I. And I can still be somewhat conservative on foreign policy issues. But when the 92 Recession hit, and listening to the awful vitriolic speeches at the Republican Convention that year, I switched. Abortion issues and the evanglicalization of the party were just too much for me. I had also just finished law school then and believe I had been exposed to too many other ideas To continue supporting Republicans. I've never turned back.

What I can’t say I anticipated was why the near coup started. I didn’t realize what had really been happening until about ten years ago. I really believe that this boils down to growing income inequality more than anything. Racism is an outgrowth of that more than anything. The need for scape goats to blame for ones circumstances is key. Trump fueled those. He made it immigrants, but it could have just as easily been any non-white. It’s such an easy distraction for what’s really going on - the continued raping of our polity by the uber rich.

SLD it is really affirming to read that post.
As one who has experienced involuntarily revulsion at Republican “ideas” since at least 1966, I am continuously re-examining my own views, lest I fall (more) victim to my own biases.
Kudos to you for the proven ability to overcome at least some of yours.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

NEWS

Today at a rally in Texas Trump floated the idea of pardoning the insurrectionists if elected in 2024.

Graham later said it was something Trump shouldn't say.

After that MTG went off on Graham, saying he's disloyal.

They are normalizing coups and pardoning, banning disloyalty.

 

[James Brown]

Huh. So Trump wants to pardon members of Antifa?

 

[ZiprHead]

Huh. So Trump wants to pardon members of Antifa?

I see what you did there.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

This was my fear at the end of his Presidency. But he didn't pardon them.

He didn’t even know all their names, and it would have looked even worse than it did, if he had just pardoned the terrorist leaders he did know.

So, as the prosecution keeps working up the pyramid, they're going to start finding elected officials that were party to the insurrection.
Which the 14th Amendment makes them ineligible to serve in tjose electdd positions.
A pardon does not make the crime go away. Accepting a pardon actually acknowledges you're guilty. You just avoid prison.

If, say, Cawthorn is found to be lapel-pin deep in the overthrow, is challenged to prevent his candidacy based on that, does a pardon affect the challenge?
Legally, that is. Not in a 'trumpists take over and nothing matters' scenario.

That is fan fiction, it isn't going to happen. Insurrection would likely need to involve the use of weapons, and be organized.

 

[RVonse]

I really believe that this boils down to growing income inequality more than anything.

That is the key to everything right there. It does not matter who you think is right or wrong, who was the worst president, or who is the best party (of 2 bad parties). If inequality does not get fixed one way or another, the political system becomes even more unstable and the US becomes a very bad place to live.

 

[RVonse]

You fucking knew this was coming

Donald Trump dangles the prospect of pardons for Capitol rioters if he returns as US president​

Former US president Donald Trump has suggested he may pardon supporters who participated in the deadly January 6 storming of the Capitol if he returns to the White House.
"If I run and if I win, we will treat those people from January 6th fairly," Mr Trump said during a rally in Conroe, Texas on Saturday. "And if it requires pardons, we will give them pardons because they are being treated so unfairly."

Fucker isn't even bothering to pretend anymore. I look forward to the usual suspects trying to bullshit on how Democrats have been doing this for years.

It was probably a calculated move on Trump's part regarding future votes cast.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Also, if he pardons the Dread Pirate Roberts, then maybe he won't rat on him.

 

[Patooka]

It was probably a calculated move on Trump's part regarding future votes cast.

Defend Trump no matter what. Good luck with that, mate.

 

[Keith&Co.]

This was my fear at the end of his Presidency. But he didn't pardon them.

He didn’t even know all their names, and it would have looked even worse than it did, if he had just pardoned the terrorist leaders he did know.

So, as the prosecution keeps working up the pyramid, they're going to start finding elected officials that were party to the insurrection.
Which the 14th Amendment makes them ineligible to serve in tjose electdd positions.
A pardon does not make the crime go away. Accepting a pardon actually acknowledges you're guilty. You just avoid prison.

If, say, Cawthorn is found to be lapel-pin deep in the overthrow, is challenged to prevent his candidacy based on that, does a pardon affect the challenge?
Legally, that is. Not in a 'trumpists take over and nothing matters' scenario.

That is fan fiction, it isn't going to happen. Insurrection would likely need to involve the use of weapons, and be organized.

Cawthorn keeps calling for violence.
Organization, meh.
Depends on thd jury, i think.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

This was my fear at the end of his Presidency. But he didn't pardon them.

He didn’t even know all their names, and it would have looked even worse than it did, if he had just pardoned the terrorist leaders he did know.

So, as the prosecution keeps working up the pyramid, they're going to start finding elected officials that were party to the insurrection.
Which the 14th Amendment makes them ineligible to serve in tjose electdd positions.
A pardon does not make the crime go away. Accepting a pardon actually acknowledges you're guilty. You just avoid prison.

If, say, Cawthorn is found to be lapel-pin deep in the overthrow, is challenged to prevent his candidacy based on that, does a pardon affect the challenge?
Legally, that is. Not in a 'trumpists take over and nothing matters' scenario.

That is fan fiction, it isn't going to happen. Insurrection would likely need to involve the use of weapons, and be organized.

Cawthorn keeps calling for violence.
Organization, meh.
Depends on thd jury, i think.

The Jury would ultimately be the Supreme Court.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I really believe that this boils down to growing income inequality more than anything.

That is the key to everything right there. It does not matter who you think is right or wrong, who was the worst president, or who is the best party (of 2 bad parties).

You are glossing over the whole President Trump and his allies speaking about going to the Capitol Bldg, wage a "trial by combat".

If inequality does not get fixed one way or another, the political system becomes even more unstable and the US becomes a very bad place to live.

Inequality my ass. Nixon and the Republicans have done a marvelous job of pitting Americans against Americans. Not over equality, but over almost nothing at all. Shit has got so bad, some right-wingers were taking horse dewormer, but that got better when some docs prescribed anti-lice medication... to deal with Covid-19. The movement that tried to reinstate Trump on 2020 has almost no ideological purpose other than wanting the "good ole times back".

 

[Keith&Co.]

Huh. So Trump wants to pardon members of Antifa?

Of course.
Remember the pardons he did grant? He's doing this for the money. It's always about the money.
"I'm gonna pardon every antifa rioter that Soros will pay for. Suck him dry! Then he can't afford a BLM riot!"

 

[lpetrich]

Justice Dept. grabbed phone, email records of Bannon attorney Robert Costello in Jan. 6 contempt probe - The Washington Post

Bannon’s team decried the collection Robert J. Costello’s records, saying it may have violated attorney-client privilege.

...
The latest developments highlight Costello’s role in Trump’s orbit. A former federal prosecutor and longtime white-collar defense attorney in New York City, Costello, 74, has represented figures such as George Steinbrenner and Leona Helmsley and litigated matters involving the top U.S. professional football, basketball and baseball leagues. Since 2018, he has emerged as a counselor to close Trump aides in politically sensitive investigations.

Before advising Bannon in the House’s probe of events related to the Jan. 6 riot that disrupted Congress’s certification the election of President Biden, Costello in December 2020 joined Bannon’s defense when he was charged in what Manhattan federal prosecutors called a massive fundraising scam targeting the donors of a private campaign to build a wall along the U.S.-Mexico border. Bannon, accused of pocketing more than $1 million from his involvement with “We Build the Wall,” pleaded not guilty before Trump pardoned him hours before leaving office on Jan. 20, 2021.

 

[ZiprHead]

Republican figures condemn RNC's decision to censure Cheney and Kinzinger

The statement says the RNC has "ceded control of a once-great movement to grifters and extremists."

www.axios.com

About 140 Republican leaders and former officials signed a statement out Monday condemning the Republican National Committee's decision last week to censure Reps. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) and Adam Kinzinger (R-Ill.) over their participation in the Jan. 6 select committee.

 

[SLD]

Republican figures condemn RNC's decision to censure Cheney and Kinzinger

The statement says the RNC has "ceded control of a once-great movement to grifters and extremists."

www.axios.com

About 140 Republican leaders and former officials signed a statement out Monday condemning the Republican National Committee's decision last week to censure Reps. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) and Adam Kinzinger (R-Ill.) over their participation in the Jan. 6 select committee.

The more Republicans they alienate, the better.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Republican figures condemn RNC's decision to censure Cheney and Kinzinger

The statement says the RNC has "ceded control of a once-great movement to grifters and extremists."

www.axios.com

About 140 Republican leaders and former officials signed a statement out Monday condemning the Republican National Committee's decision last week to censure Reps. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) and Adam Kinzinger (R-Ill.) over their participation in the Jan. 6 select committee.

The more Republicans they alienate, the better.

In a perfect world yes, however, we are watching the GOP continue it's path toward authoritarianism... and we'll be (we are being) dragged in with it, because the people have a tendency of voting for the other party because it was "time for a change".

 

[Elixir]

people have a tendency of voting for the other party because it was "time for a change

People are stupid.
If they are not made to realize that a change this November will be the last change they will ever be allowed to make, this probably WILL be it.
I don’t know if Putin’s first reelection wa free and fair at all, but it might be a good analog to what Americans are about to do to themselves.