Man electrocutes himself while charging phone in bath

[bilby]

So russians would be naked drinking vodka in some dirt?
They have all kinds of beer in Russia. And swimsuits looks very typical for Russia. Even power strip looks like the one I have.
There are clean places in Russia too, and cars. But most important clue is their mugs, which don't look italian/british/french/german at all.
Could be some eastern European, Czech for example.

Staged? They wouldn't be showing the concern they are if it were staged.

He looks concerned but not about being electrocuted , he is concerned if powerstrip would float for the stage photo, or it's a good acting. In any case it's too stupid to be real.

I can show you a dozen pictures right off the bat of something that looks too stupid to be real...but is.

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You have the cord coming from the grill into the power strip. Then the power strip needs a grounded extension cord. Hence the red cord with the big female end. But that red cord is heavy and would obviously pull any cord attached to it and fall down, yanking the grill into the pool. Hence the piece of wood to secure it and then it's taped to the pool.

They don't look Russian. Russians wouldn't be drinking beer or wearing swimsuits. The area around them is very clean and nice and there appears to be a late model car behind them. I'm thinking some place in Scandinavia.

I am pretty sure that Russians have access to both beer and swimsuits. Indeed, there are some very well regarded Russian beers out there at the moment - the Baltika brewery company, based in St Petersburg (but with breweries across Russia, and even one in Baku, Azerbaijan) is a major exporter of beer.

They don't all spend the entire year up to their arses in snowdrifts, swigging vodka.

Staged? They wouldn't be showing the concern they are if it were staged.

Unless they were to use some new and innovative staging technique, such as what I understand the thespians call 'acting'.

If you think that you can tell whether a photo is staged or not just by looking at its content, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.

A staged photo would be better composed than this one is.

I refer you to my previous comment.

 

[Derec]

And this case I do not understand. I seriously doubt a phone charger can inflict the damage described, it certainly sounds like it was the mains voltage from the extension cord that did him in. What good would a warning on the phone do?

Indeed. Phone chargers operate on 5V or so and current is given by Ohm's law. There is no way 5V will generate any dangerous currents with human body in the loop.

So he probably dropped the extension cord in the drink. And mind, normal household voltage in Europe is 240V, twice as much as in US (we use half the phase for most things and full phase only for dryers and stoves and ACs) which means twice the current for any given circuit. That means a much better chance of getting yourself killed.

 

[Derec]

View attachment 10341

Actually these boys will probably be fine. They are standing less than waist-deep in water and to go across their hearts, the current would have to go up and down their torso. Also there is some distance the current has to cover in the water (water, unless it is salty, is not a very good conductor). More distance means more resistance and less current. Very different than having the charger on his chest, thus there being only a short distance both from device to skin and though the body for the path across the heart.
I still would not do it myself of course, but still a much less dangerous setup than in the OP.

 

[Juma]

View attachment 10341

Actually these boys will probably be fine. They are standing less than waist-deep in water and to go across their hearts, the current would have to go up and down their torso. Also there is some distance the current has to cover in the water (water, unless it is salty, is not a very good conductor). More distance means more resistance and less current. Very different than having the charger on his chest, thus there being only a short distance both from device to skin and though the body for the path across the heart.
I still would not do it myself of course, but still a much less dangerous setup than in the OP.

If the contact goes in the water they will cramp and fall...

 

[Derec]

If the contact goes in the water they will cramp and fall...

By the time that happens the circuit breaker should trip, opening the circuit.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

If the contact goes in the water they will cramp and fall...

By the time that happens the circuit breaker should trip, opening the circuit.

What's the resistance of the water? Over 6 ohms and the breaker doesn't pop. On the other hand, the current should flow mostly around the plug. It's only really dangerous when the current is flowing from the plug, through the water and then to the ground (the water pipe.) Since the human body is far more conductive than fresh water the current will by preference go through the body. Ouch!

 

[Derec]

What's the resistance of the water?

It depends on the dissolved ions.

Over 6 ohms and the breaker doesn't pop.

How do you figure? A 240V line with 10A breaker would need 24Ω, but that's overall resistance, not just water. You are probably thinking American standard 120V/20A (same power as 240V/10A) where overall resistance would indeed be 6Ω, but that would include the extension cord itself. So it is much easier to trip a breaker with an imperfect short in Europe than in US. Otoh, in US you'd have half the current for the same resistance, and it is the current that kills.

On the other hand, the current should flow mostly around the plug.

Indeed. But remember, you can think of the situation as a parallel circuit where each current path contributes. Except, since it is not discrete paths you'd have to integrate current density rather than sum up currents.
And if you want 100mA to flow through water, through the guy's legs and back through the water I do not see how you do not get to 10A (or even possibly 20A) overall.

It's only really dangerous when the current is flowing from the plug, through the water and then to the ground (the water pipe.)

Or back to the neutral wire. Or both (more paths, more current).

Since the human body is far more conductive than fresh water the current will by preference go through the body. Ouch!

But it has to get to your body first, through water. That is basically a series circuit where individual resistances add up. Also, it is the interior of the body that's nice and wet and electrolytic. The skin is a much poorer conductor than say muscle tissue.

The guy in the OP had a perfect storm. He had the extension cord on his chest. That means that once it got submerged, there was not much distance between the metal and his chest. And since it was on his chest, there wasn't much distance the current had to go to cross his heart. And finally, the grounded drain provided a second, parallel, current path increasing the current.
GFCI outlets are designed to disconnect power quickly if a difference between current on the hot wire and neutral wire is detected (indicating that some of the current is either flowing along the ground wire or outside the cable entirely, such as drain pipe). A circuit breaker is designed to respond much slower unless the current is several times the rated current, to avoid nuisance tripping for transients.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It depends on the dissolved ions.

Over 6 ohms and the breaker doesn't pop.

How do you figure? A 240V line with 10A breaker would need 24Ω, but that's overall resistance, not just water. You are probably thinking American standard 120V/20A (same power as 240V/10A) where overall resistance would indeed be 6Ω, but that would include the extension cord itself. So it is much easier to trip a breaker with an imperfect short in Europe than in US. Otoh, in US you'd have half the current for the same resistance, and it is the current that kills.

Yeah, I was thinking US. Typical breakers are 120V and 20A, that means <6Ω to pop it.

On the other hand, the current should flow mostly around the plug.

Indeed. But remember, you can think of the situation as a parallel circuit where each current path contributes. Except, since it is not discrete paths you'd have to integrate current density rather than sum up currents.
And if you want 100mA to flow through water, through the guy's legs and back through the water I do not see how you do not get to 10A (or even possibly 20A) overall.

If both sides of the plug are underwater then by far the path of least resistance is simply between them even if it's fresh water. It's going through a lot more resistance to go around to find his body. Hence minimal current. Mythbusters wasn't able to electrocute their test dummy by throwing something electrical into the water--until they made the return path be through the pipes.

It's only really dangerous when the current is flowing from the plug, through the water and then to the ground (the water pipe.)

Or back to the neutral wire. Or both (more paths, more current).

But the neutral wire is half an inch away. If that path works that's where it's going to go.

Since the human body is far more conductive than fresh water the current will by preference go through the body. Ouch!

But it has to get to your body first, through water. That is basically a series circuit where individual resistances add up. Also, it is the interior of the body that's nice and wet and electrolytic. The skin is a much poorer conductor than say muscle tissue.

Dry skin is a very poor conductor.

 

[barbos]

If the contact goes in the water they will cramp and fall...

By the time that happens the circuit breaker should trip, opening the circuit.

Circuit breaker would do no such thing. Current is too low for it to trip

 

[barbos]

And this case I do not understand. I seriously doubt a phone charger can inflict the damage described, it certainly sounds like it was the mains voltage from the extension cord that did him in. What good would a warning on the phone do?

Indeed. Phone chargers operate on 5V or so and current is given by Ohm's law. There is no way 5V will generate any dangerous currents with human body in the loop.

So he probably dropped the extension cord in the drink. And mind, normal household voltage in Europe is 240V, twice as much as in US (we use half the phase for most things and full phase only for dryers and stoves and ACs) which means twice the current for any given circuit. That means a much better chance of getting yourself killed.

If I remember correctly the lowest fatal electrocution was from 6 volt. So if you are determined you can certainly kill yourself with 9 volt battery.

 

[ZiprHead]

It's not the voltage, it's the current that kills you.

 

[Derec]

It's not the voltage, it's the current that kills you.

While true, it is the voltage that determines the current, according to Ohm's Law.
The 12V car battery is able to deliver 100s of Amps, but if you touch the terminals with your fingers nothing will happen.

 

[Derec]

If I remember correctly the lowest fatal electrocution was from 6 volt. So if you are determined you can certainly kill yourself with 9 volt battery.

That could only work if you stuck electrodes deep into your chest, one on each side of your heart.

Think about it. If you lick a 9V battery, all you get is a tingle, despite a thin mucous membrane on your tongue and wet, ion-rich environment.

 

[Derec]

Circuit breaker would do no such thing. Current is too low for it to trip

How do you figure?

Remember, the total current flowing through the hot wire is the sum of all the currents flowing along all the paths.
Also, because current is inversely proportional to resistance, and resistance is directly proportional to distance, highest current density will be in the close vicinity of the receptacle.
Either you get more than enough current to trip the breaker, or the circuitous path through a meter of water and the guy's legs is not going to have enough current through it to be dangerous.

 

[barbos]

If I remember correctly the lowest fatal electrocution was from 6 volt. So if you are determined you can certainly kill yourself with 9 volt battery.

That could only work if you stuck electrodes deep into your chest, one on each side of your heart.

Think about it. If you lick a 9V battery, all you get is a tingle, despite a thin mucous membrane on your tongue and wet, ion-rich environment.

Yes, nevertheless the guy died from 6 volts.

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Circuit breaker would do no such thing. Current is too low for it to trip

How do you figure?

Remember, the total current flowing through the hot wire is the sum of all the currents flowing along all the paths.
Also, because current is inversely proportional to resistance, and resistance is directly proportional to distance, highest current density will be in the close vicinity of the receptacle.
Either you get more than enough current to trip the breaker, or the circuitous path through a meter of water and the guy's legs is not going to have enough current through it to be dangerous.

Because I did experiments.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Indeed. Phone chargers operate on 5V or so and current is given by Ohm's law. There is no way 5V will generate any dangerous currents with human body in the loop.

So he probably dropped the extension cord in the drink. And mind, normal household voltage in Europe is 240V, twice as much as in US (we use half the phase for most things and full phase only for dryers and stoves and ACs) which means twice the current for any given circuit. That means a much better chance of getting yourself killed.

If I remember correctly the lowest fatal electrocution was from 6 volt. So if you are determined you can certainly kill yourself with 9 volt battery.

Only if you stuck wires from that 9v battery into your chest.

 

[Derec]

Yes, nevertheless the guy died from 6 volts.

Did he? Have a source for that?

I googled around, and the closest I could get to is a claim that a guy got killed when he jammed leads of a multimeter into his fingers to measure resistance. The meter supposedly ran on 9V.
Resistance is Futile

Note though how short on detail the story is. No name, no location etc. Looks more like a Navy cautionary tale than something that actually happened.
Even with skin being fully pierced, human body from finger to finger on opposing hand would have resistance much higher than 100Ω.
If this story is in any way true, and not invented out of whole cloth to scare recruits, I bet the poor sailor had some underlying heart condition, similar to how some people can go into cardiac arrest from being tased.

Because I did experiments.

Fair enough. But a few comments/questions:
- Are you in the US (120V) or Europe/most of the world (240V)? You need 4 times the overall resistance to avoid tripping a typical breaker in the US vs. Europe.
- Conductivity of "typical drinking water" varies as much as a factor of 10, according to wikipedia, and the current would vary accordingly as well. So just by variations in your water's ion content you may get tripping or not.

Besides, my point was not that a breaker would be tripped for sure, just that if the overall current is less than tripping current, the current that goes through the guys' legs will not be enough to be really dangerous.

 

[Keith&Co.]

If I remember correctly the lowest fatal electrocution was from 6 volt. So if you are determined you can certainly kill yourself with 9 volt battery.

That could only work if you stuck electrodes deep into your chest, one on each side of your heart.

We used to get annual training on that guy...

A sailor doing after-work study time in an electrical school wanted to measure the resistance of his body with a multimeter, and jabbed the probes into his thumbs. So the 9v batter current went through the blood, through his heart.
It didn't electrocute him, but it did put his heart into spasms. He might have been saved if anyone else had been there, but i turned into a fatal condition.

When you touch both ends of the 9v to your tongue, the line of least resistance doesn't go through your heart.

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Note though how short on detail the story is. No name, no location etc. Looks more like a Navy cautionary tale than something that actually happened.

Yeah, that's the one.
Contact the Navy Safety Center if you're looking for verification.

 

[Underseer]

Incredibly the coroner thinks phones need to have a warning;



Independent

So now that some fuckwit has managed to kill himself doing something incredibly stupid, phone manufacturers may be required to put a warning on their phone.

This kind of stupidity is what lead lawmakers here to have to declare texting while driving a punishable offense cuz people were too stupid to connect the correlated deaths and manslaughter charges with the precursor that the driver had their eyes glued to a cell phone.

Now some other idiot manages to do the same thing that the first person who died by a hairdryer falling into a bath did and companies have to spend money on idiot warning labels. Watch out! Phones are dangerous if charged under water! Hur, dur.

If the idiot warning labels save lives, then it is worth putting them there.

Yes, even if a corporation has to spend money trying to reduce the number of customers who die.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

This kind of stupidity is what lead lawmakers here to have to declare texting while driving a punishable offense cuz people were too stupid to connect the correlated deaths and manslaughter charges with the precursor that the driver had their eyes glued to a cell phone.

Now some other idiot manages to do the same thing that the first person who died by a hairdryer falling into a bath did and companies have to spend money on idiot warning labels. Watch out! Phones are dangerous if charged under water! Hur, dur.

If the idiot warning labels save lives, then it is worth putting them there.

Yes, even if a corporation has to spend money trying to reduce the number of customers who die.

But why do you think the warning label does any good? Idiots will ignore warning labels.

Most warning labels are about lawsuit defense.