Morality of brains

[Treedbear]

Is it immoral to view child pornagraphy in the privacy of one's own home?

Is it immoral to eat a child in the privacy of one's own home? Would it be different if one had nothing to do with the killing, the butchering, or the preparation of the meal?

Do you really believe that dishwashing liquid will soften your hands? Then why do you have your fingers in my chicken soup?!

 

[Bronzeage]

Is it immoral to eat a child in the privacy of one's own home? Would it be different if one had nothing to do with the killing, the butchering, or the preparation of the meal?

Do you really believe that dishwashing liquid will soften your hands? Then why do you have your fingers in my chicken soup?!

42. It goes without saying.

 

[Treedbear]

Do you really believe that dishwashing liquid will soften your hands? Then why do you have your fingers in my chicken soup?!

42. It goes without saying.

 

[Malintent]

Yes, you do...

Ignorance and selfishness': Rubbish strewn on Welsh beach

27 pictures of shockingly selfish parking that will make ... - Wales Online

Wales 'selfish' to break away from GB - Drew Sullivan

Archbishop of Wales: Children suffer because selfish parents won't...

Britain's Most Selfish People – George Monbiot

Any clown can simply collect any quotation that includes the words 'Wails' (or whatever it is foreigners say) and 'selfish'. I think most people live mainly for their families, for whom they would if necessary die.

"Wales" and "selfish" was the term, yes... and I didn't even have to go to clown school to learn how to do that. Also, I didn;t just collect quotes. Those are hyperlinks. Which means that you can click on them and read the content with full context. And in case you didn't finish your clown school either (I guess that is what you call it over there), "click" means to position the mouse pointer over the text and push down on the button on the left.

My comment was in regard to your statement that you live in a society that mainly lives for others. Which I am saying is simply not true... there are no modern altruistic societies.

 

[DBT]

Appearance only. But in reality not (there are exceptions).

What you identify with; your family, your property, your investments, your pets, your friends, etc, are a part of your self...your extended self interest.

You may be devoted to your family, business, etc, but that is in your own interest. As is your neighbourhood, town, city and so on to whatever degree you identify with these things.

Nationalism for example; my nation as opposed to your nation, or my religion as opposed to your religion. And on it goes.

I think you are muddled.

No. I have a fair understanding of human nature.

I am so selfish, for instance, that I desperately want to save the world, at whatever personal cost - extended self interest to weirdoes conceivably, but according to that sort of thinking, anyone who has any connection with anything whatever must be selfish.

Being unselfish in one aspect of your psychological makeup and outlook does not diminish your self interest overall. Nor does your desire to 'save the world' necessarily mean a non selfish reason for your desire.

A ruthless businessman may have a thread of altruism in their makeup, but that doesn't change their overall self interest quotient: they take more than they give.

Just look at a world of division and conflict.

 

[fromderinside]

42. It goes without saying.

You don't think so,. You produced it. You've even numbered it.

 

[iolo]

Any clown can simply collect any quotation that includes the words 'Wails' (or whatever it is foreigners say) and 'selfish'. I think most people live mainly for their families, for whom they would if necessary die.

"Wales" and "selfish" was the term, yes... and I didn't even have to go to clown school to learn how to do that. Also, I didn;t just collect quotes. Those are hyperlinks. Which means that you can click on them and read the content with full context. And in case you didn't finish your clown school either (I guess that is what you call it over there), "click" means to position the mouse pointer over the text and push down on the button on the left.

My comment was in regard to your statement that you live in a society that mainly lives for others. Which I am saying is simply not true... there are no modern altruistic societies.

That funny word means foreign, and I am British, living as I do in Cymru. The society I was referring was one you are unfamiliar with, namely the human one.

- - - Updated - - -

I think you are muddled.

No. I have a fair understanding of human nature.

I am so selfish, for instance, that I desperately want to save the world, at whatever personal cost - extended self interest to weirdoes conceivably, but according to that sort of thinking, anyone who has any connection with anything whatever must be selfish.

Being unselfish in one aspect of your psychological makeup and outlook does not diminish your self interest overall. Nor does your desire to 'save the world' necessarily mean a non selfish reason for your desire.

A ruthless businessman may have a thread of altruism in their makeup, but that doesn't change their overall self interest quotient: they take more than they give.

Just look at a world of division and conflict.

If you believe in selves you get into all sorts of unpleasant muddles, I'm afraid. In America you are forced to believe in selfishness: it is the national religion.

 

[fromderinside]

If you believe in selves you get into all sorts of unpleasant muddles, I'm afraid. In America you are forced to believe in selfishness: it is the national religion.

Out here in US Cellular land it's all about sef. Luv yer sef, sefish is gud, rewad yersef, lick dat.

 

[Bronzeage]

42. It goes without saying.

You don't think so,. You produced it. You've even numbered it.

Cogito ergo cogito sum more.

 

[DBT]

If you believe in selves you get into all sorts of unpleasant muddles, I'm afraid. In America you are forced to believe in selfishness: it is the national religion.

I made no mention of 'selves' - my reference was to the multifaceted nature of human psychology, a person may be a business man, a family man (treating family far differently to business relationships), a father or mother (children before friends, associates and strangers, etc, psychology based on a hierarchy of needs, wants and fears.

 

[iolo]

If you believe in selves you get into all sorts of unpleasant muddles, I'm afraid. In America you are forced to believe in selfishness: it is the national religion.

I made no mention of 'selves' - my reference was to the multifaceted nature of human psychology, a person may be a business man, a family man (treating family far differently to business relationships), a father or mother (children before friends, associates and strangers, etc, psychology based on a hierarchy of needs, wants and fears.

The word 'selfish' IS a reference to self/selves.

 

[DBT]

I made no mention of 'selves' - my reference was to the multifaceted nature of human psychology, a person may be a business man, a family man (treating family far differently to business relationships), a father or mother (children before friends, associates and strangers, etc, psychology based on a hierarchy of needs, wants and fears.

The word 'selfish' IS a reference to self/selves.

Yes. With varying degrees of altruism or concern for others that one does not identify with, self and other.

 

[iolo]

The word 'selfish' IS a reference to self/selves.

Yes. With varying degrees of altruism or concern for others that one does not identify with, self and other.

Like the belief in 'race', the belief in a continuous 'self' has consequences, almost all bad.

 

[fromderinside]

I don't really go for that study that tries to make maths from gibberish. I do go as far as  Kin selection though. As for tribe or universalist I see benefits socially, but, socially isn't fitness is it so its pretty hrrd to shoehorn in to an evolved being the idea of brain morality. This latter has been pretty well resolved by  George C. Williams (biologist) pretty much destroying  V. C. Wynne-Edwards  Group Selection and setting the basis for  The Selfish Gene

Of course things ar much more complex than that. see  Intragenomic conflict and recent work on human behavioral modulation by her  Gut-brain axis and  Human microbiota. Seems we should get guidance from the fields of ecology inter-genetic sociology as well.

 

[Malintent]

That funny word means foreign, and I am British, living as I do in Cymru. The society I was referring was one you are unfamiliar with, namely the human one.

"hooo-maun"... funny sounding tribe. How many different governments, religions, and local customs are there in this "society".

In America you are forced to believe in selfishness: it is the national religion.

Indeed. I can't argue with that... It's more than a national religion.. it's the national pastime.

 

[iolo]

I think tribes have died out mostly, except in fairly backward, colonised or deeply-capitalist societies. While the bosses divide us, of course, we shall have plenty of pretend division for the mugs. That's capitalism for you!

 

[untermensche]

...
Morality involves what one person does to another.

What they do to themselves is not a matter of morality but of sanity and emotional state.
...

Is it immoral to view child pornagraphy in the privacy of one's own home?

Child pornography is about what one person does to another.

What one does to a child.

Looking at an image is not doing something to someone.

Morality doesn't enter the picture.

If one gets off looking at depictions of horrible exploitation then that is an issue of sanity and sadism, not morality.

People caught with child pornography should not be sent to prison. They should be taught normal empathy somehow though. If that is even possible. Minus that their picture in the paper should suffice.

 

[DBT]

Is it immoral to view child pornagraphy in the privacy of one's own home?

Child pornography is about what one person does to another.

What one does to a child.

Looking at an image is not doing something to someone.

Morality doesn't enter the picture.

If one gets off looking at depictions of horrible exploitation then that is an issue of sanity and sadism, not morality.

People caught with child pornography should not be sent to prison. They should be taught normal empathy somehow though. If that is even possible. Minus that their picture in the paper should suffice.

That's a naive position to take. Demand creates a market which drives production. So it is the consumer who mandates the act that is being paid for.

 

[untermensche]

Child pornography is about what one person does to another.

What one does to a child.

Looking at an image is not doing something to someone.

Morality doesn't enter the picture.

If one gets off looking at depictions of horrible exploitation then that is an issue of sanity and sadism, not morality.

People caught with child pornography should not be sent to prison. They should be taught normal empathy somehow though. If that is even possible. Minus that their picture in the paper should suffice.

That's a naive position to take. Demand creates a market which drives production. So it is the consumer who mandates the act that is being paid for.

A person is only guilty of what they actually cause.

Not what similar behavior might cause.

The production of this may be due to some customer or customers, and they are all accomplices.

But not every person who looks at it is responsible for the production.

As if by magic.

 

[Treedbear]

Is it immoral to view child pornagraphy in the privacy of one's own home?

Child pornography is about what one person does to another.

What one does to a child.

Looking at an image is not doing something to someone.

Morality doesn't enter the picture.

If one gets off looking at depictions of horrible exploitation then that is an issue of sanity and sadism, not morality.

People caught with child pornography should not be sent to prison. They should be taught normal empathy somehow though. If that is even possible. Minus that their picture in the paper should suffice.

Well it seems like putting their picture in the newspaper is an effort to shame them and to make an example to others. Similar to placing people in stocks in the town square during the 1700's. So it seems like a response to a moral issue. I don't know how you go about teaching them otherwise. They get to feel how demeaning it is and hopefully recognize that in others. That's how society deals with moral issues that aren't directly hurting others but tend to become that if not addressed. Morality is how we deal with the things we can't always address with laws.