Mueller investigation

[TSwizzle]

You know, TSwizzle, you can read the report yourself, which contains all the evidence.

I don't have enough interest in the subject, I am not obsessed with Trump.

Why take anyone's word for it? Afraid of what you may learn without the help of your handlers on Fox keeping you away from what's behind their smoke and mirrors? That is how I grew up. Church was all about protecting you from knowledge and trying to keep a steady-state. So, I am very familiar with all that.

FFS, do you people realize what you sound like ?

"Trumpettes" indeed.

 

[Gun Nut]

do you people realize what you sound like ?

Americans with an interest in honest discourse?
Opinions are great.. the thing of conversation and debate and such... growth comes from new ideas. It's called "learning".. that evil apple.
But no opinion that is based entirely on the "say so" of some random guy that is just making shit up can result in anything useful. Which is a polite way of saying, "your opinion does not matter because it based on lies".

 

[Angry Floof]

do you people realize what you sound like ?

Americans with an interest in honest discourse?
Opinions are great.. the thing of conversation and debate and such... growth comes from new ideas. It's called "learning".. that evil apple.
But no opinion that is based entirely on the "say so" of some random guy that is just making shit up can result in anything useful. Which is a polite way of saying, "your opinion does not matter because it based on lies".

Not everyone finds their way past good ol' American obedience training.

 

[ZiprHead]

Something I heard today on the Thom Hartmann program. During the impeachment process, the president loses his authority to pardon.

No he doesn't. He can still pardon anyone he wants, except himself. I believe that he cannot pardon himself under any circumstance... probably... it would go to the Supreme Court, who in the 70's already came to the conclusion that the President cannot pardon himself under any circumstance because "we are a nation of laws, not men, and no man is above the law".

There is so much legal precedent that uses male pronouns... It would have been interesting if it were Hillary in office responding to claims of wrongdoing simply by stating, "I am not a man, and therefore not bound by these laws". Maybe that wouldn't be very funny, actually.

the president "shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment."

I assume that's what Thom was talking about.

 

[ZiprHead]

Now the White House is ignoring subpoenas.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/22/politics/carl-kline-subpoena/index.html

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

You know, TSwizzle, you can read the report yourself, which contains all the evidence.

I don't have enough interest in the subject, I am not obsessed with Trump.

Why take anyone's word for it? Afraid of what you may learn without the help of your handlers on Fox keeping you away from what's behind their smoke and mirrors? That is how I grew up. Church was all about protecting you from knowledge and trying to keep a steady-state. So, I am very familiar with all that.

FFS, do you people realize what you sound like ?

"Trumpettes" indeed.

Let’s see, the birther movement, coffee salute gate, bowing to Saudi king gate, death panels, OMG deficit spending, secrut mooslim... etc...

Yeah, we sound no where near as partisanly neurotic as the right-wing.

 

[Patooka]

I don't have enough interest in the subject, I am not obsessed with Trump.



FFS, do you people realize what you sound like ?

"Trumpettes" indeed.

Let’s see, the birther movement, coffee salute gate, bowing to Saudi king gate, death panels, OMG deficit spending, secrut mooslim... etc...

Yeah, we sound no where near as partisanly neurotic as the right-wing.

You forgot Benjamin Ghazi, Jade Helm, false flag death threats against prominent Democrats and secret paedophile rings pretending to be pizza shops.

 

[Angry Floof]

I don't have enough interest in the subject, I am not obsessed with Trump.



FFS, do you people realize what you sound like ?

"Trumpettes" indeed.

Let’s see, the birther movement, coffee salute gate, bowing to Saudi king gate, death panels, OMG deficit spending, secrut mooslim... etc...

Yeah, we sound no where near as partisanly neurotic as the right-wing.

You forgot Benjamin Ghazi, Jade Helm, false flag death threats against prominent Democrats and secret paedophile rings pretending to be pizza shops.

You both forgot Tan Suit Gate and Obama's takin' all are gunz.

 

[Ford]

You forgot Benjamin Ghazi, Jade Helm, false flag death threats against prominent Democrats and secret paedophile rings pretending to be pizza shops.

You both forgot Tan Suit Gate and Obama's takin' all are gunz.

And Buttery Males.

 

[Copernicus]

the president "shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment."

I assume that's what Thom was talking about.

I don't know the history behind that exception, but, just based on the plain text, I would say that it means he cannot pardon government officials (such as judges) for crimes pertaining to an impeachment trial. It is implicit in the language of the Constitution that the president cannot pardon himself. It says that he can be criminally prosecuted for crimes committed in office after he leaves office. Congress has the responsibility of removing him from office, if it deems the president's offenses to be "high crimes and misdemeanors", whatever Congress thinks that means. However, if a president could pardon himself, that would nullify the Constitutional language that says he can be prosecuted after leaving office (by whatever means that comes about).

 

[Trausti]

However, if a president could pardon himself, that would nullify the Constitutional language that says he can be prosecuted after leaving office (by whatever means that comes about).

Well, he can pardon himself. He just can't undo an impeachment. (When federal judges are removed by the Senate for bad conduct they are "impeached.")

 

[Copernicus]

However, if a president could pardon himself, that would nullify the Constitutional language that says he can be prosecuted after leaving office (by whatever means that comes about).

Well, he can pardon himself. He just can't undo an impeachment. (When federal judges are removed by the Senate for bad conduct they are "impeached.")

Where did you get the impression that a president can pardon himself? There are no court rulings to support that position, and the language of the Constitution implies the exact opposite. If the founders intended the president to have the power to pardon himself, then much of what they say about his liability for misconduct would make no sense at all. It would mean that they intended for the president to be totally above the law, which they did not.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Self-Pardons: The President Can't Pardon Himself, So Why Do People Think He Can?

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

However, if a president could pardon himself, that would nullify the Constitutional language that says he can be prosecuted after leaving office (by whatever means that comes about).

Well, he can pardon himself. He just can't undo an impeachment. (When federal judges are removed by the Senate for bad conduct they are "impeached.")

Where did you get the impression that a president can pardon himself? ....

Trump Derangement Syndrome:

As has been stated by numerous legal scholars, I have the absolute right to PARDON myself, but why would I do that when I have done nothing wrong? In the meantime, the never ending Witch Hunt, led by 13 very Angry and Conflicted Democrats (& others) continues into the mid-terms!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump...me.com/5311182/donald-trump-self-pardon-poll/

 

[Keith&Co.]

Where did you get the impression that a president can pardon himself?

Imagine how Nixon's last term would have turned out if he availed himself of the superpardon.

Then used Ford's 'let's put it behind us' speech and had the country move on beyond Watergate.

Or Clinton. If he could have pardoned himself for the affair, and anything connected to it, the nation might have let it slide. "Well, Congress can't impeach him, now, but he DOES have to go home to Hillary, now..."
I can just see the political cartoons of Hillary throwing frying pans at Bill, as he tries to explain that he's been pardoned, honey!

 

[Angry Floof]

Self-Pardons: The President Can't Pardon Himself, So Why Do People Think He Can?

Why conservatives believe anything

 

[Patooka]

You forgot Benjamin Ghazi, Jade Helm, false flag death threats against prominent Democrats and secret paedophile rings pretending to be pizza shops.

You both forgot Tan Suit Gate and Obama's takin' all are gunz.

And Buttery Males.

I just realized. HOW THE FUCK DID WE ALL FORGET ABOUT THE ATROCITY THAT WAS BOWLING GREEN!!!!!!oneoneone. And you have all forgotten the rules of Project Trump:

1) You don't ask questions.
2) You don't ask questions.
3) Make excuses.
4) Make lies.
5) You have to trust Donald.

 

[Worldtraveller]

You are the picture perfect example of the voter who just wants to "pwn the libtards". No real thought, just pure hate. I have no doubt, even though you imply you didn't vote for Bonespurs the first time, that you did vote for him. Please, continue celebrating your ignorance and hatred. Its good to have stupid people self identify for all to know who they are.

Immature certainly but it is not out of hate. It's purely out of comic relief. "Bonespurs", "pwn the libtards" ?! Do you even listen to yourselves ? It's seriously hilarious.

I live in California, a state so democratic that my vote does not matter. However, I have never voted for a dem or repub for president, I ALWAYS vote for the libertarian candidate for president if there is one.

Feel free to pile on with more teeth gnashing angst. It amuses me.

Libertarian. Explains the immaturity.

As usual, the onion nails it!

https://www.theonion.com/computer-scientists-say-ai-s-underdeveloped-ethics-have-1834209623

 

[Gun Nut]

However, if a president could pardon himself, that would nullify the Constitutional language that says he can be prosecuted after leaving office (by whatever means that comes about).

Well, he can pardon himself. He just can't undo an impeachment. (When federal judges are removed by the Senate for bad conduct they are "impeached.")

Where did you get the impression that a president can pardon himself? There are no court rulings to support that position, and the language of the Constitution implies the exact opposite. If the founders intended the president to have the power to pardon himself, then much of what they say about his liability for misconduct would make no sense at all. It would mean that they intended for the president to be totally above the law, which they did not.

Even 16th Century England's Royal family was limited in the same way. The language in the Constitution that limits that power of the President was taken from ancient law preventing even Kings from being completely above the law.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Self-Pardons: The President Can't Pardon Himself, So Why Do People Think He Can?

Why conservatives believe anything

Interesting. It seems to confirm two suspicions; 1) that religion fucks up critical thinking abilities and 2) Russian clandestine influence warfare is effective (re: the destruction of a fact-based reality in general that has been at the heart of their efforts since 2014):

Part of the problem is widespread suspicion of facts—any facts. Both mistrust of scientists and other “experts” and mistrust of the mass media that reports what scientists and experts believe have increased among conservatives (but not among liberals) since the early ’80s. The mistrust has in part, at least, been deliberately inculcated. The fossil fuel industry publicizes studies to confuse the climate change debate; Big Pharma hides unfavorable information on drug safety and efficacy; and many schools in conservative areas teach students that evolution is “just a theory.” The public is understandably confused about both the findings and methods of science. “Fake news” deliberately created for political or economic gain and Donald Trump’s claims that media sites that disagree with him are “fake news” add to the mistrust.

But, the gullibility of many on the right seems to have deeper roots even than this. That may be because at the most basic level, conservatives and liberals seem to hold different beliefs about what constitutes “truth.” Finding facts and pursuing evidence and trusting science is part of liberal ideology itself. For many conservatives, faith and intuition and trust in revealed truth appear as equally valid sources of truth.

Potent combination.