NFL Caves, Pence Claims Victory For Trump.

[Harry Bosch]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

The football players are employees of the Franchise, are they not? The biggest problem is that Trump wanted to force employers to punish their employees regardless of their own choice, which happens to be against the law, I believe... unlike kneeling.

And currently, I think the NY Jets owner said he'd pay the fine as others would as well, I'd guess to hazard.

Agreed...

 

[Underseer]

Once again, Republicans are arguing that people who protest "shouldn't be in the country."

Remember: the freedom of speech only counts when you use it to defend Nazis!

 

[ZiprHead]

Brings up the point that was raised here oh so many months ago by Athena, iirc. Where is protesting by black people appropriate and approved by right-wingers?

 

[untermensche]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

Money over principles.

That is capitalism to a tee.

 

[untermensche]

I'm occasionally amazed at the level of ignorance here. This is one of those times. The first amendment prevents the government from punishing you for the content of your speech. It does not prevent an employer from firing you for speechifying on your job. The logic of this ought to be blindingly obvious. When you go to work for McDonalds you say what McDonalds wants you to say to customers. You are not free to deliver lectures about how horrible McDonalds food is to customers. You'd have to be serioisly mentally challenged to think otherwise.

You cannot own a person's mind.

You sick tyrant!

You can merely rent their labor.

And standing for some ridiculous song is not the job of a QB.

You can also set out the terms on which you will employ them.

You can set out what work you expect done during working hours for the money.

McDonalds having a policy that McDonalds cashiers can't deliver anti-McDonalds rants to McDonalds customers as they walk up to the counter is not "sick tyranny".

I agree with this.

NFL players should not be allowed to say bad things about the NFL during working hours.

 

[Harry Bosch]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

Money over principles.

That is capitalism to a tee.

It's just that when it comes to my business, satisfying the customer is my number one principle. All my competitors feel the same way...

 

[ZiprHead]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

Money over principles.

That is capitalism to a tee.

It's just that when it comes to my business, satisfying the customer is my number one principle. All my competitors feel the same way...

You don't have moral limits to fulfilling your customer's demands?

 

[untermensche]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

Money over principles.

That is capitalism to a tee.

It's just that when it comes to my business, satisfying the customer is my number one principle. All my competitors feel the same way...

We are all forced to survive in an unfair game of dog eat dog.

We actually have control.

And we could make a better system where people can maintain their moral integrity in the face of customers.

 

[Harry Bosch]

It's just that when it comes to my business, satisfying the customer is my number one principle. All my competitors feel the same way...

You don't have moral limits to fulfilling your customer's demands?

Well, of course I do. I'm exaggerating some. But if I had a salesman who routinely offended half of my customers, I'd find him/her a new place in the company.

 

[untermensche]

What if the customers were offended the salesman had a black wife?

What if they were offended because the salesman was gay?

 

[braces_for_impact]

It's football, it's the NFL. It's most popular in the South, and a lot of people don't like being reminded they are living in a racist society and benefit from said society. This is why it's allowed to stay in the locker room in protest because no one can see you protest in there, and that's what the NFL cares about. They want to avoid bad publicity form their mostly troglodyte base. Yes, it is legal. I disagree with it, but it is legal. I'll be interested to see if any players simply turn away from flag during the national anthem. Somebody missed that in the wording of the rules.

 

[dismal]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

The football players are employees of the Franchise, are they not? The biggest problem is that Trump wanted to force employers to punish their employees regardless of their own choice, which happens to be against the law, I believe... unlike kneeling.

And currently, I think the NY Jets owner said he'd pay the fine as others would as well, I'd guess to hazard.

Trump, Trump, Trump,Trump, Trumpy, Trumpity-Trump.

Seriously, you need to get a sanity check. This has little or nothing to do with Trump.

 

[RavenSky]

It is government sanctioned suppression of expression. If the government sits back and permits it.

If the government sits back and permits murder it is sanctioning murder.

It is as if the government were doing it.

And that's not unconstitutional?

The US Constitution has a First Amendment.

First Amendment doesn’t cover the workplace.

Forced "patriotism" has no place in the workplace either

I love what the Jets CEO said, especially since his brother, the owner, turned over control to him in order to become 45’s ambassador to the UK. That’s a big F U.

Me too (and learning that his brother works for Trump makes it even more delicious)

 

[RavenSky]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

Just as many are currently furious with the NFL for taking this position. Twitter has been filled with people vowing to boycott or take the knee themselves at the games.

 

[Axulus]

Based on unter's logic, employers are taking away employee rights and violating the 2nd amendment when they prohibit guns on the workplace.

Oh right, I forgot the only rights and amendments that unter cares about are those he likes and employer rules he hates are those he disagrees with (and vice versa)

 

[untermensche]

Based on unter's logic, employers are taking away employee rights and violating the 2nd amendment when they prohibit guns on the workplace.

According to the 2nd Amendment people should be allowed to bring guns wherever they choose.

Onto planes and into bars and into work.

I agree all restrictions of the 2nd Amendment violate it.

It is a primitive outdated Amendment that should be overturned but that is another matter.

 

[ZiprHead]

I'll be interested to see if any players simply turn away from flag during the national anthem. Somebody missed that in the wording of the rules.

That was my first thought too.

 

[Tristan Scott]

I hate to say it, but I've changed my mind. I dislike Trump so much that I hate to see him win all the time. However, I agree with the NFL. The NFL relies on fans to purchase their tickets, watch their sponsors, buy their products, and etc. Some of those fans, probably a great deal of them, are deeply offended by the kneeling. The NFL is like all other companies, they are trying to maximize their profit. As I think about it, I do the same! I own a small medical manufacturing company. I have three full time salesmen. If one of them offended a customer - we'd have a big problem. I wouldn't allow it. I can't afford to allow it. Companies have to satisfy their customers - or they will be out of business.

Money over principles.

That is capitalism to a tee.

This^^^

 

[Harry Bosch]

What if the customers were offended the salesman had a black wife?

What if they were offended because the salesman was gay?

I wouldn't want to go into business with a customer who didn't like black people or a person who is gay. But here's the deal facing every business in America: at least 35% of the country is a Trump supporter. There's no way that I can employ salespeople who would offend 35% of our possible client base! I support Colin's basic political points. I support his right to protest. But I wouldn't hire him as a salesperson.

 

[southernhybrid]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000934062/article/nfls-national-anthem-policy-leaves-room-for-more-controversy

The NFL Players Association issued a statement Wednesday noting that it was not consulted on the new policy and saying it would watch closely what the league and team rules will be, to see if they violate the collective bargaining agreement. Unsaid: The union is prepared to file a grievance if it believes the rules or team punishment are out of line. That was almost certainly a consideration as owners crafted the new policy. Owners likely believed that discipline of a player by the league would be much more vulnerable to scrutiny under the CBA than team discipline.

The next few months of the offseason will be critical, though, if the league hopes to avoid a repeat of last year, when the controversy over player protests nearly engulfed the entire season. Owners will return to their teams and talk to their players in the coming weeks and go about the task of crafting rules that will likely reflect the owners -- and, perhaps more importantly, the market they represent.

Some players are saying they will hold up fists as a protest. The fight isn't over. It's outrageous to tell grown adults how they must respond to the national anthem.