Police shooting in Atlanta aka "Sir, this is a Wendy's drive-through"

[Derec]

You wrote "Remember, he just witnessed Brooks giving the other officer a concussion." not me.

I did not mean as in medical diagnosis, but he did see Brook punching a fellow officer.

Lethal force should be used against lethal threats. Mr Brooks was not a lethal threat, unless you think black man means lethal threat.

A person of any race or gender is a significant threat armed with a taser, especially when they have already demonstrated willingness to use violence and when they have turned around to shoot the stolen taser.

Of course it was. You explicitly brought it up with "it was alright because he was white" bullshit.

That was sarcasm. But I forgot, you Marxists are inherently sarcasm challenged.

No, that case does not disprove it.

It does. It shows that an officer is allowed to respond with lethal force to a taser.

First, the suspect was not fleeing in that case, but actively fighting.

Not relevant to the question of whether an officer may respond with deadly force to an attack with a taser.

Second, the suspect was not killed.

Not relevant. He was still shot. It was just his dumb luck that he lived.

 

[Derec]

So basically you have no real rational response, just hate and vitriol.

No, unironic accusations of "cultural appropriation" are sadly all too real in our "woke" culture.

 

[laughing dog]

I did not mean as in medical diagnosis, but he did see Brook punching a fellow officer.

In other words, you were simply bsing.

A person of any race or gender is a significant threat armed with a taser, especially when they have already demonstrated willingness to use violence and when they have turned around to shoot the stolen taser.

A significant threat is not the same as a lethal threat.

That was sarcasm. But I forgot, you Marxists are inherently sarcasm challenged.

I am as much a Marxist as you are a card carrying member of the KKK.

It does. It shows that an officer is allowed to respond with lethal force to a taser.

Wrong, see below.

Not relevant to the question of whether an officer may respond with deadly force to an attack with a taser.

Of course it is relevant to the issue. Unlike Mr Brooks who was fleeing, these two were fighting.

 

[Derec]

In other words, you were simply bsing.

Not at all. A perp who punches an officer is a threat per se.
You can lie about him not being a threat all you want, you can split hairs about medical diagnoses, but Rayshard Brooks most certainly was a threat.

A significant threat is not the same as a lethal threat.

And as we have seen from Dalton, GA an immediate lethal threat is not required. Paul Howard is playing politics because he is behind the 8-ball in the primary and wants the cop-hater vote.
A perp who temporarily disables a police officer with a taser can easily steal his gun. Not to mention that tasers can themselves be deadly on rare occasions.

I am as much a Marxist as you are a card carrying member of the KKK.

I don't believe you.

Of course it is relevant to the issue. Unlike Mr Brooks who was fleeing, these two were fighting.

Brooks wasn't just fleeing. He fired the taser at Rolfe.

 

[Derec]

OPINION: Why no outrage? Atlanta shootings surge, but it’s not the cops

Councilman Antonio Brown, who represents the district just west of downtown, was getting ready to speak in the virtual meeting when he told the chief: “I was just notified there was a young man who was just shot and killed at 377 Westchester Boulevard. Can you get a unit out there? He’s been on the ground and there’s no police who have come. He’s dead already, he’s on the ground and the residents have put a sheet over him and the police still haven’t arrived.”It sounds like Afghanistan: Can you please come and pick up the body?

It's a farce
- "defund and abolish the police"
(dead body appears)
"where are these cops" ...

On June 13, as angry protesters milled around the south Atlanta Wendy’s the day after Rayshard Brooks was shot in the parking lot by a cop — and hours before the restaurant was burned down — there was a wild shootout in the Edgewood neighborhood in east Atlanta. Five people were wounded and two were killed. Residents reported hearing perhaps 40 gunshots.Earlier this month, the owners of a bar in the popular Edgewood Avenue nightlife district posted a photo online of the business’s window smashed by a bullet. They said they felt unsafe and were closing “until the city gets its #@&! together.”
[...]
Violence is off the chain in Atlanta.During the first three weeks of this month — May 31 to June 20 — 75 people have been shot in Atlanta. Last year during that period, 35 people were shot in the city.At this rate it’ll be 100 shot by July.
[...]
These are not police shootings. They’re civilians shooting civilians. They don’t carry the outrage and notoriety that a cop shooting someone will. But the victims are just as dead.

 

[laughing dog]

Not at all. A perp who punches an officer is a threat per se.

You were bsing about the concussion.

You can lie about him not being a threat all you want, you can split hairs about medical diagnoses, but Rayshard Brooks most certainly was.

I said he was not a lethal threat. Please try to focus.

And as we have seen from Dalton, GA an immediate lethal threat is not required.

You are not the king, and the Dalton GA situation was different.

A perp who temporarily disables a police officer with a taser can easily steal his gun.

Not when he is running away from the officer.

Not to mention that tasers can themselves be deadly on rare occasions.

So, tasers are not deadly when the police use them but are when others do.

 

[Derec]

You were bsing about the concussion.

Concussion was reported elsewhere. In any case, Rolfe saw a fellow officer getting punched hard enough to cause a concussion.

You do not have a point, so you endlessly split hairs about the concussion. That is always your debating tactic and it is very transparent. Regardless, Rayshard Brooks was a threat.

I said he was not a lethal threat. Please try to focus.

Anybody attacking a police officer is potentially a lethal threat as they can disarm the officer.
Which is for example why shooting of Michael Brown was justified.

You are not the king, and the Dalton GA situation was different.

Who said anything about being a king? It's an example of a similar case in the same state. No two cases will be exactly alike of course, but they are substantially similar.

Not when he is running away from the officer.

He could have easily stopped and reversed had he successfully tased Rolfe.

So, tasers are not deadly when the police use them but are when others do.

No matter who uses it there is a finite

So, does that mean you are member of the KKK or not?

Of course not. But I believe you are a Marxist.

 

[laughing dog]

Concussion was reported elsewhere. In any case, Rolfe saw a fellow officer getting punched hard enough to cause a concussion.

You do not have a point, so you endlessly split hairs about the concussion.

Your backpedalling about the concussion is still bs. You are the one who is big on accurate context and you brought up the bs about a concussion. I was simply correcting your factually incorrect context.

Anybody attacking a police officer is potentially a lethal threat as they can disarm the officer.

While running away?

Who said anything about being a king? It's an example of a similar case in the same state. No two cases will be exactly alike of course, but they are substantially similar.

We disagree.

He could have easily stopped and reversed had he successfully tased Rolfe.

I doubt you actually believe that one.

No matter who uses it there is a finite

That appears to be an incomplete sentence.

Of course not. But I believe you are a Marxist.

I am fairly certain you do not know what a Marxist is. Karl Marx did have some valid insights about capitalism, but that does not make me a Marxist. Your tactic is similar to right wing demagogues and the KKK.

 

[J842P]

I am as much a Marxist as you are a card carrying member of the KKK.

I don't believe you.

Seriously? Laughing dog is very clearly not a Marxist, for fuck's sake.

 

[Derec]

The cops who killed Rayshard Brooks aren’t guilty of murder; the prosecutor is guilty of malpractice

Fortunately for Rolfe and Brosnan, multiple videos captured the 40 minutes of interaction between them and Brooks. The cops were making a lawful arrest for DUI and the videos show their valid response to the deadly situation created by Brooks. Yet Atlanta District Attorney Paul Howard ordered both cops arrested and announced 11 charges against Rolfe, including felony murder. Howard filed these charges at a time when he is in danger of losing his reelection bid, and under criminal investigation himself for allegedly using a nonprofit to funnel $140,000 of Atlanta funds to supplement his salary.
Howard should face serious repercussions for irresponsibly bringing these charges.
The charges against Rolfe boil down to whether under Georgia law, the taser is a “deadly weapon.” The answer lies with Howard. Just 10 days before Rolfe’s arrest, Howard announced that he had charged several Atlanta cops with excessive force involving a taser. CNN reported that the taser is referred to as a “deadly weapon” in those arrest reports. At that press conference, Howard stated unequivocally that “under Georgia law, a taser is considered as a deadly weapon.” Apparently, for Howard, it’s not a deadly weapon if it’s used against a cop.
In attempting to justify Rolfe and Brosnan’s arrests, Howard claimed that “Mr. Brooks never displayed any aggressive behavior.” Was that before or after Brooks fought the two officers, grabbed one of their tasers, and then fired it at the other? Howard then claimed that the cops didn’t follow procedure in informing Brooks of the reason for his arrest.

That last part is really a whopper. I don't know how anybody can watch the video and claim that Brooks "never displayed any aggressive behavior".

Atlanta detective says Rayshard Brooks would have faced 10 charges for altercation that led to police shooting

[ATLPD detective Hogan said Brooks would have been charged with DUI, two counts of felony obstruction, two counts of aggravated assault against a police officer, two counts of battery against a police officer, theft by taking, removal of a weapon from a public official, and robbery.

In Prosecuting Police, Atlanta DA Has Contradictory Stance on Taser's Deadliness, Defense Says

Defense lawyers who secured a $500,000 bond Tuesday for the fired Atlanta police officer who fatally shot Rayshard Brooks said the shooting was justified based on an earlier determination by District Attorney Paul Howard that a taser is a deadly weapon.
The defense also criticized Howard during Tuesday’s hearing for previously making two stunning allegations when announcing felony charges against officers Garrett Rolfe and Devin Bronson at June 17 news conference. Rolfe attorney Noah Pines said his client never kicked Brooks as he lay dying on the pavement and never uttered the phrase, “I got him,” after shooting Brooks twice in the back, as Howard claimed.
[...]
Howard filed multiple felonies against the officers after two college students—Messiah Young and Taniyah Pilgrim—were tasered and dragged from their car during demonstrations in downtown Atlanta on May 30 as police sought to enforce a curfew. Young also suffered a broken wrist and a gash that required stitches, and both students were handcuffed for hours in a police van while being denied protective masks. The warrant justified the felony charges in those cases by describing the taser as a deadly weapon

The hypocrisy here is stunning.

But Pines said Brooks was shot after he committed multiple felonies as he fought the officers after Rolfe attempted to handcuff him for being too intoxicated to drive. Brooks punched Rolfe in the face, knocked Brosnan to the pavement so hard he suffered a concussion, wrested away Brosnan’s taser and tasered the officer, then fired the taser at Rolfe as he ran, Pines said. Brooks was shot just after turning and firing the taser at Rolfe in what Pines contended was an aggravated assault.

"Never displayed any aggressive behavior", eh? Paul Howard is such a Nifong!

 

[Derec]

So it wasn't just the girlfriend who burned down that Wendy's.
These two cats helped.
BREAKING: Atlanta protest organizer among 2 more arrested in Wendy’s arson

An Atlanta protest organizer is one of two people who were arrested on arson charges Thursday in connection with the fire at the Wendy’s where Rayshard Brooks was killed, authorities said. Atlanta fire spokesman Sgt. Cortez Stafford confirmed that John Wade, 33, and Chisom Kingston, 23, have both been taken into custody in connection with the June 13 blaze. Wade was one of several people who organized large demonstrations across Atlanta in the wake of George Floyd’s death at the hands of Minneapolis police, authorities confirmed.

Just to remind you guys, this is the girlfriend, Natalie White:
Bodycam: Natalie White involved in violent domestic outburst 2 months before arrest for arson

 

[Jayjay]

The irony is that the girlfriend could have prevented Rayshard's death had she made sure he wasn't going to drive that night... but apparently she blames Wendy's for calling the cops instead.

 

[Derec]

The irony is that the girlfriend could have prevented Rayshard's death had she made sure he wasn't going to drive that night... but apparently she blames Wendy's for calling the cops instead.

Yupp. If they were both drunk, they should have gotten a GrubHub or something.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

From Derec's link:

The report goes on to state that an officer provided White a courtesy ride home without incident. White's interaction highlights a stark difference in the treatment Rayshard Brooks received before being fatally shot on June 12 at the Wendy's on University Avenue.

Though he was compliant in talking with officers and participated in several field sobriety tests, he was never offered a ride home; not even when he suggested leaving his car in the parking lot and walking home.

 

[J842P]

From Derec's link:

The report goes on to state that an officer provided White a courtesy ride home without incident. White's interaction highlights a stark difference in the treatment Rayshard Brooks received before being fatally shot on June 12 at the Wendy's on University Avenue.

Though he was compliant in talking with officers and participated in several field sobriety tests, he was never offered a ride home; not even when he suggested leaving his car in the parking lot and walking home.

What absurd point are you trying to make?

That is because almost everywhere in the USA a DUI will result in your arrest and booking in jail. Happened to me, happened to everyone I know who has gotten a DUI.

 

[laughing dog]

From Derec's link:

The report goes on to state that an officer provided White a courtesy ride home without incident. White's interaction highlights a stark difference in the treatment Rayshard Brooks received before being fatally shot on June 12 at the Wendy's on University Avenue.

Though he was compliant in talking with officers and participated in several field sobriety tests, he was never offered a ride home; not even when he suggested leaving his car in the parking lot and walking home.

What absurd point are you trying to make?

That is because almost everywhere in the USA a DUI will result in your arrest and booking in jail. Happened to me, happened to everyone I know who has gotten a DUI.

I think the point is not absurd at all. Ms White was offered a ride home (even though there is reason to believe she may have been drunk because the officers smelled alcohol on her breath) while Mr. Brooks was not.

To make the point even clearer. The officer in Mr. Brooks situation choose to give field sobriety tests. In fact, if you watch the body cam video, he badgered Mr. Brooks into a breathalyzer test. In Ms. White's situation, even though the officers smelled alcohol on her breath, apparently they did not choose to administer any field sobriety tests, and ended up offering her a ride home.

I think the implication is clear - Mr. Rolfe could have chosen to offer Mr. Brooks a ride home instead of badgering him to take the breathalyzer test.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

From Derec's link:

The report goes on to state that an officer provided White a courtesy ride home without incident. White's interaction highlights a stark difference in the treatment Rayshard Brooks received before being fatally shot on June 12 at the Wendy's on University Avenue.

Though he was compliant in talking with officers and participated in several field sobriety tests, he was never offered a ride home; not even when he suggested leaving his car in the parking lot and walking home.

What absurd point are you trying to make?

That is because almost everywhere in the USA a DUI will result in your arrest and booking in jail. Happened to me, happened to everyone I know who has gotten a DUI.

She was behaving erratically, violent to property, violent to persons, trying to operate a motor vehicle but failing, having problems following orders, and smelled of alcohol. Merely one of these factors was adequate to reasonably be suspicious of drugs or alcohol, not to mention crimes such as disturbing the peace and other discretionary crimes police can charge a person with. Yet, no sobriety test.

As someone who has gotten a DUI, I expect you to not be offended by my quoting a paragraph, but instead by the inconsistent actions of the executive branch of government, giving YOU a DUI charge, but not even testing this person for drugs or alcohol.

Don't shoot the messenger!

 

[Derec]

She was behaving erratically, violent to property, violent to persons,

And the victim refused to press charges. That is different than a crime such as DUI.

trying to operate a motor vehicle but failing,

Where does it say in the article that she tried to operate a motor vehicle?

having problems following orders, and smelled of alcohol. Merely one of these factors was adequate to reasonably be suspicious of drugs or alcohol, not to mention crimes such as disturbing the peace and other discretionary crimes police can charge a person with. Yet, no sobriety test.

Being drunk by itself is not a crime.

s someone who has gotten a DUI, I expect you to not be offended by my quoting a paragraph, but instead by the inconsistent actions of the executive branch of government, giving YOU a DUI charge, but not even testing this person for drugs or alcohol.

Two different governments, two different cities in two different counties. Rayshard Brooks was in Atlanta in Fulton County and this was in Norcross in Gwinnett County.

Also the details of the cases are quite different, but if White got preferential treatment it is far more likely to be for her being a woman than her being white.

 

[Derec]

I think the point is not absurd at all. Ms White was offered a ride home (even though there is reason to believe she may have been drunk because the officers smelled alcohol on her breath) while Mr. Brooks was not.

Being drunk is not a crime per se. Unlike Brooks she wasn't found passed out behind the wheel of a car in a drive through lane.

To make the point even clearer. The officer in Mr. Brooks situation choose to give field sobriety tests. In fact, if you watch the body cam video, he badgered Mr. Brooks into a breathalyzer test.

Again, Brooks was strongly suspected of driving drunk. A field sobriety test and administering a breathalyzer is completely appropriate. Letting drunk drivers go is not.

In Ms. White's situation, even though the officers smelled alcohol on her breath, apparently they did not choose to administer any field sobriety tests, and ended up offering her a ride home.

She wasn't driving.

I think the implication is clear - Mr. Rolfe could have chosen to offer Mr. Brooks a ride home instead of badgering him to take the breathalyzer test.

The implication is as clear as it is wrong. Rolfe should not have offered Brooks a ride home as drunk driving is a dangerous crime. Brooks could have killed somebody, especially if he had passed out before he reached the Wendy's.

It's amazing how people here (and elsewhere - for example CBS 46) downplay drunk driving as no big deal just because a drunk driver got shot. The same happened with people downplaying strongarm robbery in order to defend Michael Brown.

 

[Derec]

From Derec's link:

Any particular reason for the oversized font?

The report goes on to state that an officer provided White a courtesy ride home without incident. White's interaction highlights a stark difference in the treatment Rayshard Brooks received before being fatally shot on June 12 at the Wendy's on University Avenue.

Just the writer stirring some shit and comparing apples to oranges.
Different crimes (DUI vs a domestic disturbance) and different jurisdictions (Atlanta/Fulton vs. Norcross/Gwinnett). No cop would or at least should offer a drunk driver a ride home.

Though he was compliant in talking with officers and participated in several field sobriety tests, he was never offered a ride home; not even when he suggested leaving his car in the parking lot and walking home.

He failed the field sobriety test. He failed the breathalyzer. At that point there was probable cause for an arrest for DUI. Why should he have been offered a ride home exactly?

Something else from the article:

"I came here to talk, we were suppose to have a conversation [about] our relationship. You know, just domestic f--king dispute that go on every f--king day,"

What she should have said, channeling Willie the Alligator Man: "No, no, that's the wrong house. We're not domestic. We're not even married."