Questions For Women

[thebeave]

I agree it could be read that way. I tried to express my thought with the words “sounds like”. The tone should have come across quizzically rather than critically.

Or: you could have expressed sympathy with the fact that women in the US and much of the rest of the world are expected to wear an undergarment that requires some maneuvering to put on.

Or simply said: I did not know that.

I mean, personally, jock straps always confused me. And cups. I mean, how did they not hurt? For that matter, as a child I was quite confused how boys managed to run or climb trees or do anything at all with a penis dangling between their legs. Aside from the convenience of being able to pee on a tree or fire hydrant instead of running inside to the bathroom, a penis seemed quite uncomfortable a thing to have. But these were not questions that girls were supposed to ask back in the days of jock straps and cups....

So, whatever my husband tells me about them, I simply take as gospel, without question. He has assured me, several times, that underwear is sufficient to control the bobbing about of boy parts when they run and play.

It can be, for sure. It's why we have to have our legs apart when we sit down (i.e. "manspreading"). Thankfully, there are feminists who are doing what they can to keep us slouchy guys in line and sitting dignified:

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/women/manspreading-chair-design-laila-laurel-award-brighton-university-a9008746.html

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I have 3 pairs of the exact same Levi's. They are all the same size and they are slightly different in the way that they fit. My husband used to be a manufacturing engineer. His original background was in clothing. I think I remember him telling me that size differences are often due to where the clothing is manufactured. One company he worked for had operations in Costa Rica, Mexico and China. I guess each plant might size a little bit differently.

Yeah, there are always differences. Good brands should minimize them, though.

Since Loren and I were disagreeing about compression sleeves, let me add, that mine never fold over or slip down. I wear some that are made of bamboo. Some of mine are about five years old and are just starting to become a bit stretched out. They are quite comfortable and protective enough to help my pain. My knees are bone on bone. I refuse knee replacement surgery, but I am finally going to have gel injections next month as several other older women I know, have claimed that they work well for pain. They usually last about 6 months. Medicare covers the cost. Just adding that in case anyone else here is having knee issues and doesn't want surgery.

I've just got some sort of quirky extension issue--a quick step, especially slightly downhill can leave my knee suddenly in pain for maybe an hour. The compression sleeves I wear make this maybe 30 seconds if that. I have another one that squeezes a bit harder and completely eliminates the issue--but it rubs wrong, I can't stand more than about 5 miles with it. Walking slower on flat ground I have no need of them.

Please don't take this as criticism or bragging. But, I found that aerobic exercise has increased my metabolism so much that I now worry more about losing too much weight, instead of gaining too much weight. I used to think it was bunk when I was told that your metabolism stays higher several hours after you finish your workout, but I think it may be true.

During the pandemic, I increased my workouts from 3 days a week to 7 days a week. I lost ten pounds and I eat more now than I did before I increased the workouts. I just use Leslie Sansone's DVDs. She's a bit annoying but the workouts are easy to follow and they work. They were using them at our senior center, but when it shut down due to the pandemic, I started using some that I had ordered from Amazon or had previously bought in a store. Even with bad knees, I can do them, as long as I take an analgesic about an hour prior to beginning.

No idea on frequent workouts--for me, exercise means hiking. Usually only once a week--but often 10+ miles.

Working out has all but eliminated by neck and back pain. As long as I wear compression sleeves on my knees, I can tolerate the pain. I don't mean to sound like an exercise evangelist, but I've read several articles that give evidence that exercise is more important that what you weigh. So, for Toni or anyone else who is concerned about gaining weight or just needs to be more active, please consider aerobic workouts. I'd do fast walking but my feet are also arthritic and bending them while walking is too painful. Walking in place and doing dance steps is very tolerable. Forgive me for preaching about exercise. I just want everyone to be healthier. We were made to move!

Yup, everyone should do something.

Men usually don't like Leslie's workouts. Whenever a man would join our group, he would rarely stay around very long. My husband joined us for about a year, but now he takes a 2 mile walk every morning with one of our dogs. I started out that way when I was about 50, but once the foot arthritis set in, I had to do something else. I miss walking around the neighborhood, but one must do whatever works best.

Walking out in nature is far better than walking around the neighborhood.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Are you my sister-in-law?? My wife used to eat like a horse (my favorite illustration was maybe 25 years ago, buffet line. One person ended up between us, he saw her plate and commented to me that she must have a hollow leg--and my reply: yes, and that will fill up one of them. I knew she would get three plates, although the last wouldn't have as much on it) and her young adult weight was under 90 pounds. She has one sister that's about her size, the other two have been in the overweight category as long as I've known them.

Ok I should qualify that: I ate like a teenage girl horse up until my30’s. Nothing at all compared with my husband or sons. But back in the day, I would drop a few pounds if I stayed up too late or skipped a meal. At one point I had to be careful because if I dropped below 93 or 94 lbs, I’d just keep losing weight. I generally stayed at 98-102. If I hit 105, I felt chubby. I’m short and have a slight frame so even a small change in weight was noticeable. Alas! Those days are gone.

I was just joking because what you describe sounded so much like my wife. My parents didn't believe me when I told them she outate me (even though I'm a bit over 50% bigger than she is.) It didn't take them long to see I was right. From what she tells me as a young adult she ate even more than I've known her to eat--there were never leftovers with her around and she's the eldest of 7. And she was in her 50s in the buffet incident I described upthread.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Today my girlfriend was recycling bottles and putting them into the machine. She accidentally put the bottle in the wrong hole.

I said "see, it's not that easy".

I was very proud of that quip

 

[Toni]

I agree it could be read that way. I tried to express my thought with the words “sounds like”. The tone should have come across quizzically rather than critically.

Or: you could have expressed sympathy with the fact that women in the US and much of the rest of the world are expected to wear an undergarment that requires some maneuvering to put on.

Or simply said: I did not know that.

I mean, personally, jock straps always confused me. And cups. I mean, how did they not hurt? For that matter, as a child I was quite confused how boys managed to run or climb trees or do anything at all with a penis dangling between their legs. Aside from the convenience of being able to pee on a tree or fire hydrant instead of running inside to the bathroom, a penis seemed quite uncomfortable a thing to have. But these were not questions that girls were supposed to ask back in the days of jock straps and cups....

So, whatever my husband tells me about them, I simply take as gospel, without question. He has assured me, several times, that underwear is sufficient to control the bobbing about of boy parts when they run and play.

It can be, for sure. It's why we have to have our legs apart when we sit down (i.e. "manspreading"). Thankfully, there are feminists who are doing what they can to keep us slouchy guys in line and sitting dignified:

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/women/manspreading-chair-design-laila-laurel-award-brighton-university-a9008746.html

Just read this and glanced over at my husband who is sitting, reading the newspaper, with his legs.......not spread out to take up the entire sofa. In fact, if he had been wearing baggy shorts, I'm pretty sure I could not have seen his underwear or dangly bits.

Co-workers and I were talking about this one day as we looked around the lab and noted exactly one man sitting so that he was manspreading--something that he habitually did. Not just his legs, but also his arms wide spread, taking up as much room as possible. None of the other men did. He was, indeed, a nasty asshole who was always trying, in various ways, to assert his dominance over all of his coworkers except admin. who had the authority to discipline him. A couple of people knew him outside of work and one or two had known him since they were kids. According to them, that's how he always was.

Interesting bit: As a private 'experiment' the next time we were working alone, I made sure that I also sat with my legs spread really wide. It wasn't immodest: wearing long pants, baggy lab coat, etc. I just made a point of positioning myself so that I took up as much physical space as possible. Didn't change a single other thing about how I did my job or interacted with him. I just made sure that I physically took up as much room as possible.

It was weird: He didn't do that manspreading thing that day. He never did that manspreading thing again with me. Also quit trying to dump extra work on me.

I have no idea why.

 

[ZiprHead]

Here's a question for women that I hope doesn't devolve into a stand-off.

To my mind, a front-clasp bra would be easier for a woman to put on and off, but they seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Am I wrong about that, or is there some other reason that most bras are rear-clasp?

This has nothing to do about access for a significant other--just everyday wear.

When a woman wears a bra that clasps in the back, it's really quite simple. She just clasps it in the front, then simply turns the bra around, and pulls the strap over her shoulders.

What I have always thought were repulsive, are those underwire bras, but I won't judge my female peers if that's what they prefer to wear. What works for one woman, doesn't work for all. We should all wear what we find to be the most comfortable, even if that means going braless.

Why do some men wear boxer shorts, while other wear bikini style underwear? There are many styles of underpants for both men and women. Who cares what one chooses to wear? I certainly don't.

This and the words that make no sense thread kinda' go together. The other day the wife was telling me she was getting dressed for work and for some reason she forgot how to put on her bra.

 

[Rhea]

Here is a question, are women against wearing loose pants because they think tight pants are comfortable?

It's tough, unless you are under 20 and 5'10+, weighing under 120 lbs. Too loose and you look shorter and dumpier and no one wants that. Too tight and you look like you bought your pants 20 lbs (or more) ago and nobody wants that.

I like loose pants. And I don’t care what people think I look like, honestly.
I used to be VERY skinny and I liked loose pants. Now I am overweight, and I like loose pants.
My professional shopper hates this for me, and always tries to get me to try on the snug pants. “Get one size smaller,” she says, “really.” And the shop-keeper agrees. But I really don’t like that. I like the way men’s pants look. Well, previous style men’s pants. Now they all have the skinny-pant look. Which looks fine on people and I like the way it looks on them, it’s just not what I like for me.


For me it is all about...

It can be really, really, really tough to find a pair of jeans or pants that [...] have convenient and sufficiently deep pockets

Pockets.

LLbean Chinos have great pockets. The fit is not absolutely perfect, but the pockets are. So I buy them.

 

[Rhea]

I'm surprised. I've seen that sort of size variability with no-name clothes (as a teenager I once bought a 30 and a 34 on the same day), but I exclusively buy Levi's jeans these days--and I can absolutely trust the fit from pair to pair.

With women’s levis, they change the fit from time to time and it’s a pain. Same length, yes. Same waist, yes. But they went and changed the hips and seat and now everything is wrong.


Or those awful “low-rise” versions they have now.
Not a fan!

 

[Rhea]

Women have to be prepared to do our own hemming. Worse, I have had to explain over and over to a few women why I can't just wear regular sizes. I'm no longer petite in terms of girth but I haven't grown any taller.

Well petite is ONLY height. You can buy Plus sized Petite.
I have trouble with arm-lengths, too.

Unfortunately for me, my metabolism took a nosedive some years ago and I haven't been able to drop pounds I've picked up. Before, I ate like a horse and weighed....under 100 soaking wet. Now, I am much more moderate in my eating habits but alas, although I swore I would never gain weight like a lot of my family members, it was a promise I could not keep.

Feel you. Ditto.

 

[Rhea]

Here's a question for women that I hope doesn't devolve into a stand-off.

To my mind, a front-clasp bra would be easier for a woman to put on and off, but they seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Am I wrong about that, or is there some other reason that most bras are rear-clasp?

It’s the discomfort of the stiff clasp mechanism on your front side where you bend and move.

All clasp mechanisms are inherently bulkier and more stiff than a strip of elastic. So if you put it on the front, you’ll press against it whenever you bring your arms forward (like driving, lifting, typing) and whenever you bend forward (lifting, gardening, reaching). Whereas if that inch-wide mechanism is lying across your flat back, you won’t ever feel it.

In addition to the stiffness, clasp mechanisms are also inherently less airy, so you have a sweat spot that also itches.

Turning the bra around when putting it on is a miniscule effort compared to shifting, pinching and scratching all day. This is true no matter what the weight or boob size is involved.

 

[James Brown]

Here's a question for women that I hope doesn't devolve into a stand-off.

To my mind, a front-clasp bra would be easier for a woman to put on and off, but they seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Am I wrong about that, or is there some other reason that most bras are rear-clasp?

It’s the discomfort of the stiff clasp mechanism on your front side where you bend and move.

All clasp mechanisms are inherently bulkier and more stiff than a strip of elastic. So if you put it on the front, you’ll press against it whenever you bring your arms forward (like driving, lifting, typing) and whenever you bend forward (lifting, gardening, reaching). Whereas if that inch-wide mechanism is lying across your flat back, you won’t ever feel it.

In addition to the stiffness, clasp mechanisms are also inherently less airy, so you have a sweat spot that also itches.

Turning the bra around when putting it on is a miniscule effort compared to shifting, pinching and scratching all day. This is true no matter what the weight or boob size is involved.

Thanks. Makes sense.

 

[southernhybrid]

I just want to add that every women should dress exactly the way she likes, without any worries about pleasing someone else. A woman doesn't need to please or attract men or to please her partner. Besides that, a good partner is never critical of how a woman dresses. I know that because I have a good partner and in 40 years he has never told me how to dress and he has never criticized my choices in clothing.

I've never criticized the way he dresses either. That's what it's really all about, not why do women do this or that. Women do what they feel is best for them. I like what Rhea said. Despite someone else telling her what to wear, she chooses to wear what she likes and she doesn't care what anyone else thinks about her choices. That's what I'm talking about. An emotionally secure woman with good self esteem doesn't need anyone else's approval for her style choices.

 

[Toni]

I just want to add that every women should dress exactly the way she likes, without any worries about pleasing someone else. A woman doesn't need to please or attract men or to please her partner. Besides that, a good partner is never critical of how a woman dresses. I know that because I have a good partner and in 40 years he has never told me how to dress and he has never criticized my choices in clothing.

I've never criticized the way he dresses either. That's what it's really all about, not why do women do this or that. Women do what they feel is best for them. I like what Rhea said. Despite someone else telling her what to wear, she chooses to wear what she likes and she doesn't care what anyone else thinks about her choices. That's what I'm talking about. An emotionally secure woman with good self esteem doesn't need anyone else's approval for her style choices.

I confess I'm a little in awe of Rhea having a personal shopper. I'd have no problem rejecting suggestions but it would be nice to have an objective eye and someone who knows what looks good and what's 'in' for someone my age vs under 25.

 

[Rhea]

I confess I'm a little in awe of Rhea having a personal shopper. I'd have no problem rejecting suggestions but it would be nice to have an objective eye and someone who knows what looks good and what's 'in' for someone my age vs under 25.

By "personal shopper," I refer to friends who like to help, based on what they see me choosing for myself.

To one, I remarked, "I really don't like the act of shopping. It is so tedious for me. I wish I could find someone who likes shopping and would just take my money," to which she replied - "I LOVE shopping! You tell me what you want and I will go get it for you! I find bargains!" So I gave her some money and said, "I need shirts and sweaters for work" and a few weeks later a box arrived at my house (she lives several states away) with some fabulous bargains and nice styles that I would never have chosen for myself but that looked nice.

To another I remarked, "I just got a new job and now I need office clothes for the first time in years," and she replied, "Rhea, do not go shopping alone. Take me with you. Promise me you'll take me with you? We'll go to outlets, we'll have lunch, it will be fun. I'll buy you a margarita if you take me with you."

 

[Toni]

I confess I'm a little in awe of Rhea having a personal shopper. I'd have no problem rejecting suggestions but it would be nice to have an objective eye and someone who knows what looks good and what's 'in' for someone my age vs under 25.

By "personal shopper," I refer to friends who like to help, based on what they see me choosing for myself.

To one, I remarked, "I really don't like the act of shopping. It is so tedious for me. I wish I could find someone who likes shopping and would just take my money," to which she replied - "I LOVE shopping! You tell me what you want and I will go get it for you! I find bargains!" So I gave her some money and said, "I need shirts and sweaters for work" and a few weeks later a box arrived at my house with some fabulous bargains and nice styles that I would never have chosen for myself but that looked nice.

To another I remarked, "I just got a new job and now I need office clothes for the first time in years," and she replied, "Rhea, do not go shopping alone. Take me with you. Promise me you'll take me with you? We'll go to outlets, we'll have lunch, it will be fun. I'll buy you a margarita if you take me with you."

Still in awe. My late MIL was a like that: she had excellent taste, a good sense of style and a keen eye as to what would and would not look good on a particular person. She bought me a few items I would never have picked for myself but were wonderful. I confess to being nervous about shopping with her because if I admired something, she was inclined to want to buy it for me. Terrible problem, right? But I wasn’t used to that at all. My mother never took me shopping and her tastes ran.....much more pink than mine. And very adverse to spending money—but then, we didn’t have a lot and she had other daughters who were happier to let her pick out their clothes. My MIL had only sons so taking another girl shopping was a treat, even an unfashionable one. We always lived hundreds of miles away from our families so visits were usually centered on things other than shopping.

 

[southernhybrid]

I'm glad I'm retired. I wear nothing but skinny jeans and cotton tops, usually from Eddie Bauer. I also love long sweaters, when the weather is just right for them.

My mother and I used to go shopping when I visited her. She always wanted me to use coupons at Macy's. I still have a shirt that I got her to buy for my birthday one year. It wasn't on sale and I think it was very difficult for her to pay full retail. I almost never pay full price for clothing, but I figured since it was my birthday, it was okay to have my mom buy me something special. It's basically a nice t-shirt with long sleeves and lace trim. I have very simple taste in clothing, which is why I'm happy wearing jeans everyday. I stopped wearing dresses by age 50. I gave all of what I had to charity. I kept one pair of dress pants just in case I need to look a little bit dressed up. To each her own.

My late mother in law would just give us her credit card and tell us to buy what we wanted during the last few years of her life. I have a nice dress coat that cost more than I would have paid for a coat. It's a classic style and best of all, it can be washed on the delicate cycle, despite looking like wool. It still looks like new despite being over 15 years old. I rarely wear it now, but I still like it. Maybe I can start calling some of my clothing "vintage". I have a hard time giving some of the older pieces to Goodwill, despite rarely wearing them. One day, when I downsize, they will be donated.

To me, the way to look dressed up, is to wear expensive jewelry with a nice sweater and jeans. That's one of the benefits of being older. You wear whatever you want without any worries. Then again, I wore jeans during the 18 years that I worked as the only nurse in an assisted living facility. The residents seemed to like my casual look. I think it made them feel closer to me, as the atmosphere of the place was very casual. Sometimes wearing a uniform can make it difficult for people to relate to you. Most of my jobs didn't require a nursing uniform. I liked that.

 

[Emily Lake]

Interesting bit: As a private 'experiment' the next time we were working alone, I made sure that I also sat with my legs spread really wide. It wasn't immodest: wearing long pants, baggy lab coat, etc. I just made a point of positioning myself so that I took up as much physical space as possible. Didn't change a single other thing about how I did my job or interacted with him. I just made sure that I physically took up as much room as possible.

It was weird: He didn't do that manspreading thing that day. He never did that manspreading thing again with me. Also quit trying to dump extra work on me.

I have no idea why.

How strange. I'm very curious though. I have one neighbor who does this. He even stands with his feet really wide apart, like further than shoulder width. He's an odd duck. Makes me want to try this experiment.

 

[Emily Lake]

I like loose pants. And I don’t care what people think I look like, honestly.
I used to be VERY skinny and I liked loose pants. Now I am overweight, and I like loose pants.
My professional shopper hates this for me, and always tries to get me to try on the snug pants. “Get one size smaller,” she says, “really.” And the shop-keeper agrees. But I really don’t like that. I like the way men’s pants look. Well, previous style men’s pants. Now they all have the skinny-pant look. Which looks fine on people and I like the way it looks on them, it’s just not what I like for me.


For me it is all about...

It can be really, really, really tough to find a pair of jeans or pants that [...] have convenient and sufficiently deep pockets

Pockets.

LLbean Chinos have great pockets. The fit is not absolutely perfect, but the pockets are. So I buy them.

Oh yes, pockets! I have some work trousers that don't have pockets... but they're parts of a suit, and the jacket has pockets. All of my house clothes and pajamas have pockets. I really don't understand why all clothes don't have pockets. Not that I ever carry things in them, but I always need a place to put my hands.

 

[Emily Lake]

Women have to be prepared to do our own hemming. Worse, I have had to explain over and over to a few women why I can't just wear regular sizes. I'm no longer petite in terms of girth but I haven't grown any taller.

Well petite is ONLY height. You can buy Plus sized Petite.
I have trouble with arm-lengths, too.

Unfortunately for me, my metabolism took a nosedive some years ago and I haven't been able to drop pounds I've picked up. Before, I ate like a horse and weighed....under 100 soaking wet. Now, I am much more moderate in my eating habits but alas, although I swore I would never gain weight like a lot of my family members, it was a promise I could not keep.

Feel you. Ditto.

Lol, yes, I feel you both. Age is a bitch.

I always struggle with petites because I have a normal-sized torso, and just have short arms and legs. Petite pants are the right overall length, but the rise is always too short. I end up having to get a larger size and wear them as a lower-rise pant than they're designed for. When I can find them, I really prefer regular cut in a short length. WHBM has a lot of good pants options. I don't have as much trouble with petite shirts, they usually fit pretty good, sometimes they just end up being shorter than they should be on my torso.

 

[Emily Lake]

Turning the bra around when putting it on is a miniscule effort compared to shifting, pinching and scratching all day. This is true no matter what the weight or boob size is involved.

I have a friend who grew up without a mom. She's a fair bit younger than me. I went shopping with her for a bra, and she grabbed a bunch of 32-B bras - which I knew were never going to fit her boobs. When she went to try them on, she tried to put the bra on from the front, and was twisting her arms backwards to try to clasp it in back.

It turned into a bra-fitting lesson. I showed her how to put a bra on with the clasp in front and then turn it around. I also taught her how to test the cup fit, how to do the "jiggle test" and the "bend over" test to make sure she wasn't going to pop out. And I introduced her to full-coverage t-shirt bras, which was eye opening for her. Turns out she was a 32-D, and having the right size was sooooo much more comfortable!

Poor girl. I kind of feel like bra shopping should be taught in middle school, as some sort of girls-day field trip. But I can see so many ways that could go wrong.