Republicans, I hope you like rape.

[Loren Pechtel]

The "Give them porn or they'll rape you" hypothesis would probably fail in the same way the "Attractive young women in short skirts cause rape" hypothesis collapses when actual rape victims are considered. It's found the majority were not young, wearing a short skirt, not attractive in a conventional sense.

The last phrase is a bit harsh

Harsh in what way?
Women are told, “if you try to look attractive, and men harm you, then it’s your own fault because you were asking for it.” We know that; we are told this all the time. Don’t dress up to go out clubbing, because it’s an invitation. Don’t dress up for one man, because all men think it’s a signal for all of them. But the data shows that women who are not dressed up, not in makeup and not conventionally pretty are also raped.

So it’s a lie to blame women who are raped, which itself emboldens rapists even more. But the data shows that the blame is a lie. Women get raped because they are women, which makes them prey of men. (Some men are also prey, and sometimes by men who are not homosexual, thereby further proving that it is NOT about sexual pleasure)

You still don't seem to be able to understand the difference between a risk factor and blame.

Dressing for clubbing makes a predator more likely to select you, it doesn't make the predator appear.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Yeah, we've proven as a society time and again that ignorance about sex and money make people LESS safe regarding those topics.

The two sources of the vast majority of unnecessary misery on those subjects are a lack of information or BAD information, both of which are exacerbated by educational failures.

Because BAD information is going to spread because "dumb children", and the only remedy to that is good information, the only choice is "bad information" or "good information" anyway. "No information" is simply not an option.

Of course this will, as you point out, create more misery, specifically for those who want to be able to escape consequences through the existence of bad, absent, or incomplete information... but seriously (don't) fuck those guys!

Is there any topic where ignorance makes people safer??

 

[Toni]

Please note: I am not advocating for or against viewing internet porn. I AM stating that viewing porn that contains coercive sex DOES affect how at least some adolescents view sex and what they see as normal sex acts.

The points about the paucity of sex education in schools and at home is taken. Very few homes provide access for kids to view the adults having sex with each other. Indeed, to do so would invite intervention by CPS, for reason. In our society, sex is seen as private and between adults.

Indeed, sex is often clouded in mystery and porn can fill in the blanks for some kids. The danger is when kids view porn that depicts coercive or violent acts can have an outsized influence over what the kids see as normal or expected.

 

[Toni]

Yeah, we've proven as a society time and again that ignorance about sex and money make people LESS safe regarding those topics.

The two sources of the vast majority of unnecessary misery on those subjects are a lack of information or BAD information, both of which are exacerbated by educational failures.

Because BAD information is going to spread because "dumb children", and the only remedy to that is good information, the only choice is "bad information" or "good information" anyway. "No information" is simply not an option.

Of course this will, as you point out, create more misery, specifically for those who want to be able to escape consequences through the existence of bad, absent, or incomplete information... but seriously (don't) fuck those guys!

Is there any topic where ignorance makes people safer??

See: access to information about how to make a bomb. Probably even you will agree that adolescents do not need to access this information. Indeed, we know that some school shootings are inspired by….other school shootings and a desire for fame.

 

[Jarhyn]

Most people are mostly good most of the time, even the people who look at porn most people would consider to be "gross".

By going after people who post porn openly, you only drive it into the domain of those who would be less serious about doing it ethically.

Yup. As normal, legal, regulated yuck markets are better than illegal, unregulated markets.

Yeah, like... people on the internet be expected to be over a certain age and warned about exactly that explicitly in a classroom like Driver's Education before we say as a society "ok, internet time". Everyone should have their own ISP account, and they should be expected to keep it secure from kids.

I agree with the education aspect. I don't agree with keeping them off--as with many things a gradual approach is better than a cliff.

The thing about kids getting onto the internet is that they need to be warned first about the dangers and pitfalls. It should be things like "genital pics on the internet are forever", "genital pics will end up on the Internet," and "the consequences of genital pics on the internet are cruel and insidious and often slow to manifest."

I would rather the internet itself be a child-free environment. I would rather VPNs check if the ISP account connecting to them is owned by a minor, and to block the IPs of VPNs which don't require an adult verified account from the entire country.

It should be entirely possible for an adult to access and use absolute anonymization services.

It should be extremely difficult for a child to access and use anonymization services services (or if they are able to, they should be "minor-marked" the same way a con badge is at a convention with adult areas.

The problem isn't the content, it's the interactivity. That's where kids can be harmed. And I still believe education is a better answer than banning.

Yeah, I wouldn't ever want to see content banned. Still, having such infrastructure that keeps kids away from porn is pretty important until after the education phase.

Yeah, we've proven as a society time and again that ignorance about sex and money make people LESS safe regarding those topics.

The two sources of the vast majority of unnecessary misery on those subjects are a lack of information or BAD information, both of which are exacerbated by educational failures.

Because BAD information is going to spread because "dumb children", and the only remedy to that is good information, the only choice is "bad information" or "good information" anyway. "No information" is simply not an option.

Of course this will, as you point out, create more misery, specifically for those who want to be able to escape consequences through the existence of bad, absent, or incomplete information... but seriously (don't) fuck those guys!

Is there any topic where ignorance makes people safer??

Keeping people ignorant of "the rumor mill", and informed with "comprehensive education" does make people safer.

I would say I am safer politically speaking for insulating myself from the torrent of right wing misinformation.

 

[Tigers!]

I do know and understand how women and children were treated in the past. That is why I want it to stop. Freely allowing porn and more types of it will not be the way to stop such treatment of women and children.

And you think they weren't treated badly in the past?! What we are seeing now is they aren't putting up with it anymore.

Why do you think that I think that there was not poor/bad treatment is the past? I must have typed something I cannot find again.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Yeah, we've proven as a society time and again that ignorance about sex and money make people LESS safe regarding those topics.

The two sources of the vast majority of unnecessary misery on those subjects are a lack of information or BAD information, both of which are exacerbated by educational failures.

Because BAD information is going to spread because "dumb children", and the only remedy to that is good information, the only choice is "bad information" or "good information" anyway. "No information" is simply not an option.

Of course this will, as you point out, create more misery, specifically for those who want to be able to escape consequences through the existence of bad, absent, or incomplete information... but seriously (don't) fuck those guys!

Is there any topic where ignorance makes people safer??

See: access to information about how to make a bomb. Probably even you will agree that adolescents do not need to access this information. Indeed, we know that some school shootings are inspired by….other school shootings and a desire for fame.

Not knowing how discourages want-to-be bombmakers?? It might make a difference on how many blow themselves up in the process but I doubt ignorance is going to do much to stop them.

And I certainly agree about school shooters and fame--I believe that's the driving force behind most of them. And I believe we should limit reporting (not prohibit, just keep it to a minimum) on school shootings for this very reason. But that's not ignorance.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Is there any topic where ignorance makes people safer??

Keeping people ignorant of "the rumor mill", and informed with "comprehensive education" does make people safer.

I would say I am safer politically speaking for insulating myself from the torrent of right wing misinformation.

I don't believe it's possible to keep people away from the rumor mill. There's always going be something if interaction is permitted. The best approach is to provide the truth and not leave hidden areas for the rumor mill.