Jarhyn
Wizard
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2010
- Messages
- 15,567
- Gender
- Androgyne; they/them
- Basic Beliefs
- Natural Philosophy, Game Theoretic Ethicist
Yeah, we've proven as a society time and again that ignorance about sex and money make people LESS safe regarding those topics.The idea of consent culture is relatively new. Generally speaking, school systems are very slow to adopt changes. Of course there are exceptions. But what seems to be universally true is that changes to curriculum that involves sex are the most difficult to change. A lot of people get nervous about the idea of kids being taught that they have choices to make about their own bodies, because those choices might not be what the parent wants.I've had people think that flirting over text meant an entitlement to nudes.I did not see it as misogynistic at all. He's right. IMO, rapists rape because of their own rage and because of the sense of power it gives them. Also, a strong sense of entitlement. The last applies most strongly to the casual date rapist, the person who thinks that they get what they want as long as they bought dinner or movie tickets or their victim let them kiss them or they've had sex with the victim before or they 'know' the victim is not a virgin, etc. Some assume that consenting to dinner or a movie is consent to whatever the person who paid for dinner wants.If I, as a male, called any woman "not attractive in a conventional sense" I would immediately be classed as misogynistic, uncaring, hateful etc. etc. So I was surprised to see Bronzeage use the phrase. It is a harsh phrase.Harsh in what way?The last phrase is a bit harshThe "Give them porn or they'll rape you" hypothesis would probably fail in the same way the "Attractive young women in short skirts cause rape" hypothesis collapses when actual rape victims are considered. It's found the majority were not young, wearing a short skirt, not attractive in a conventional sense.
Women are told, “if you try to look attractive, and men harm you, then it’s your own fault because you were asking for it.” We know that; we are told this all the time. Don’t dress up to go out clubbing, because it’s an invitation. Don’t dress up for one man, because all men think it’s a signal for all of them. But the data shows that women who are not dressed up, not in makeup and not conventionally pretty are also raped.
So it’s a lie to blame women who are raped, which itself emboldens rapists even more. But the data shows that the blame is a lie. Women get raped because they are women, which makes them prey of men. (Some men are also prey, and sometimes by men who are not homosexual, thereby further proving that it is NOT about sexual pleasure)
Everything else you mention is sadly true.
Victims are raped regardless of their age, their race, their level of physical attractiveness, what they are or are not wearing. All that is required is opportunity and access.
But instead of teaching consent culture in sex ed, they teach abstinence, as if ignorance ever solves anything.
As a parent, it can be truly scary to think that your child might make seriously bad, life changing decisions that they are too young to be able to deal with. Worse, that someone else will make those decisions for them.
Some parents believe that keeping some information, usually about sex but also about money, will help keep their kids safe. Some kids are also extremely adverse to their parents talking with them about sex, abd birth control. That includes families that are generally very open about talking about health and bodies and touch. I am convinced that some of this has to do with heritable personality traits. This does not mean that these difficult discussions do not need to happen. They do.
And of course, the idea of consent can be pretty threatening to those who do it believe that women and children or whoever is the object of their desire has real control over their own body.
The two sources of the vast majority of unnecessary misery on those subjects are a lack of information or BAD information, both of which are exacerbated by educational failures.
Because BAD information is going to spread because "dumb children", and the only remedy to that is good information, the only choice is "bad information" or "good information" anyway. "No information" is simply not an option.
Of course this will, as you point out, create more misery, specifically for those who want to be able to escape consequences through the existence of bad, absent, or incomplete information... but seriously (don't) fuck those guys!