I'm opposed to the actions of the state of Israel. I have no qualms with its existence.
-
Features
Swedish Social Democratic anti-semitism
- Thread starter Derec
- Start date
I'm opposed to the actions of the state of Israel. I have no qualms with its existence.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Does Israel's existence require the blowing up of children?
No problem here, then.
Seems so for the moment. We live in hope of better days, I guess.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Well if that's the case, then for the moment I'm opposed to its existence. IMO institutions and regimes that require the deaths of children should always be opposed.
Then, start with the United States, plz.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Does the Unites States require the deaths of children for it to exist?
Seems so for the moment. We live in hope of better days.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Really? In what way does the US require the deaths of children? How would sparing their lives cause the US to cease to exist?
Children have recently been killed in US drone strikes. How is that different from children dying as a result of Israeli counter-insurgency activities in Gaza?
Arctish
Centimillionaire
The US will not cease to exist if no more children are killed in drone strikes. The US will not be imperiled if peaceful relations are established between the US and the parents and countrymen of those children. In fact, the US will be safer.
You suggested Israel's existence was dependent on blowing up children when you posted this:
That's why I asked what you meant.
I don't believe that blowing up children makes Israel safer or more secure. I think it has the opposite effect. I think it enrages Israel's neighbors, thereby endangering Israelis at home and abroad. It invites retaliation, which just keeps the violence going.
I think anti-blowing-up-defenseless-children-wth-rockets-ism is the way to go, for both the Israelis and the Palestinians.
Why in a world where we know what organizations like Hamas stand for – brutality toward women, murder of gays, suppression of freedom, genocidal aspirations toward the Jews – can people elevate the terrorist organization over democratic Israel? The answer lies in evil’s ability to hide in the shadows and escape the light of scrutiny. To hide behind masks as it commits atrocities. To cower behind lies and propaganda that ensnare the illiterate and befuddle the blind. It is found in the refusal to analyze and scrutinize one’s own biases and to uncover the contradictions and fallacies that pervade one’s own thinking.--Schmuley Boteach
Arctish
Centimillionaire
If you want to make peace, you don't talk to your friends. You talk to your enemies. -- Moshe Dayan
No one said anything about elevating a terrorist organization over democratic Israel. That's just bluster. What people are talking about is recognizing a Palestinian state just as the world has recognized the State of Israel. It means putting a limit on the expansion of Israel into all of Eretz Yisrael, which is why ardent Zionists have a problem with it. It also means recognizing Palestinians have the same rights as Israelis, and that Muslim, Christians, Druze, and religious minorities have the same rights as Jews, which is why racists and religious bigots don't like it either. And it means valuable natural resources will be developed by other parties which is why certain vested interests don't like it either. But ultimately it means finding a way for people to live as neighbors without killing each other's children, which is why it is distinctly pro-semitic.
No one said anything about elevating a terrorist organization over democratic Israel. That's just bluster. What people are talking about is recognizing a Palestinian state just as the world has recognized the State of Israel. It means putting a limit on the expansion of Israel into all of Eretz Yisrael, which is why ardent Zionists have a problem with it. It also means recognizing Palestinians have the same rights as Israelis, and that Muslim, Christians, Druze, and religious minorities have the same rights as Jews, which is why racists and religious bigots don't like it either. And it means valuable natural resources will be developed by other parties which is why certain vested interests don't like it either. But ultimately it means finding a way for people to live as neighbors without killing each other's children, which is why it is distinctly pro-semitic.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Why do you think I'm talking to you?
Because it's better than watching Bowling For Dollars?
Yes, because Hamas hides behind those children and shoots at Israel.
The death of a hostage is the fault of the hostage-taker no matter who actually killed them.
- - - Updated - - -
This means handing the world over to the most vile groups out there.
I don't think you would fare too well under ISIS--you're in effect asking to be beheaded.
- - - Updated - - -
*EVERY* country that opposes terrorists does.
They can stick their head in the sand for a while and let others do the dirty work but that doesn't avoid the deaths.
- - - Updated - - -
Lets pretend we have a government that will not kill an innocent child no matter what.
The terrorists come here wearing armor of babies and equipped with deadman bombs.
There's no way to stop them without killing the babies. The US falls.
Of course they aren't doing this because it wouldn't work--*EVERY* government out there would kill the attackers even with their baby armor.
You're really out of touch with reality here.
We can't establish peaceful relations with them because they're hardline Islamists--peace with non-Muslims simply isn't possible for them. Look at what they are doing over there--killing non-Muslims in the areas they take over.
There are only two options:
1) Somebody stops them.
2) They take over. Non-Muslims die. (And in time they die, also, from resource depletion.)
The stronger they get before they're stopped the more will die.
- - - Updated - - -
You're supporting the side that actually engages in ethnic cleansing rather than is merely accused of it.
laughing dog
Contributor
Arctish is not supporting Israel. And the facts show that in terms of efficiency in effectual ethnic cleansing via killings and annexation, Israel is way ahead of Hamas.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Taking hostages and imperiling their lives is evil. So is asserting children are hostages in order to justify killing them.
But you know what is even more evil that that? A regime that requires children be blown up in order for it to exist, and that regime actually existing. That's the worst. There is nothing in all of human history that could out-do it for evil-ness. Even the Third Reich didn't require children be blown up, it just found it convenient.
BTW, in case the sarcasm isn't coming through, I think this whole line of argument is bullshit. Israel does not require that children be blown up in order for it to exist any more than the US, or India, or Japan, or Paraguay requires it. It just so happens that blowing up children is convenient for those who 1) think their own kids are safe, 2) don't give a shit about their neighbors' kids, and 3) are embroiled in a fight they want to win so badly they're willing to blow up kids to do it. It's all very anti-Semitic and anti-human being, if you ask me. Not blowing up kids is infinitely preferable.
Not blowing up children means what, handing the world over to the kind of people who blow up children? We have to kill babies or the baby-killers will win?
That is probably the most disturbing pro-baby-killing apologetics I've ever read. If we don't blow up children when we don't have to, the US will fall to baby-wearing terrorists, and nevermind the fact the baby-wearers are only protected as long as they properly care for the babies. Blowing up defenseless children is how we keep freedom alive, so bombs away!
What a strange way to protest official recognition of a Palestinian State.
Jokodo
Veteran Member
You and No Robots are claiming that at this very moment, not killing children would cause the US to cease to exist. A thought experiment in which you pretend, as you admit you are doing, that "the terrorists" do something you admit they don't actually do isn't going to help you one bit to make that argument.