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Transracial Woman Under Fire in Spokane

I don't much care what race she wants to claim or identifies with; but given the high number of apparent lies on multiple topics (including police reports), she sounds like a nut... or her mother is.

In listening to this woman being interviewed I have no doubt she deeply and sincerely wishes to be perceived as Black by society, and inventing things like a Black father are a manifestation of that desire.

Calling people who wish to be perceived as Black insane does not strike me as particularly tolerant or progressive.
 
OF course, for it to mean anything, we'll have to identify what each race 'feels' like. What racial behaviors are.
Luckily, there is a lot of trail-blazing in this area. We could even create checksheets. A certain number of points for liking watermelon or tentacle hentai, for poor driving, excelling grades, punctuality...

This obstacle is no different than that for transgenders whose claims that they "feel" like a woman are meaningless unless they presume to know how men and women feel differently from each other. Likewise, our efforts to honor and respect those transgender claims is an endorsement of those assumptions of psychological sex differences.
 
dismal said:
Calling people who wish to be perceived as Black insane does not strike me as particularly tolerant or progressive.

It depends, if she has mental health issues then perhaps I'd be more willing to indulge her fantasy. But if she is just flat out lying then I'd be a lot less gentle with my opinions. I suspect the former but I really don't care that much about it. Ho hum.
 
what, specifically, makes someone any particular race?
Tendency of range of geographic location of ancestors about ten thousand years ago generally makes a major human race. With minor human races, the ancestral geography would be more recent. Ancestral geography corresponds to genetics, so geneticists can identify races by ranges of frequencies of genetic markers in combination, to match self-identification of race. See, for example, Tang et al's "Genetic Structure, Self-Identified Race/Ethnicity, and Confounding in Case-Control Association Studies," 2004.
 
I don't much care what race she wants to claim or identifies with; but given the high number of apparent lies on multiple topics (including police reports), she sounds like a nut... or her mother is.

In listening to this woman being interviewed I have no doubt she deeply and sincerely wishes to be perceived as Black by society, and inventing things like a Black father are a manifestation of that desire.

Calling people who wish to be perceived as Black insane does not strike me as particularly tolerant or progressive.

JUDITH: Well, why do you want to be Loretta, Stan?

LORETTA: I want to have babies.

REG: You want to have babies?!

LORETTA: It's every man's right to have babies if he wants them.

REG: But... you can't have babies.

LORETTA: Don't you oppress me.

REG: I'm not oppressing you, Stan. You haven't got a womb! Where's the foetus going to gestate?! You going to keep it in a box?!

LORETTA: crying

JUDITH: Here! I-- I've got an idea. Suppose you agree that he can't actually have babies, not having a womb, which is nobody's fault, not even the Romans', but that he can have the right to have babies.

FRANCIS: Good idea, Judith. We shall fight the oppressors for your right to have babies, brother. Sister. Sorry.

REG: What's the point?

FRANCIS: What?

REG: What's the point of fighting for his right to have babies when he can't have babies?!

FRANCIS: It is symbolic of our struggle against oppression.

REG: Symbolic of his struggle against reality.
 
So, if someone claims to be of a particular race, and you doubt it, 23andMe.com will do a DNA test for 99 dollars and generally sort out whether or not he or she is telling the truth. No need to interview the parents.
 
dismal said:
Calling people who wish to be perceived as Black insane does not strike me as particularly tolerant or progressive.

It depends, if she has mental health issues then perhaps I'd be more willing to indulge her fantasy. But if she is just flat out lying then I'd be a lot less gentle with my opinions. I suspect the former but I really don't care that much about it. Ho hum.

I think she has a case of "white guilt" that is off the charts.
 
It depends, if she has mental health issues then perhaps I'd be more willing to indulge her fantasy. But if she is just flat out lying then I'd be a lot less gentle with my opinions. I suspect the former but I really don't care that much about it. Ho hum.

I think she has a case of "white guilt" that is off the charts.

You both seem to miss the most important point about her childhood. She was brought up with black brothers and sisters. She identifies with them. Case closed. Is it a mental problem to identify with those with whom you've been raised? Is it white guilt to work to better what she probably considers her social situation? PC and judgmental. Quit it.
 
what, specifically, makes someone any particular race?
Tendency of range of geographic location of ancestors about ten thousand years ago generally makes a major human race. With minor human races, the ancestral geography would be more recent. Ancestral geography corresponds to genetics, so geneticists can identify races by ranges of frequencies of genetic markers in combination, to match self-identification of race. See, for example, Tang et al's "Genetic Structure, Self-Identified Race/Ethnicity, and Confounding in Case-Control Association Studies," 2004.

Actually no. All of the above is highly disputed among scientists, though I am entire unsurprised that you are the first to answer my question.

But let's even hypothetically assume you are accurate - has anyone done a genetic test on this woman? And either way, at what point do these "ranges of frequencies of genetic markers in combination" shift to make someone "white" vs "black"

Researchers at 23andMe looked at the genetic ancestry of about 78,000 customers likely to consider themselves as entirely of European ancestry and found that somewhere between 3 percent and 4 percent of those people have “hidden” African ancestry.

The percent of African ancestry is relatively low with the majority of individuals having just 0.5 percent to 0.75 percent — which suggests that those people have an African ancestor who lived about six generations, or about 200 years, ago.


Read more at http://blog.23andme.com/ancestry/our-hidden-african-ancestry/#VmmVW2BwlJf91xio.99
 
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So, if someone claims to be of a particular race, and you doubt it, 23andMe.com will do a DNA test for 99 dollars and generally sort out whether or not he or she is telling the truth. No need to interview the parents.

The website says it can "learn what percent of your DNA is from populations around the world". So let's say, hypothetically, that her test came back showing that some small percentage of her DNA originates from Sub-Saharan Africa. How large must the percentage be before she can call herself "black"?
 
Sounds like she may be the Mike Barnacle of the NAACP.

I'm curious why, if the accusations are true about her lies she'll pretty much disappear from the face of Civil Rights activism, why is it that James O'Keefe is still out in the wild fighting the conservative "cause"?
 
You both seem to miss the most important point about her childhood. She was brought up with black brothers and sisters. She identifies with them. Case closed. Is it a mental problem to identify with those with whom you've been raised? Is it white guilt to work to better what she probably considers her social situation? PC and judgmental. Quit it.

Do you know if the black brothers and sisters are dressing from Gap ?
 
You both seem to miss the most important point about her childhood. She was brought up with black brothers and sisters. She identifies with them. Case closed. Is it a mental problem to identify with those with whom you've been raised? Is it white guilt to work to better what she probably considers her social situation? PC and judgmental. Quit it.

Do you know if the black brothers and sisters are dressing from Gap ?
My response as a former resident is "What's gap?" There are exactly three Gap stores and outlets in the entire state, none of them in the northwest of Montana.

Mon-tan-a   Montana Population has been at between 800k and 1000k for this fourth largest state in area for 70 over years.
 
I think with all the shootings by various wackos including the police saying this woman is under fire isn't appropriate.....
nobody is shooting at her, maybe some want to though...
 
This obstacle is no different than that for transgenders whose claims that they "feel" like a woman are meaningless unless they presume to know how men and women feel differently from each other. Likewise, our efforts to honor and respect those transgender claims is an endorsement of those assumptions of psychological sex differences.

No, on two counts. First, all that needs to be acknowledged is the experience of dysphoria. No individual can truly claim to know what it feels like to be a man or a woman beyond their own personal experience, but they can know when their mental experience and their anatomy cause a feeling of discrepancy.

The same consideration may or may not apply to this transracial scenario. If so, it's the feeling of dysphoria we have to consider. I have no opinion on whether this transracial experience is at all similar to gender dysphoria, but I would say that this woman does not need to know what it feels like to be black by some (as of yet undefined) objective standard to feel she identifies more with looking black than white.

Two, science has some rough understanding of differences between male and female neurology and the impact of hormones. While not every individual transgender person is going to be tested, some research has been done indicating neurological differences between trans men and cis women, and trans women and cis men. It's imperfect, like most science, but there is some data reducing the amount of assumption required. I am not aware that science has examined racial identity the same way. If we compare being transracial with being transgender, our understanding of the latter has advanced a lot more than the former. Maybe being transracial will follow a similar path, or maybe it won't (or cannot). Time will tell, but at present time the two scenarios are at very different places in our level of understanding and... assumption.
 
This obstacle is no different than that for transgenders whose claims that they "feel" like a woman are meaningless unless they presume to know how men and women feel differently from each other. Likewise, our efforts to honor and respect those transgender claims is an endorsement of those assumptions of psychological sex differences.

No, on two counts. First, all that needs to be acknowledged is the experience of dysphoria. No individual can truly claim to know what it feels like to be a man or a woman beyond their own personal experience, but they can know when their mental experience and their anatomy cause a feeling of discrepancy.

The same consideration may or may not apply to this transracial scenario. If so, it's the feeling of dysphoria we have to consider. I have no opinion on whether this transracial experience is at all similar to gender dysphoria, but I would say that this woman does not need to know what it feels like to be black by some (as of yet undefined) objective standard to feel she identifies more with looking black than white.

Two, science has some rough understanding of differences between male and female neurology and the impact of hormones. While not every individual transgender person is going to be tested, some research has been done indicating neurological differences between trans men and cis women, and trans women and cis men. It's imperfect, like most science, but there is some data reducing the amount of assumption required. I am not aware that science has examined racial identity the same way. If we compare being transracial with being transgender, our understanding of the latter has advanced a lot more than the former. Maybe being transracial will follow a similar path, or maybe it won't (or cannot). Time will tell, but at present time the two scenarios are at very different places in our level of understanding and... assumption.

And just how, are you suggesting, is "race" embedded in one's brain chemistry, and presumably in the genetic make-up of the brain?
 
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