Trump’s Persecution of Jerome Powell and Political Opponents Must End

[lostone]

Land of the Free? What a pathetic joke.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Didn’t he pardon all the J6 people in one go? Hard to believe based on that then that pardons require full spelling out of all charges.

 

[RVonse]

What panic prior to the fed ever lasted longer than the 1930's depression?

The ones in 1785-1788, 1789-1793, 1815-1821,1839-1843, and 1873-1879
(Source:  List of Recessions in the United States).

But I fail to see the relevance of your question.

Perhaps we are failing to communicate? From google AI

The Great Depression lasted over a decade, generally considered to have started with the 1929 stock market crash and officially ending around 1939-1941, with full recovery often linked to the massive economic stimulus from World War II efforts. It was the longest and deepest economic downturn in modern history, marked by high unemployment and poverty.

None of the panics you just listed lasted more than a decade and most only for a couple of years. Sure, there would have been workers out of the job for a couple of years but then able to move quickly back into the economy. That was what an unregulated market driven interest rate did for us.

And the relevance for myself asking about great depression. It was the worst, deepest, and longest downturn in US history. The fed was formed to manage the best interests of the US when this happened. Perhaps you can argue the fed should have done even more; I guess we will never know. But the fact is that the fed was in charge during this period of time when our economy has never failed worse for a longer period of time.

The fed has proven to be very much like the money manager in charge of an IRA that always loses money. Always doing the wrong trade and charging a hefty fee for each trade. Then ending up with a portfolio worth less than if the original stocks were just left alone.

If the fed did not help the US out of the depression they surely have not helped with inflation. Their existance serves only to enrich certain people and not the public in general.

 

[RVonse]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

 

[RVonse]

What panic prior to the fed ever lasted longer than the 1930's depression?

The ones in 1785-1788, 1789-1793, 1815-1821,1839-1843, and 1873-1879
(Source:  List of Recessions in the United States).

But I fail to see the relevance of your question.

That has nothing to do with the fact that the Federal Reserve was created specifically to both limit the occurrences and mitigate the damage from those kinds of financial collapses.

Why not? If the fed was created to limit occurrence and damage of failings, why do we want them continuing to fail? We should be able to just admit our mistake of having them in the first place and get rid of them and not continue digging a deeper hole.

 

[laughing dog]

What panic prior to the fed ever lasted longer than the 1930's depression?

The ones in 1785-1788, 1789-1793, 1815-1821,1839-1843, and 1873-1879
(Source:  List of Recessions in the United States).

But I fail to see the relevance of your question.

Perhaps we are failing to communicate? From google AI

The Great Depression lasted over a decade, generally considered to have started with the 1929 stock market crash and officially ending around 1939-1941, with full recovery often linked to the massive economic stimulus from World War II efforts. It was the longest and deepest economic downturn in modern history, marked by high unemployment and poverty. .,.

The USA started to come out of the Great Depression by 1933. By 1936, most economic indicators had returned to their levels in the 1920s except the unemployment rate (11% down over 25%). Much of the world took longer to recover.

At the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. The idea of macroeconomic management did not exist as we know it. The Great Depression occurred because of free markets. It’s duration was extended by competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries,pro cyclical fiscal policy ( cutting spending to offset falling tax revenues), and a reluctance to increase the money supply.

Blaming the Fed for the Great Depression is like blaming oxygen for forest fires.

Your views are based on misinformation.

I

 

[Patooka]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

Firstly, way to completely miss the point. I'm kinda impressed.

Secondly, are you really going to die on this hill that house colours are a measure of inflation?

 

[TV and credit cards]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

Firstly, way to completely miss the point. I'm kinda impressed.

Secondly, are you really going to die on this hill that house colours are a measure of inflation?

Perhaps we could use umbrella color to measure consumer sentiment.

 

[Patooka]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

Firstly, way to completely miss the point. I'm kinda impressed.

Secondly, are you really going to die on this hill that house colours are a measure of inflation?

Perhaps we could use umbrella color to measure consumer sentiment.

Don't be fucking stupid. We should be measuring car colours versus gasoline consumption.

 

[RVonse]

.

What panic prior to the fed ever lasted longer than the 1930's depression?

The ones in 1785-1788, 1789-1793, 1815-1821,1839-1843, and 1873-1879
(Source:  List of Recessions in the United States).

But I fail to see the relevance of your question.

Perhaps we are failing to communicate? From google AI

The Great Depression lasted over a decade, generally considered to have started with the 1929 stock market crash and officially ending around 1939-1941, with full recovery often linked to the massive economic stimulus from World War II efforts. It was the longest and deepest economic downturn in modern history, marked by high unemployment and poverty. .,.

The USA started to come out of the Great Depression by 1933. By 1936, most economic indicators had returned to their levels in the 1920s except the unemployment rate (11% down over 25%). Much of the world took longer to recover.

At the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. The idea of macroeconomic management did not exist as we know it. The Great Depression occurred because of free markets. It’s duration was extended by competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries,pro cyclical fiscal policy ( cutting spending to offset falling tax revenues), and a reluctance to increase the money supply.

Blaming the Fed for the Great Depression is like blaming oxygen for forest fires.

Your views are based on misinformation.

I

Google AI directly disagrees with you as does many other articles I have read.
Google AI:

Yes, many economists argue the Federal Reserve significantly worsened the Great Depression through poor monetary policy, failing to act as lender of last resort and allowing the money supply to collapse as banks failed, turning a recession into a prolonged depression, especially by tightening credit and raising rates when they should have expanded liquidity. While not the sole cause, the Fed's inaction and misguided tightening in the early 1930s, under a gold standard system, is seen as a crucial factor in the severe contraction of money and output.

The free market would have not contracted and tightened money supply. Therefore it can be claimed all that came afterwords would not have occurred under free market capitalism. And even if we did not agree with the fed's poor monetary policy at the time we can not escape the fact that the fed was not fulfilling its primary mandate.

 

[Bomb#20]

At the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. The idea of macroeconomic management did not exist as we know it. The Great Depression occurred because of free markets. It’s duration was extended by competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries,pro cyclical fiscal policy ( cutting spending to offset falling tax revenues), and a reluctance to increase the money supply.

Blaming the Fed for the Great Depression is like blaming oxygen for forest fires.

What free markets?!? Surely you've heard of the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act. You've definitely heard of competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries, and in a free market exchange rates aren't determined by governments' decisions to devalue, but float. And as you say, at the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. But preventing bank panics does not require a Fed; a free market will do the job. When the Depression hit, the U.S. had thirty thousand banks and ten thousand of them failed; Canada had ten banks and zero of them failed. Canadian banks were huge nationwide operations with the resources to weather a local run; America had thirty thousand little banks that could be wiped out by rumors of failure because laws prohibited interstate banking and in some cases even multi-branch banking. States in that era just loved enacting incompetent banker job security acts. Blaming free markets for the Great Depression is like blaming religious freedom for the St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre.

 

[Patooka]

.

What panic prior to the fed ever lasted longer than the 1930's depression?

The ones in 1785-1788, 1789-1793, 1815-1821,1839-1843, and 1873-1879
(Source:  List of Recessions in the United States).

But I fail to see the relevance of your question.

Perhaps we are failing to communicate? From google AI

The Great Depression lasted over a decade, generally considered to have started with the 1929 stock market crash and officially ending around 1939-1941, with full recovery often linked to the massive economic stimulus from World War II efforts. It was the longest and deepest economic downturn in modern history, marked by high unemployment and poverty. .,.

The USA started to come out of the Great Depression by 1933. By 1936, most economic indicators had returned to their levels in the 1920s except the unemployment rate (11% down over 25%). Much of the world took longer to recover.

At the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. The idea of macroeconomic management did not exist as we know it. The Great Depression occurred because of free markets. It’s duration was extended by competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries,pro cyclical fiscal policy ( cutting spending to offset falling tax revenues), and a reluctance to increase the money supply.

Blaming the Fed for the Great Depression is like blaming oxygen for forest fires.

Your views are based on misinformation.

I

Google AI directly disagrees with you as does many other articles I have read.
Google AI:

Yes, many economists argue the Federal Reserve significantly worsened the Great Depression through poor monetary policy, failing to act as lender of last resort and allowing the money supply to collapse as banks failed, turning a recession into a prolonged depression, especially by tightening credit and raising rates when they should have expanded liquidity. While not the sole cause, the Fed's inaction and misguided tightening in the early 1930s, under a gold standard system, is seen as a crucial factor in the severe contraction of money and output.

The free market would have not contracted and tightened money supply. Therefore it can be claimed all that came afterwords would not have occurred under free market capitalism. And even if we did not agree with the fed's poor monetary policy at the time we can not escape the fact that the fed was not fulfilling its primary mandate.

Why do you hate the working/middle class?

 

[laughing dog]

At the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. The idea of macroeconomic management did not exist as we know it. The Great Depression occurred because of free markets. It’s duration was extended by competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries,pro cyclical fiscal policy ( cutting spending to offset falling tax revenues), and a reluctance to increase the money supply.

Blaming the Fed for the Great Depression is like blaming oxygen for forest fires.

What free markets?!? Surely you've heard of the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act. You've definitely heard of competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries, and in a free market exchange rates aren't determined by governments' decisions to devalue, but float. And as you say, at the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. But preventing bank panics does not require a Fed; a free market will do the job. When the Depression hit, the U.S. had thirty thousand banks and ten thousand of them failed; Canada had ten banks and zero of them failed. Canadian banks were huge nationwide operations with the resources to weather a local run; America had thirty thousand little banks that could be wiped out by rumors of failure because laws prohibited interstate banking and in some cases even multi-branch banking. States in that era just loved enacting incompetent banker job security acts. Blaming free markets for the Great Depression is like blaming religious freedom for the St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre.

1/3 of US banks failed because they were allowed to. QED

 

[laughing dog]

.

What panic prior to the fed ever lasted longer than the 1930's depression?

The ones in 1785-1788, 1789-1793, 1815-1821,1839-1843, and 1873-1879
(Source:  List of Recessions in the United States).

But I fail to see the relevance of your question.

Perhaps we are failing to communicate? From google AI

The Great Depression lasted over a decade, generally considered to have started with the 1929 stock market crash and officially ending around 1939-1941, with full recovery often linked to the massive economic stimulus from World War II efforts. It was the longest and deepest economic downturn in modern history, marked by high unemployment and poverty. .,.

The USA started to come out of the Great Depression by 1933. By 1936, most economic indicators had returned to their levels in the 1920s except the unemployment rate (11% down over 25%). Much of the world took longer to recover.

At the time, the Fed’s charge was to prevent bank panics. The idea of macroeconomic management did not exist as we know it. The Great Depression occurred because of free markets. It’s duration was extended by competitive exchange rate devaluation by most countries,pro cyclical fiscal policy ( cutting spending to offset falling tax revenues), and a reluctance to increase the money supply.

Blaming the Fed for the Great Depression is like blaming oxygen for forest fires.

Your views are based on misinformation.

I

Google AI directly disagrees with you as does many other articles I have read.
Google AI:

Yes, many economists argue the Federal Reserve significantly worsened the Great Depression through poor monetary policy, failing to act as lender of last resort and allowing the money supply to collapse as banks failed, turning a recession into a prolonged depression, especially by tightening credit and raising rates when they should have expanded liquidity. While not the sole cause, the Fed's inaction and misguided tightening in the early 1930s, under a gold standard system, is seen as a crucial factor in the severe contraction of money and output.

The free market would have not contracted and tightened money supply. Therefore it can be claimed all that came afterwords would not have occurred under free market capitalism. And even if we did not agree with the fed's poor monetary policy at the time we can not escape the fact that the fed was not fulfilling its primary mandate.

Please stop quoting Google AI as some sort of reliable source.

1/3 of US banks failed. That would contract the money supply in the absence of a central bank, so you are incorrect.

In the start of the Great Depression, the Fed acted like a private bank and restricted credit to the lowest risks.

 

[Toni]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

You definitely did not get it. You seem to wax very nostalgic for the 1950/, or perhaps the 1850’s. It is difficult not to believe that the main source of the nostalgia is the societal model was straight white make provider and wife and 2.5 children happily believing he knew everything. Persons of color were confined to their places, out of sight and mind of decent white folks.

 

[ZiprHead]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

You definitely did not get it. You seem to wax very nostalgic for the 1950/, or perhaps the 1850’s. It is difficult not to believe that the main source of the nostalgia is the societal model was straight white make provider and wife and 2.5 children happily believing he knew everything. Persons of color were confined to their places, out of sight and mind of decent white folks.

It's pretty obvious some right wing blow hard AM radio talking head put a bug in RVonse's ear.

 

[Patooka]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

You definitely did not get it. You seem to wax very nostalgic for the 1950/, or perhaps the 1850’s. It is difficult not to believe that the main source of the nostalgia is the societal model was straight white make provider and wife and 2.5 children happily believing he knew everything. Persons of color were confined to their places, out of sight and mind of decent white folks.

Short version: white power and "Leave it to beaver and my 3 sons"

 

[Toni]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

You definitely did not get it. You seem to wax very nostalgic for the 1950/, or perhaps the 1850’s. It is difficult not to believe that the main source of the nostalgia is the societal model was straight white make provider and wife and 2.5 children happily believing he knew everything. Persons of color were confined to their places, out of sight and mind of decent white folks.

Short version: white power and "Leave it to beaver and my 3 sons"

Father Knows Best

 

[Bomb#20]

Blaming free markets for the Great Depression is like blaming religious freedom for the St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre.

1/3 of US banks failed because they were allowed to. QED

Ah, so the standard for "free market" isn't whether your market activity was coerced, but whether the government bailed you out after its intervention made you go belly up in the first place. Got it.

 

[Bomb#20]

To be fair, when Rvonse is being so nostalgic about colour back in the 50s, I don't think he's only referring to the colour of the houses...

It's just he can't bring himself to say the quiet part out loud.

Race has nothing to do with people preferring to purchase non color items. When someone goes into Home Depot to buy gray tile the store does not care the least who buys the tile all they care about is that more and more people are buying gray tile so that is what they order from the manufacture. Same with cars and other items people of all races purchase.

People of all races are buying neutral colors so they can easily resale their investment later and not risk losing equity.

You definitely did not get it. You seem to wax very nostalgic for the 1950/, or perhaps the 1850’s. It is difficult not to believe that the main source of the nostalgia is the societal model was straight white make provider and wife and 2.5 children happily believing he knew everything. Persons of color were confined to their places, out of sight and mind of decent white folks.

Short version: white power and "Leave it to beaver and my 3 sons"

Can either of you two quote RVonse saying anything racist, or are you using ad hominems because your capacities to critique his argument are inadequate?