A woman, identified only as Jane Doe, alleges she was gang-raped by seven fraternity members in 2024 and accuses Cornell University of failing to protect her.
www.cbsnews.com
This part sounds like a major screwup:
According to a transcript of the alleged victim's interview with campus police, obtained by CBS News New York's Mahsa Saeidi from a source, Jane Doe distinguished the initial sexual activity from what she says happened later in the night.
She described drinking and using drugs the night of the alleged rape, and said she had gaps in her memory, according to the transcript.
When asked whether she was OK with the initial encounter, she said, "Yeah, as much as I can be because, again, I was super drunk when I got there ... But I was pretty OK with all of this."
When describing what happened later in the night, the transcript says Jane Doe said, "I can say with 100% confidence I was raped."
The interview began on Nov. 14, 2024 — more than three weeks after the alleged gang rape — and continued the next day.
The transcript was used as the basis for the alleged victim's written statement, and it shows the investigator read her account back to her word by word and gave her a chance to clarify or correct the record.
On the second day of the interview, Jane Doe reviewed the revised six-page statement. The transcript shows her adviser asked if she wanted her and another adviser to review the statement.
Before signing, the transcript shows Jane Doe said, "I'm very confident about this."
Tompkins County District Attorney Matthew Van Houten told CBS News Tuesday night that he was never provided the full transcripts of those initial interviews Jane Doe conducted with Cornell school police.
He said the sworn statement submitted to his office in November 2024 made no mention of the statements that were made in the transcript obtained by CBS News New York, specifically Doe telling school investigators, "I can say with 100 percent confidence I was raped."
"I never saw it, never heard it until tonight," Van Houten told CBS News. "If it exists, I will get it. You can be sure of that."
...
Cornell University said it's police department provided the results of the school's investigation to the DA.
WTF???
And this part will be very problematic for the prosecution:
CBS said:
Screenshots of a separate text exchange, also reported exclusively by CBS News New York, show what a source describes as messages sent two days later between Jane Doe and one of the defendants now accused in the lawsuit.
The man started by apologizing for "how things went down." He said his memory is "kinda fuzzy," and that he and another man feel bad for being too intoxicated to "shut it down and kick people out before it got way out of hand."
The woman in the text chain replied that her memory is "super clouded too," and said they had all been heavily intoxicated.
She also wrote, "non(e) of the sexual stuff was illegal." She said she liked being with him and another man. Later, she suggested they smoke together again, "but like leave out the extra 5 billion men and ketamine."
The woman's attorney, Thomas Giuffra, confirmed she exchanged texts with this defendant shortly after the alleged assault, but he could not confirm whether these were the specific texts.
Giuffra said she was in denial and traumatized shortly after the alleged assaults. He said she was intoxicated to the point of incapacity that night and was trying to find out what happened.
Personally, I am wondering if these text messages also need to be put into the context of her distinction between the initial encounter and then what transpired later. In other words, this person was part of the initial encounter which she initially described as consensual. His charges or claims against him are probably very minimal in comparison to the others. And she was being loose with language to get information about what happened. "You're not in trouble, just tell me what happened."
I am seeing that text as a big barrier, though, in the case.
Yes, I see the barrier but I see it as a barrier that is comprised of the absolute fact that relatively few males ever experience rape from a victim's POV and especially very few (relatively speaking---1 is too many for anybody, full stop) are victims of a gang rape.
It is extremely extremely extremely common for the victim to initially minimize what happened, to downplay it. Even more so if they were intoxicated during the assault. Both trauma and intoxication work against recall. Details and even large portions of the event sometimes come back over time. Days, weeks, months. Sometimes years.
In the other thread, I wrote about shutting down what was shaping up to be the gang rape of my very intoxicated friend who was laying on a bed, declaring how much she just loved everybody in the whole world. Happy if extremely infrequent drunk. In fact, that was the only time I ever saw her even slightly intoxicated. The next day, she was upset/embarrassed, mostly because her asshole boyfriend who abandoned her was angry with her and because the guys were suggesting that the two of us were lovers, which is why I stopped what was happening. Because why else would anyone stop what looked like a rape unless they wanted sole proprietorship amiright??? I remember bursting out laughing at the suggestion but she was upset and embarrassed. She never actually remembered most of what happened that night and did not actually remember at the time the menace of what was happening. My friend was tall, slender--a dancer's body, very smart and outwardly very sure of herself. Inwardly, not so much which is how I understand why she ever dated her boyfriend at the time. He was cute but not particularly smart and not particularly mature for his age. Because she was smart, beautiful and very articulate and btw, ambitious, there were a bunch of guys who were not overly fond of her. They preferred dumb and quiet, preferably with big boobs. Or someone they thought was easy and yeah, they equated blonde and boobs with dumb. #Not all guys of course, and not even all guys on that floor or in that dorm. But enough guys.
My reputation as a lesbian (I am not a lesbian although at that particular period of time, if I could have changed my orientation to lesbian, I might well have done--lots of shitty guys around) was further solidified when the same friend and actually another friend would frequently recruit me to stick around when particular guys stopped by or was coming to work on a project or whatever because they knew he was pushing for contact they did not wish. Somehow, and I never and still do not quite understand it, they did not feel capable of fending off the guys in question on their own. Both were beautiful and extremely smart. The only thing I can think of is that generally speaking, girls are raised/socialized to be nice, polite, accommodating, reassuring, placating. As odd as this is to write, I had had the benefit of being assaulted when I was much younger than college age and spent several years fending off disgusting advances so I had my NO down really really firmly. And, I am a fight not flight or freeze person so I will hurt someone who tries to hurt me or someone I care about. Not my first move but if necessary, yeah I will hurt you and not feel guilty about it at all. This was not without risk to me: One would be suitor was so enraged at my cockblocking that he wrapped his bicycle chain around my neck and pulled tight. I laughed in his face and fortunately there were two other guys standing by who looked alarmed and made him stop. So heck of a nice guy, huh?
I've had a number of women describe to me sexual encounters that were not consensual, that they did not want, that they tried to refuse but ultimately acquiesced to avoid being hurt more. They did not call those events rape but that is what they described to me. Rarely was any alcohol involved. There was a lot of self blame, fear they had 'led him on' because they knew he 'liked them' more than they liked him and they were trying to be nice and didn't expect things to 'go that way.'
Self doubt, self blame is common among victims of sexual assault. How could I have been so dumb? Did I lead him on? Why did I go there/drink that/say that/accept a ride/wear that/ad nauseum. As if there was a magic spell one could weave, perfect behavior one could model that would ward off sexual assault.
There is not.
So it is unsurprising that Cornell's Jane Doe did not immediately go to the police (universities heavily discourage rape victims from reporting to police, everywhere) or that she did not fully grasp exactly what happened, especially given the ketamine but alcohol would have been enough plus trauma. Given that she, for some incomprehensible reason, still thought she liked the guy who put her in that situation, she was still in the placating/minimizing mode. Horrible but not surprising.
I realize that almost none of the men will believe or accept this. Probably would never even consider this unless they had been rape victims themselves or perhaps someone they cared about was. Even then, there's a lot of doubt.
