Another Fucking Mass Shooting At US School

[Derec]

Yup. Not only are they out getting guns, they are idiots.

They are probably rushing to buy because they fear another "assault weapons" ban.

 

[Patooka]

They are probably rushing to buy because they fear another "assault weapons" ban.

Further reinforcing that they are idiots.

 

[Derec]

That's right. And the Uvalde killer, instead of walking into a gun-store on his 18th birthday and walking out with an AR-15 and a crate of ammunition, might have recalled his Eagle Scout skills and built himself a bow-and-arrow set.

Or he could have gotten himself a handgun or two.

Vast majority of gun homicides are perpetrated by handguns, not rifles of any kind. And scary "assault weapons" are a subset of rifles.
Even when we limit ourselves to "mass shootings", handguns predominate.

 

[Derec]

Further reinforcing that they are idiots.

It's not that far-fetched. An "assault weapons" ban existed between 1994-2004.
It did not stop Columbine, of course.

 

[Patooka]

It's not that far-fetched. An "assault weapons" ban existed between 1994-2004.
It did not stop Columbine, of course.

Please list the vast number of Republicans willing to commit political suicide allowing such a thing to happen. I'll wait.

 

[Derec]

CDC data shows that for children and adolescents ages 1 to 18, and ages 1 to 19, firearms were the leading cause of death in 2020.
Researchers from Johns Hopkins, the University of Michigan, and the Rockefeller Institute of Government analyzed CDC data and confirmed these findings.

One of the reasons is surely that others causes of death, especially disease, have been reduced so much. So something like this can come up as cause number one even if it does not account for many deaths at all.

Note also that vast majority of firearm deaths for people under 18 in the US are not school shootings like Uvalde or Sandy Hook or Parkland.
Most firearm deaths are teenagers shooting each other.
Like this girl:
A murdered teen, two million tweets and an experiment to fight gun violence

 

[Derec]

Guns like the AR15 are designed to make it easy to kill a lot of people, even when wielded by a novice. They are not really designed for hunting or sport shooting, even though they can be used for such activities, especially hunting dangerous game like feral hogs (which is a thing in the south). Guns like the AR15 and its derivatives don't belong in the hands of civilians. That was my point.

Handguns are also easy to wield, and if fact account for far more gun homicides than rifles of any type. '
To focus on AR-15s and similar while ignoring handguns would be a major mistake.

 

[Derec]

The AR15 is a military weapon.

Fully auto version certainly is. The semi-auto is the civilian version.

It has much higher velocity and a round that tumbles and causes much more damage to its victim.

Any gun that fires a similar cartridge and has a similar barrel length will have similar ballistic properties.
So-called "assault weapons" are not unique in firing a small projectile at a high muzzle velocity.

 

[Derec]

s are something that america does seem to get upset about, and while it might seem a bit arbitrary and kind of silly

It is arbitrary and capricious.

if the pro-gun people would shut the fuck up about it and let assault weapons be banned, they could own all the handguns and rifles and shotguns they want, which i thought was the real purpose of their pro-gun stance in the first place.

The assault weapons ban discriminated against certain gun largely based on how they looked.
The law wasn't based on firepower but on things like shoulder things that go up.

 

[prideandfall]

s are something that america does seem to get upset about, and while it might seem a bit arbitrary and kind of silly

It is arbitrary and capricious.

if the pro-gun people would shut the fuck up about it and let assault weapons be banned, they could own all the handguns and rifles and shotguns they want, which i thought was the real purpose of their pro-gun stance in the first place.

The assault weapons ban discriminated against certain gun largely based on how they looked.
The law wasn't based on firepower but on things like shoulder things that go up.

ok, and?

so just concede the point to the people who don't like it then go back to hording all your other firearms.

 

[laughing dog]

Guns like the AR15 are designed to make it easy to kill a lot of people, even when wielded by a novice. They are not really designed for hunting or sport shooting, even though they can be used for such activities, especially hunting dangerous game like feral hogs (which is a thing in the south). Guns like the AR15 and its derivatives don't belong in the hands of civilians. That was my point.

Handguns are also easy to wield, and if fact account for far more gun homicides than rifles of any type. '
To focus on AR-15s and similar while ignoring handguns would be a major mistake.

Not really. Focusing on the easy (weapons like the AR -15) would reduce the killing, especially the “large number” mass shootings. It might make it easier to move onto handguns.

 

[Derec]

Pretty much every handgun I have used (numerous 1911s, Glocks, Berettas and others) are vastly inferior to an AR15 as a weapon of mass killing.

And yet handguns kill vastly more people than so-called "assault weapons".

The AR15 is light, ergonomic, easy to aim and has a mild recoil that makes it perfect for the novice and expert alike, and I'm not even counting on the magazine capacity.

Wait, didn't one of our Congresswomen say that an AR15 weighed as much as 10 moving boxes?

Or could it be she confused it with an AR50? (described by Mike Ehrmantraut as "a hernia with a scope on it"). Btw, the AR50 is not an evil semi-auto but rather a harmless bolt-action rifle.

Back to AR15. It is relatively light weight (6.5 lbs) but still weighs far more than a handgun (a Glock 17 is less than 1.5 lbs).
And handguns can also accept large magazines.

Most handguns require experience to be used efficiently and effectively against multiple targets, and some can be extremely picky about ammo and regular cleaning.

More so than a rifle? Why?

 

[Derec]

Not really. Focusing on the easy (weapons like the AR -15) would reduce the killing, especially the “large number” mass shootings.

Would it? The shooters in Columbine did not use any assault weapons.
The Virginia Tech shooter used two handguns and he managed to kill 33 people and injure some more.

It might make it easier to move onto handguns.

So you admit your goal is to ban all firearms?

 

[Tigers!]

View attachment 38936

What you build with Legos is amazing these days.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Guns like the AR15 are designed to make it easy to kill a lot of people, even when wielded by a novice. They are not really designed for hunting or sport shooting, even though they can be used for such activities, especially hunting dangerous game like feral hogs (which is a thing in the south). Guns like the AR15 and its derivatives don't belong in the hands of civilians. That was my point.

Handguns are also easy to wield, and if fact account for far more gun homicides than rifles of any type. '
To focus on AR-15s and similar while ignoring handguns would be a major mistake.

It's about chipping away at guns, just like the right chipped away at abortion.

 

[Elixir]

More so than a rifle? Why?

Have you ever shot one? I mean, emptied a few clips in a minute or two?
AR15s are fun, easy, fast, light and deadly with almost no recoil. A whole other experience from you daddy’s bolt action 30-06 or even a semi-auto 30-30.

 

[laughing dog]

Not really. Focusing on the easy (weapons like the AR -15) would reduce the killing, especially the “large number” mass shootings.

Would it? The shooters in Columbine did not use any assault weapons.
The Virginia Tech shooter used two handguns and he managed to kill 33 people and injure some more.

Apparently the difference between “reduce” and “eliminate” eludes you.

So you admit your goal is to ban all firearms?

No. How did you find the NRA convention?

 

[ZiprHead]

The AR15 is a military weapon.

Fully auto version certainly is. The semi-auto is the civilian version.

It has much higher velocity and a round that tumbles and causes much more damage to its victim.

Any gun that fires a similar cartridge and has a similar barrel length will have similar ballistic properties.
So-called "assault weapons" are not unique in firing a small projectile at a high muzzle velocity.

Sorry but no. The creator of the AR15 said it was never intended for civilian use.

 

[Ford]

View attachment 38936

Daniel Defense is the Firearms store that sold Ramos his gun. This was posted 8 days before the shooting.

This kid appears to be only a little older than my grandson. His dad is teaching him to be a White Sox fan, and that's okay.

My dad? He taught us responsible handling of firearms, but we didn't even get to touch so much as a bb gun until we were about twice this kid's age. I remember one day when I was about 10, and my dad was cleaning his shotgun on the kitchen table after a hunting trip. It was disassembled, and being curious, I picked up the barrel and looked down it from the wrong end. My dad about lost his fucking mind. Lecture? Check. Sent to my room? Check. Grounded? Check.

He was right. Even though I could see clear from one end of the barrel to the other, I never should have put the business end of it anywhere near my face. This photo isn't just an example of bad parenting. It is a company that is fucking encouraging parents to hand their kids a weapon at an age when the only thing that's age-appropriate is maybe a plastic squirt gun.

I am at a loss.

 

[Jarhyn]

Im kind of shocked at the tenacity of folks to argue against military veterans about whether the AR15 is more "combat oriented" and "deadly".

Of course it is.

Any rifle with a pistol grip loses accuracy in exchange for ready time. The angle of the wrist just makes it so much easier to fire while moving and standing. It's the ability to get your hand around the whole thing, and the perpendicularly of the wrist in the motion.

Combine that with the action of the thing, smooth on a massive round, and it's just so much more deadly it doesn't bear comparison.

It's a weapon, for a war, not a tool for getting meals.