Texas Secessionists Push for Referendum on State Becoming Independent

[Oleg]

If I recall the last time some states tried to secede there was a bit of shooting for a few years.

Back then the US was much more homogeneous and patriotic. Neither side had much difficulty gettting willing and motivated volunteers. I seriously doubt that's true today. Can't see Zoomers lining up to fight any war.

 

[TomC]

Back then the US was much more homogeneous and patriotic.

I can't imagine why anybody thinks that.

The northern army invaded the Confederacy because U.S. was far more about States than United.
Tom

 

[Oleg]

Back then the US was much more homogeneous and patriotic.

I can't imagine why anybody thinks that.

The northern army invaded the Confederacy because U.S. was far more about States than United.
Tom

The Southerners were patrotic for the South. No denying that. The Confederacy had no difficulty getting recruits.

 

[TomC]

The Southerners were patrotic for the South. No denying that. The Confederacy had no difficulty getting recruits.

The southerners lived in a different country from the northerners.

They were patriotic, concerning their own country.

That's what made the war of Northern Aggression so long, bloody, and destructive. Northerners were fighting for wealth, power, and Glory. Southerners were fighting for themselves, their families, and their homes. Northerners had industrial power behind them. Southerners were fighting for themselves on the land they grew up on.
Tom

 

[Oleg]

The Southerners were patrotic for the South. No denying that. The Confederacy had no difficulty getting recruits.

The southerners lived in a different country from the northerners.

They were patriotic, concerning their own country.

That's what made the war of Northern Aggression so long, bloody, and destructive. Northerners were fighting for wealth, power, and Glory. Southerners were fighting for themselves, their families, and their homes. Northerners had industrial power behind them. Southerners were fighting for themselves on the land they grew up on.
Tom

I agree. There is no greater motivation for a young man to fight than that a foreigner is in his land. I just don't see the current US military age population heading to the recruiting office if Texas, or California, or Alaska, or whatever state, opts to depart. The past is indeed a different country.

 

[laughing dog]

Back then the US was much more homogeneous and patriotic.

I can't imagine why anybody thinks that.

The northern army invaded the Confederacy because U.S. was far more about States than United.
Tom

Yeah, having a fort attacked had nothing to do with it.

 

[TomC]

Back then the US was much more homogeneous and patriotic.

I can't imagine why anybody thinks that.

The northern army invaded the Confederacy because U.S. was far more about States than United.
Tom

Yeah, having a fort attacked had nothing to do with it.

You mean
A fort in the midst of Charleston Harbor?

What do you think that the invaders were doing there? Having a picnic?
Tom

 

[Politesse]

The Southerners were patrotic for the South. No denying that. The Confederacy had no difficulty getting recruits.

The southerners lived in a different country from the northerners.

They were patriotic, concerning their own country.

That's what made the war of Northern Aggression so long, bloody, and destructive. Northerners were fighting for wealth, power, and Glory. Southerners were fighting for themselves, their families, and their homes. Northerners had industrial power behind them. Southerners were fighting for themselves on the land they grew up on.
Tom

That is a severely disingenuous take. The South wasn't just sitting down there passively getting invaded, the Northerners also had homes to defend.

 

[Oleg]

The Southerners were patrotic for the South. No denying that. The Confederacy had no difficulty getting recruits.

The southerners lived in a different country from the northerners.

They were patriotic, concerning their own country.

That's what made the war of Northern Aggression so long, bloody, and destructive. Northerners were fighting for wealth, power, and Glory. Southerners were fighting for themselves, their families, and their homes. Northerners had industrial power behind them. Southerners were fighting for themselves on the land they grew up on.
Tom

That is a severely disingenuous take. The South wasn't just sitting down there passively getting invaded, the Northerners also had homes to defend.

Okay. I didn’t intend my comment to open a likely long discussion on the Civil War. My point is that the generation that fought that war was highly homogeneous and nationalistic, on both sides. The present crop of young men are just not like that.

 

[TomC]

That is a severely disingenuous take. The South wasn't just sitting down there passively getting invaded, the Northerners also had homes to defend.

When did southerners invade the homes of northerners?

Sorry, history revisionist. That didn't happen. Northerners invaded the Confederacy. Invaded the homes and families of citizens of the Confederacy.

You can pretend that the Confederates were the Aggressors all you want. But the facts remain. The Confederacy was attacked and invaded and ultimately destroyed.
Tom

 

[laughing dog]

Back then the US was much more homogeneous and patriotic.

I can't imagine why anybody thinks that.

The northern army invaded the Confederacy because U.S. was far more about States than United.
Tom

Yeah, having a fort attacked had nothing to do with it.

You mean
A fort in the midst of Charleston Harbor?

What do you think that the invaders were doing there? Having a picnic?
Tom

Fort Sumter was built in 1814 as a reaction to the war of 1812. It is either disingenuous or ignorant to portray it as part of an invading force.

The fact is that the Confederacy attacked Fort Sumter.

 

[Politesse]

That is a severely disingenuous take. The South wasn't just sitting down there passively getting invaded, the Northerners also had homes to defend.

When did southerners invade the homes of northerners?

Sorry, history revisionist. That didn't happen. Northerners invaded the Confederacy. Invaded the homes and families of citizens of the Confederacy.

You can pretend that the Confederates were the Aggressors all you want. But the facts remain. The Confederacy was attacked and invaded and ultimately destroyed.
Tom

I don't have a "side". I wasn't there, and my family that were there were split down the middle by the affair. But you're just not talking facts here. Both sides invaded one another's territories at various stages of the war, as every American schoolchild knows. Most of us memorize the Gettysburg address, delivered at the terminus of the Gettysburg campaign. The fact that the invasion was rebuffed in no way changes the fact that it was intended as an invasion, ditto the Early campaign, Glorieta Pass, etc. I do not see the North's full scale invasion of the South as defensible, nor their slaughter of civilians, and the ongoing negative ramifications of those acts even in modern politics are plain for anyone to see. But no cause is best served by misrepresenting history.

 

[TomC]

Both sides invaded one another's territories at various stages of the war,

When did a Confederate soldier invade a northern home?

I'm saying it was after the northerners invaded and destroyed the homes and families of Confederates.
Many times.

If you've got an example of a Confederate soldier invading the home of a northerner before his own home had been invaded, feel free to show it. I don't think you can.
Tom

 

[laughing dog]

Both sides invaded one another's territories at various stages of the war,

When did a Confederate soldier invade a northern home?

I'm saying it was after the northerners invaded and destroyed the homes and families of Confederates.
Many times.

If you've got an example of a Confederate soldier invading the home of a northerner before his own home had been invaded, feel free to show it. I don't think you can.
Tom

Really, you can show that all the Confederate soldiers at Gettysburg had had their own homes invaded?

 

[TomC]

Really, you can show that all the Confederate soldiers at Gettysburg had had their own homes invaded?

Heh

You probably think I said that.
Tom

 

[bilby]

Really, you can show that all the Confederate soldiers at Gettysburg had had their own homes invaded?

Heh

You probably think I said that.
Tom

Heh.

It's possible that you might even think you didn't.

 

[laughing dog]

Really, you can show that all the Confederate soldiers at Gettysburg had had their own homes invaded?

Heh

You probably think I said that.
Tom

I employed your standard of

If you've got an example of a Confederate soldier invading the home of a northerner before his own home had been invaded, feel free to show it.

I doubt anyone has access to the sufficient information to successfully meet the standard of identifying a soldier from either army who invaded a home of the enemy after his home had been invaded.

Of course, you can prove me wrong by coming up with evidence of a Confederate soldier who invaded a home in the North after his home had been invaded. Or you can stop demanding evidence that is impossible to provide. Or even pay attention to the words in your posts so that you can avoid having to "clarify" the meanings of posts, because Politesse did correctly answer your question of "When did southerners invade the homes of northerners?" with Gettysburg.

 

[Politesse]

Both sides invaded one another's territories at various stages of the war,

When did a Confederate soldier invade a northern home?

I'm saying it was after the northerners invaded and destroyed the homes and families of Confederates.
Many times.

If you've got an example of a Confederate soldier invading the home of a northerner before his own home had been invaded, feel free to show it. I don't think you can.
Tom

Your rapidly wandering goalpost is noted, but we will resolve nothing by fighting the battle over again.

 

[TomC]

Your rapidly wandering goalpost is noted,

"rapidly wandering goalpost"?

I keep pointing out that the Confederate States were invaded by the northerners.

That's what happened.
Tom

 

[bilby]

Your rapidly wandering goalpost is noted,

"rapidly wandering goalpost"?

I keep pointing out that the Confederate States were invaded by the northerners.

That's what happened.
Tom

That's not all that happened, though...