What if the shooter had been a christian republican?

[Tigers!]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/12/us/muslim-student-shootings-north-carolina.html

I wonder why these fora has been quiet about this?
I can imagine the reaction if the shooter had been a Christian republican.
I can imagine the reaction if the victims were black.

Yet an atheist murders Muslims and there is thundering silence.

Why?

(Before some one pipes in about the possible parking dispute would you allow a Christian republican that latitude? I doubt it.)

 

[ZiprHead]

I just heard about this ten minutes ago on the morning news. Jeez!

 

[AthenaAwakened]

The shooting happened Tuesday night

It's Thursday morning

It hasn't been 48 hours yet.

And the story is still unfolding.

Condolences to the family.

(I am sure you simply forgot to offer your sentiments to the family Tigers!. I mean, in your righteous indignation of the hypocrisy of atheists, you simple over looked common courtesy.)

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There is no central tenants of being an Atheist. What was done was awful, but I don't see how that falls to other Atheists.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

 

[ksen]

There is no central tenants of being an Atheist.

Don't tell Sam Harris or Peezus Myers.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There is no central tenants of being an Atheist.

Don't tell Sam Harris or Peezus Myers.

I read that as Sam Houston for some reason.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Don't tell Sam Harris or Peezus Myers.

I read that as Sam Houston for some reason.

Damn those Alamo Flashbacks!

 

[laughing dog]

(Before some one pipes in about the possible parking dispute would you allow a Christian republican that latitude? I doubt it.)

Actually, that would completely explain the shooting in my eyes (but not justify it).

 

[dismal]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/12/us/muslim-student-shootings-north-carolina.html

I wonder why these fora has been quiet about this?
I can imagine the reaction if the shooter had been a Christian republican.
I can imagine the reaction if the victims were black.

Yet an atheist murders Muslims and there is thundering silence.

Why?

(Before some one pipes in about the possible parking dispute would you allow a Christian republican that latitude? I doubt it.)

If it doesn't make alternet or dailykos how are people here supposed to know it even happened?

 

[RavenSky]

News reports are not clear - did Craig Hicks target only these people over parking issues, or was he generally a jackass to everyone on that topic? Or did this family have a habit of parking in this man's parking space? The brother of the dead man reports that he, too, parked in Craig Hick's parking space and was yelled at by Craig Hicks for it. Was there assigned parking, or did Craig Hicks simply feel like a particular spot was "his" because he typically parked there?

Nothing in this incident justifies Craig Hick's murdering three people - not parking disputes, not his apparently hatred for all religion - but it would be interesting to know what the full story was.

As to this being an anti-Muslim shooting, allegedly his Facebook posts are more anti-Christian and anti-religion than specifically anti-Muslim. If this was a hate crime, it sounds like it is anti-religions-in-general than anti-Muslim. But even that doesn't seem likely since the same Facebook account has multiple posts stating that as much as he is against religion - especially religions imposing into governmental matters - he fully supports everyone's individual right to believe whatever religion they want.

All in all, it does sound like anger management issues coupled with easy access to guns is more to blame here than any sort of anti-Muslim bias.

 

[ksen]

News reports are not clear - did Craig Hicks target only these people over parking issues, or was he generally a jackass to everyone on that topic?

From what I've read he was a dick to everyone about it and the towing company eventually stopped taking his calls.

However, it was only the muslim ones that got bullets to the head about it. The fact that they were killed "execution" style makes me think it was more than just parking space rage.

 

[Rhea]

I had some busy days and haven't posted on this, but I've been thinking about it.

This guy was violent anti-theist. Which I guess is the exact equivalent of a violent extremist religionist. There aren't very many violent anti-theists, but they are equally vile. What's unfortunate about this guy (society-wise) is that his anti-theism alone didn't have enough to reach this level.

Yes, he is an asshole and definitely a bigot against religionists. Apparently exacerbated by overt symbols of religion. So he makes mountains out of molehills in daily living disputes, apparently because of the religion of the people. Meaning, I suspect he feels especially aggrieved by their parking because of their muslim symbols. He's an extremist and a bigot. bad stuff. Glad there are not very many of them.


What turns it tragic, I think, is the addition of gun culture onto his bigotry.



And that's when it turns from vile to tragic.
I'm glad there are not centers of gathering for anti-theists, nor preachers of this hate. But there are gatherings for gun culture and preachers of that culture, so there is a risk of it spreading. It needs to be stopped. Bigots need to be stopped. It's one thing to hate religion and want to see its influence diminished. But it's another to hate people and want to harm them. This guy is a rotten spot. Others like him need to be identified and defused.


edited - after reading other posts about his facebook, I need to make it clear that my reaction is preliminary and subject to change with incoming data. E.g. I did not read about his respect for people to believe, and I have no idea how many other people he threatened about this parking space.

 

[ronburgundy]

The reason there was no thread about it, besides just happening 48 hours ago, is that there is no evidence it has anything to do with race, religion, or politics other than being more evidence in support of gun control.

Every reported fact points to it being motivated by a long-standing dispute over parking and nothing points to being shot for being Muslim.
The media scoured this guy's posts and the most "threatening" thing they found was a criticism of the general practice of prayer, not at all directed at Muslims.

People shoot people over stupid shit, and (outside of war) it usually has nothing to do with religion or race. Sometimes, the people shot for the countless other stupid reasons will be Muslim. Sometimes, (though disproportionately infrequently), the shooter will be an atheist.

Hey Tiger, can you point us to a single time on this board where a person shot another person and the consensus here was that it was religiously motivated, despite there being no evidence of such other than differing religious views of the parties involved?

 

[ronburgundy]

News reports are not clear - did Craig Hicks target only these people over parking issues, or was he generally a jackass to everyone on that topic?

From what I've read he was a dick to everyone about it and the towing company eventually stopped taking his calls.

However, it was only the muslim ones that got bullets to the head about it. The fact that they were killed "execution" style makes me think it was more than just parking space rage.

Poor reasoning there. If he had already shot someone else over it, he'd be in jail (unless in Florida). IOW, your argument that since he hadn't previously shot a bunch of people over it, it must of been their religion makes no sense. The people he shot were, in his mind, repeat offenders that he had confronted about it before (and didn't shoot them before), and he knew where they lived. He worked himself into a rage over time about the issue (and was probably a rageful prick in general), then one day he went over the edge. Nearly everyone who parked in his spot was religious (we know that probabilistically) and the evidence suggest that if anything, he was more annoyed with Christians (though I have yet to see anything other than critiques of religious practices and beliefs). So, it makes no sense to assume that it was their being Muslim that was a major factor. IF he had shot any other of the parking offenders, they would have likely been religious too and thus the same baseless claims would be made that he shot them for whatever religion they were.

 

[RavenSky]

News reports are not clear - did Craig Hicks target only these people over parking issues, or was he generally a jackass to everyone on that topic?

From what I've read he was a dick to everyone about it and the towing company eventually stopped taking his calls.

yep, I found this article shortly after I posted: http://www.wsj.com/articles/alleged...ing-disputes-tow-truck-driver-says-1423706574

It says that he was an asshole to just about everyone over parking, and that parking was assigned.

However, it was only the muslim ones that got bullets to the head about it. The fact that they were killed "execution" style makes me think it was more than just parking space rage.

I suspect that was perhaps more coincidence than anything. I just don't see anything reported so far that indicates he targeted Muslims.

Which is not to say there aren't atheists who disproportionately target Muslims for their anti-religion rants. We know they exist I just don't see evidence that this guy was one of them. He seems to have been more anti-Christian than anti-Muslim.

 

[Rhea]

Looks like I may have been off base blaming his anti-theism.

Hicks' current wife, Karen Diane Haggerty, described her husband after the shooting as a champion of the rights of gays and minorities.

"This incident had nothing to do with religion or the victims' faith but was related to a longstanding parking dispute that my husband had with the neighbors," she told reporters, as quoted by USA Today.

and his own words,

The lead photo on Hick's Facebook page professed his belief in "anti-theism" and stated that he wants "religion to go away."

"I don't deny you your right to believe whatever you'd like; but I have the right to point out it's ignorant and dangerous for as long as your baseless superstitions keep killing people," the text in the photo read.

doesn't look violent in his anti-theism there. So I will refrain from further comment as I wait for more to become factual. perhaps he will speak on it himself.

 

[RavenSky]

It is rather ironic that he talks about someone else's "baseless superstitions" leading to killing people, then he kills three people over... what... a parking spot? I don't think we could find a more baseless reason than that.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Like I said, it has been less than 48 hours and the story is still unfolding. Right now all we know is that three people are dead, a family and community are in mourning, the shooter is in custody, and nerves are raw. All kinds of things will said over the next few news cycles that will have no basis in reality. Let's just wait and see.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I don't know, I think I'd prefer their deaths be about their religion and not something as unbelievably trite as a parking space.