How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Ovazor]

No, the real problem is that a Russian supremacist cannot endure the thought of truly sovereign and independent countries if they formerly controlled those. They can be nominally independent as long as they toe the Moscow line, but a Russian supremacist feels threatened by a truly independent former republic. Just look at your own statement.

 

[Ovazor]

Right now yes, they have no agencies, becasue you denied it.
Elensky was elected on the promise of settling with Russia. Then you ordered him to not do that. Ad now ukrainians are kidnapped on the streets and sent to die for EU cleptocrats, and elections are cancelled, along with all opposition parties.
Agency my ass.

You don't seem even to understand what have agency means. It means that they can decide. But in your view they are always only puppets, either Russian or American. It is not so.

 

[barbos]

Right now yes, they have no agencies, becasue you denied it.
Elensky was elected on the promise of settling with Russia. Then you ordered him to not do that. Ad now ukrainians are kidnapped on the streets and sent to die for EU cleptocrats, and elections are cancelled, along with all opposition parties.
Agency my ass.

You don't seem even to understand what have agency means. It means that they can decide. But in your view they are always only puppets, either Russian or American. It is not so.

They did not decide any of that. Nuland decided for them.
They had not been russian puppets in their 1991-2014 years.
We were ridiculously patient with all their crap until Nuland&Co decided that they needed a proxy war with Russia. And even after that we were patient and had waited for 8 years for them to come to their senses and choose a correct path of neutrality. Elensky appeared a sane guy before elections. But apparently was not brave enough to go against CIA and nazis.
Well, too bad. There will be no Ukraine left soon. It will become a russian Oblast.

 

[Ovazor]

They did not decide any of that. Nuland decided for them.

You are still denying the fact that it was Ukrainians that were fed of the corrupt government by incompetent kleptocrat but insist it was all conspiracy. How did Nuland get hundreds of thousands of people to go out and protest against their will?

We were ridiculously patient with all their crap until Nuland&Co decided that they needed a proxy war with Russia.

Ukraine did not start a war with Russia, Russia started the war.

And even after that we were patient and had waited for 10 years for them to come to their senses and choose a correct path of neutrality.

So, Russia started an illegal irredentist invasion because Ukraine disrespected Russia by making independent decisions about her foreign policy? Why do you think that that argument gains you any sympathy?

 

[bilby]

Fuck your imaginary "neocon papers".

Imaginary ?
Fuck nazi shit you post here!
Rand Corporation is a terrorist organization.

Perhaps. I couldn't care less about the Rand Corporation. Are they even still a thing? I remember them from the Cold War.

 

[bilby]

EU/US are terrorist and nazi regimes.

They are neither.

You need to calm down and start observing and thinking, instead of just believing.

 

[bilby]

Our government does lie a little.

A LITTLE???

 

[ZiprHead]

Is this Bald guy on the right an AI?

Never any end to Russian shills. I guess rubles spend just as well as dollars.

Speaking like a true patriot of American Empire.

I'm not the one posting videos by kiddie diddlers.

 

[ZiprHead]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

 

[Harry Bosch]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

View attachment 50874
View attachment 50875

Those bombers look perfectly fixable to me!

 

[Elixir]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

View attachment 50874
View attachment 50875

Those bombers look perfectly fixable to me!

Good parts planes.

 

[steve_bank]

Ukraine managed to get shipping containers into Russia during a war undetected carrying drones. Military targets and a critical bridge attacked.

I am sure Putin and his militray and intelligence staff are rolling on the floor laughing.

They should have hit the Kremlin or Putin's private residence.

 

[ZiprHead]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

View attachment 50874
View attachment 50875

Those bombers look perfectly fixable to me!

Yup. That'll buff right out.

 

[bilby]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

View attachment 50874
View attachment 50875

That'll buff out.

 

[bilby]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

View attachment 50874
View attachment 50875

Those bombers look perfectly fixable to me!

Yup. That'll buff right out.

GMTA

 

[steve_bank]

Barbos

Are you familiar with Zaitsev? I first learned about him in a book on the Battle Of Stalingrad.

I read several books about the Russian front along with other books about the African, European, and Pacific fronts.
Do you know anything about the campaigns in North Africa, Europe, Guadalcanal, Midway, and Okinawa? Do you know anything about the naval war in the North Atlantic that kept supplies from Canada and America coming to Russia?

Russia did in n no way single handedly ‘defeat the Germans’.
I am sure in conversation some will say we(America) defeated the Germans, but in general it is usually attributed to the combined efforts of the Allies. ‘We’ did it.

Russia was never really part of the Allies, more like the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

Dwight D. Eisenhower, the Allied supreme commander, strategically chose not to push Western Allied forces to capture Berlin first during the final stages of WWII. His decision was rooted in a few key factors, including pre-existing agreements about how Germany would be divided after the war, a belief that capturing Berlin would result in unnecessary casualties and friendly fire, and a desire to avoid a potentially complex and chaotic situation of both Allied and Soviet forces attempting to enter the city simultaneously.

My point is Russian post revolution hatred of the west emphasized by Putin is counterproductive and ignores history. It is a moot point as Putin has by his words backed himself into a corner with no possibility of a rapprochement with the west.

Putin is obsessed with an image of Russia as great dominating empire of past Russian history, and like Hitler will drag down his country trying.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[bilby]

I understand that in some quarters, 18-wheeler trucks are now being called "Ukrainian Aircraft Carriers".

 

[Tigers!]

That depends how shitty the Soviet manufacturing process was in the first place. If a fire has occurred close to the main spar (which it has)

Planes are 70 years old. I think they were well constructed.
Fire while impressive does not mean it spread beyond engines.

View attachment 50874
View attachment 50875

They might be able to build one bomber out of the pieces of the others (if enough were destroyed). Recycling always works.

 

[ZiprHead]

How much more winning can Russia take?