Dem Post Mortem

[Politesse]

No. I'm saying to quit demand that the government take radical positions.

When simply defending the national Constitution against direct attack is called "radical", that is your warning bell that it's time for some radical action. Read some history books if you don't understand why. Better yet, read some James Baldwin. The heroes we celebrate most in the long run aren't the ones who "did whatever was necessary to win elections". They are those who looked Americans in the eye and refused to let them abandon the best of our values for the sake of momentary fears or expediencies. When called upon to do so, Americans are more than capable of taming that cue, and fixing things ourselves most of the time. Or if we've lost that ability, it's time to let our empire fall, and give way to some younger nations that still have some imagination, and the grit to follow through on it.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The electorate is made up of people. I'm one of them. I'm standing where I am not because I find it a "workable compromise" but because according to decades of asking what the nature of what is right actually is, this is the answer I have found.

In other words, letting perfect be the enemy of good. You can't have everything so you reject a partial solution.

 

[Politesse]

Progressives provide such vision, and they steal the votes the Democrats want.

As do the damned Nazis...

 

[Politesse]

The electorate is made up of people. I'm one of them. I'm standing where I am not because I find it a "workable compromise" but because according to decades of asking what the nature of what is right actually is, this is the answer I have found.

In other words, letting perfect be the enemy of good. You can't have everything so you reject a partial solution.

Working across an ideological divide to come to some sort of compromise is political life. Every Progressive you can throw a dart at makes deals and compromises routinely. But actually embracing conservative ideology as though it were your own and agreeing to call black "white" just because it's popular to do so? Is cowardice. If the Democrats cannot find an answer to the question "what do you stand for?" that doesn't sound like a malfunctioning AI wrote it, they will continue to leak voters for as long as we still have the vote.

 

[Jarhyn]

Progressives provide such vision, and they steal the votes the Democrats want.

As do the damned Nazis...

At the end of the day? Yes. People do want leaders, effective leaders, who push in some direction that we can all more or less get behind.

This is why socialism was viciously attacked: because it presented a direction.

And instead of of viscously attacking the direction of "the other side" and defending that vision, we ended up in a red scare followed by foreign wars designed to cement the defense industry.

 

[ZiprHead]

How many times does it have to be said that coming here and claiming asylum is and does not make you an illegal?

Doing so fraudulently does. Vast majority of the people from places like Honduras, El Salvador etc. come here for "better life", not because they are being prosecuted by their governments.
Example of an asylum seeker, whose family admitted the real reason for his "asylum seeking" only after he died:
Photo of Drowned Migrants Captures Pathos of Those Who Risk It All

Mr. Martínez quit his job at Papa John’s, where he had earned about $350 a month. By then, his wife had already left her job as a cashier at a Chinese restaurant to take care of their daughter.
The couple lived with Mr. Martínez’s mother in the community of Altavista, a massive housing complex of tiny concrete houses east of San Salvador, according to Mr. Beltran.
Though Altavista is under the control of gangs, the couple was not fleeing from violence, Rosa Ramírez, Mr. Martínez’s mother, told him. Rather, the grind of surviving as a family on $10 a day had become unmanageable.

Well, that's one. It certainly doesn't prove "vast majority."

And those claiming asylum are not "illegal" unless their claim is denied and they run from deportation.

 

[Elixir]

those claiming asylum are not "illegal" unless their claim is denied and they run from deportation.

Or, they can show up to their hearing, get kidnapped by anonymous ICE thugs and be summarily disappeared.
WWYD?

 

[Politesse]

 

[Politesse]

Progressives provide such vision, and they steal the votes the Democrats want.

As do the damned Nazis...

At the end of the day? Yes. People do want leaders, effective leaders, who push in some direction that we can all more or less get behind.

This is why socialism was viciously attacked: because it presented a direction.

And instead of of viscously attacking the direction of "the other side" and defending that vision, we ended up in a red scare followed by foreign wars designed to cement the defense industry.

I mean, that's pretty much what happened with the original Nazis. The Weimar government thought they were fighting a war on two fronts. But only one of those fronts fucking mattered.

 

[ZiprHead]

The problem is that they have never really looked.

But that does not change the problem he's pointing out: you represent an attitude that cost the country dearly.

You see the fascist tide rising, and the only villains you see are those who were brave enough to call it what it is.

I see the fascist tide rising and I see a bunch of you sitting back and ignoring it because the alternative wasn't good enough for you.

And we saw the fascist tide rising and said "the solution to this is to do this specific stuff". We said it for decades, and watched people just ignore the advice "because trust us"

Instead of taking the advice and leaning towards social policies and emphasizing the value of social policies, we watched the Democrats do nothing as the GOP maneuvered a coup.

We decided to quit propping up an alternative that was never going to work, not for anyone and most certainly not for the folks championing it.

Or, other people did. I still voted for the ineffective alternative.

You cost the country dearly. You and anyone else who leaned right, from the left. The only question was whether they would get more time to dig the hole deeper.

2024 had so many voting irregularities that it's clear that one didn't even matter; 2016 was the last election that mattered, and YOU lot fucked it up by not playing ball with Bernie and taking whatever licks the scoreboard indicated.

You're just repeating yourself. I'm pointing out that you're in a hole (wanting policies left of the electorate) and your response is dig deeper (move farther from the electorate.)

You have yet to prove that conjecture.

 

[Politesse]

He opposes the chancellor's plans for the Empire. Doesn't that seem seditious to you?

 

[Derec]

He opposes the chancellor's plans for the Empire. Doesn't that seem seditious to you?

More like Sidious.

 

[Derec]

What is actually radical about Mamdani's agenda?

Rent freezes, $30 minimum wage^*, "free" buses, government-owned grocery stores, globalizing the Intifada.

^* And yet he still demands that halal food for himself and his fellow Muslims be super cheap.

 

[southernhybrid]

Regardless of how one feels about the policies that Mamdami supports, at least he seems like a decent, honest persons with good intentions, while his Republican critics are disgusting, racist assholes, and I'm sharing some of the evidence of that. They are trying to do to him, what Trump tried to do to President Obama.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/26/...e_code=1.SE8.57C5.6zkyAOPT3Tsh&smid=url-share

Representative Andy Ogles, a hard-right Tennessee Republican, on Thursday used Islamophobic language on social media to refer to Zohran Mamdani, the presumptive Democratic nominee for New York City mayor, and said he should be deported.

Representative Nancy Mace, Republican of South Carolina, implied that Mr. Mamdani was somehow tied to the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, which occurred when he was 9. That came after Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene, Republican of Georgia, reacted on Wednesday to Mr. Mamdani’s apparent victory with an edited image of the Statue of Liberty clothed in a burqa.

The responses to Mr. Mamdani’s electoral triumph were the latest examples of how far-right Republicans in Congress have become overt in their use of bigoted language and ethnically offensive tropes, in both casual comments and official statements.

Mr. Mamdani, a three-term New York State assemblyman who is all but certain to win the Democratic primary for mayor, was born in Uganda and has lived in New York City since 1998, when he was 7 years old. He was naturalized as a U.S. citizen in 2018 and, if elected, would become the city’s first Muslim mayor.

There is no credible evidence to suggest Mr. Mamdani is not, or shouldn’t be, a U.S. citizen. But his shock win put him on the national radar, and some Republicans in Congress are now seeking to undermine him using a strategy similar to the racist one that Donald J. Trump employed against former President Barack Obama by questioning whether he was born in the United States.

“Death threats. Islamophobic bigotry. Now a sitting council member calling for my deportation. Enough,” Mr. Mamdani responded then on social media. “This is what Trump and his sycophants have wrought.” His campaign did not respond to a request for comment about Mr. Ogles’s letter.

There's more of the disgusting bigotry of Republicans in the article if you can stand to read it. It's one thing to disagree with a candidate's platform in a thoughtful way and quite another to attack a candidate with such hateful bigotry.

 

[southernhybrid]

What is actually radical about Mamdani's agenda?

Rent freezes, $30 minimum wage^*, "free" buses, government-owned grocery stores, globalizing the Intifada.

^* And yet he still demands that halal food for himself and his fellow Muslims be super cheap.I

I watched that video and to me it appeared as if he simply wanted to make it cheaper for those who sell street food make it easier and cheaper to get permits. Sure, he mentioned Halal food, but if this was accomplished it would apply to any type of food sold this way. It makes sense that a vendor selling food shouldn't have to pay 22K for the right to sell their goods.

Plus, a mayor doesn't get everything they want. They have to get the approval of the city council to pass bills and based on what I've read, some of the council members seem rather conservative. If Mamdani becomes mayor, he, like any other politician in a leadership position will have to compromise. It's doubtful he will get many of the things he supports passed. If I lived in NYC, I'd vote for him simply because he's better than the alternatives, despite the fact that he's very idealistic and may not have the experience needed to do such a complicated job. I certainly couldn't vote for Adams, Cuomo or the Republican candidate, but it's up the residents of NYC to decide if they think he's qualified to be mayor of their city. It's not up to you or me.

 

[ZiprHead]

What is actually radical about Mamdani's agenda?

Rent freezes,

NYC has had rent control since 1942.

$30 minimum wage^*,

Poverty wage in NYC is $23/hr. I suspect the $30 is a negotiating starting point.

"free" buses,

There are many places around the world that have free buses. And NYC already had it.

Cities with Free Public Transportation:

• Tallinn, Estonia: Free for registered residents.
• Dunkirk and Aubagne, France: According to Tempo.co English, both offer free public transportation.
• Avesta, Sweden: Has offered free bus services since 2012.
• Cluj-Napoca, Romania: Offers free public transportation for residents on Fridays.
• Perth, Australia: Offers free bus services within the central area.
• Kansas City, Missouri: Offers free bus rides through ZeroFare KC.
• Tucson, Arizona: Offers free rides on the streetcar.
• Clemson, South Carolina: Has a free public transportation system.
• Breckenridge, Colorado: Offers free transportation around the ski town.
• Chapel Hill, North Carolina: Offers free fixed-route service and EZ-Rider service.
  

Specific Routes/Areas in Cities with Free Buses:

• Baltimore's Charm City Circulator: Offers free service on four bus lines connecting popular destinations.
  
  
• NYC's free bus pilot program: Offered free service on one line in each borough, but it is ending in 2024.
  
  
• Go KL City Bus (Kuala Lumpur): Operates around the CBD focusing on tourist spots.
  
  
• PJ City Bus (Petaling Jaya): A free service funded by the city council.
  
  
• Smart Selangor Bus: A free bus service operated by Rapid Bus funded by the Selangor State Government, covering multiple areas in Selangor.
  
  
• CAT Penang Bus: A free bus service funded by the Penang State Government.
  
  
• Tirumalai (Tirupati), India: Free buses run by the Temple authority to visit nearby religious centers.
  
  
• Jakarta, Indonesia: Offers free bus services on specific TransJakarta routes and several free city tour routes.

government-owned grocery stores,

Ohio has government liquor stores. Why is it necessary to make a profit to feed people?

globalizing the Intifada.

I'll need a reference for that.

 

[Jarhyn]

What is actually radical about Mamdani's agenda?

Rent freezes,

NYC has had rent control since 1942.

$30 minimum wage^*,

Poverty wage in NYC is $23/hr. I suspect the $30 is a negotiating starting point.

"free" buses,

There are many places around the world that have free buses. And NYC already had it.

Cities with Free Public Transportation:

• Tallinn, Estonia: Free for registered residents.
• Dunkirk and Aubagne, France: According to Tempo.co English, both offer free public transportation.
• Avesta, Sweden: Has offered free bus services since 2012.
• Cluj-Napoca, Romania: Offers free public transportation for residents on Fridays.
• Perth, Australia: Offers free bus services within the central area.
• Kansas City, Missouri: Offers free bus rides through ZeroFare KC.
• Tucson, Arizona: Offers free rides on the streetcar.
• Clemson, South Carolina: Has a free public transportation system.
• Breckenridge, Colorado: Offers free transportation around the ski town.
• Chapel Hill, North Carolina: Offers free fixed-route service and EZ-Rider service.

Specific Routes/Areas in Cities with Free Buses:

• Baltimore's Charm City Circulator: Offers free service on four bus lines connecting popular destinations.
  
  
• NYC's free bus pilot program: Offered free service on one line in each borough, but it is ending in 2024.
  
  
• Go KL City Bus (Kuala Lumpur): Operates around the CBD focusing on tourist spots.
  
  
• PJ City Bus (Petaling Jaya): A free service funded by the city council.
  
  
• Smart Selangor Bus: A free bus service operated by Rapid Bus funded by the Selangor State Government, covering multiple areas in Selangor.
  
  
• CAT Penang Bus: A free bus service funded by the Penang State Government.
  
  
• Tirumalai (Tirupati), India: Free buses run by the Temple authority to visit nearby religious centers.
  
  
• Jakarta, Indonesia: Offers free bus services on specific TransJakarta routes and several free city tour routes.

government-owned grocery stores,

Ohio has government liquor stores. Why is it necessary to make a profit to feed people?

globalizing the Intifada.

I'll need a reference for that.

And to the doubters: look at how much MAGA is fucking freaking out about this. A nerve was struck, and a fear response was evoked just for him beating Cuomo in the primary.

MAGA was downright comfortable with a Cuomo win and now they're asking Daddy Trump to deport the guy rather than accept the consequences to their agenda of the idea that we can seek "progress" towards something that is not Gilead.

 

[Politesse]

Ohio has government liquor stores.

As well as sixteen other states.

 

[Politesse]

And to the doubters: look at how much MAGA is fucking freaking out about this. A nerve was struck, and a fear response was evoked just for him beating Cuomo in the primary.

MAGA was downright comfortable with a Cuomo win and now they're asking Daddy Trump to deport the guy rather than accept the consequences to their agenda of the idea that we can seek "progress" towards something that is not Gilead.

That's why the Democrats are so worried. They don't want to offend MAGA, they're trying to get their votes "back".

 

[Jarhyn]

And to the doubters: look at how much MAGA is fucking freaking out about this. A nerve was struck, and a fear response was evoked just for him beating Cuomo in the primary.

MAGA was downright comfortable with a Cuomo win and now they're asking Daddy Trump to deport the guy rather than accept the consequences to their agenda of the idea that we can seek "progress" towards something that is not Gilead.

That's why the Democrats are so worried. They don't want to offend MAGA, they're trying to get their votes "back".

And the kicker is that isn't how to get those votes in the first place.

Mamdani actually did the thing that gets the votes the Dems lost.