Public education is a socialist monopoly

[Starman]

"Public education is a socialist monopoly, a real one." - The Late Milton Friedman, Professor Emeritus



By the National Association of Scholars (Argue with them and students of Milton Friedman)

A Crisis of Competence: The Corrupting Effect of Political Activism in the University of California


Educational achievement is inversely proportional to educational spending.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

When I become The Grand Empress of the Universe (and I will) my first law will be if you use the word socialist for something that isn't socialist or use the word as a proxy for the word evil or something I don't like, you will be dipped in honey and staked out next to a fire ant hill while 72 virgins pull off your fingernails, gauge out your eyes, and burn off all your body hair with acid, Then just before you die, you will be strapped to rocket and flown into the SUN!!!

 

[Ford]

If education is a socialist plot, then I don't think it is a stretch to say the tendrils of this sinister conspiracy have yet to reach you, and perhaps never will.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Since socialism refers to collective (read: government) ownership of the means of production, and since an overwhelming majority (probably over 90%) of schools are government schools, then technically the OP is correct.

Athena, will you also apply that punishment to people who mistakenly use the term to describe something good? I cannot count the times I've seen progressives gushing about the social safety net in Scandinavia and praise it as Socialism. If the advocates cannot use the term correctly, who is to fault the opponents for using it the exact same way.

 

[laughing dog]

Since socialism refers to collective (read: government) ownership of the means of production, and since an overwhelming majority (probably over 90%) of schools are government schools, then technically the OP is correct.

Your own statement show that is technically incorrect. In order for public education to be socialist, all of the schools would have to be publicly owned. Nor is it technically a monopoly, since there are other sellers in the market for education, including charter schools.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

What, exactly, is the government in your own unique disconnected little world?

 

[laughing dog]

What, exactly, is the government in your own unique disconnected little world?

The same as it is everywhere else in the USA. Charter schools are public education and they are not owned by the gov't - so the gov't does not own the entire means of production of public education, so technically it is not socialist. And charter schools mean that public schools do not technically hold a monopoly (single seller) on public education. For someone who claims to be such a stickler for the proper use of definitions, you seem to out of league here.

 

[Starman]

Your own statement show that is technically incorrect. In order for public education to be socialist, all of the schools would have to be publicly owned. Nor is it technically a monopoly, since there are other sellers in the market for education, including charter schools.

Of course. You are so much wiser than Professor Milton Friedman was.

From 1934:

Recommendations of the American Historical Association


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"A new age of collectivism"
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[laughing dog]

Your own statement show that is technically incorrect. In order for public education to be socialist, all of the schools would have to be publicly owned. Nor is it technically a monopoly, since there are other sellers in the market for education, including charter schools.

Of course. You are so much wiser than Professor Milton Friedman was.

I am under the impression that when Professor Milton Friedman wrote that quote, there were no charter schools, so public education could be described as socialist. Whether he was correct about the monopoly part depends on what one views as the relevant market. If the relevant market is education, then they were not a monopoly because there were private schools that competed with the public sector.

More importantly, why does it matter to you how we describe public education? There is no necessary reason to decry a system of public education because it is public. For example, Finland's system of public education is internationally lauded.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Since socialism refers to collective (read: government)

Not necessarily. Private co-ops can also be considered socialist.

ownership of the means of production, and since an overwhelming majority (probably over 90%) of schools are government schools, then technically the OP is correct.

Private schools account for 24 percent of the nation's schools and enroll 10 percent of all PK-12 students.

Athena, will you also apply that punishment to people who mistakenly use the term to describe something good? I cannot count the times I've seen progressives gushing about the social safety net in Scandinavia and praise it as Socialism. If the advocates cannot use the term correctly, who is to fault the opponents for using it the exact same way.

Jason, I will be Grand Empress of the Universe. That is where I begin. Do you really think that post was an invitation to have a serious discussion of socialism?

 

[bilby]

Public education in the US, Australia, and the UK is not a socialist monopoly.

But if it was, it would be more likely to be better than the status quo than to be worse - so I for one would support, in principle, making it one.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

"It's not 100%, there are a few outlier, there are a few minor exception. So we can't call it socialism unless it's 100%".

Gotcha. Education in the US is mostly socialism, so therefore it isn't socialism at all.

 

[dystopian]

Educational achievement is inversely proportional to educational spending.

No, it's not. You just posted a single-country (presumably a US one) chart of cost-over-time. This does not demonstrate that educational achievement is inversely proportional to education spending. There are a fair number of countries that spend more than the US does on education and which achieve higher educational scores.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Educational achievement is inversely proportional to educational spending.

No, it's not. You just posted a single-country (presumably a US one) chart of cost-over-time. This does not demonstrate that educational achievement is inversely proportional to education spending. There are a fair number of countries that spend more than the US does on education and which achieve higher educational scores.

Thank you dystopian.

And another thing.

If Educational achievement is inversely proportional to educational spending, explain Andonver, Exeter, or Fieldston.

 

[Starman]

When I become The Grand Empress of the Universe (and I will) my first law will be if you use the word socialist for something that isn't socialist or use the word as a proxy for the word evil or something I don't like, you will be dipped in honey and staked out next to a fire ant hill while 72 virgins pull off your fingernails, gauge (sic) out your eyes, and burn off all your body hair with acid, (sic) Then just before you die, you will be strapped to (sic) [a] rocket and flown into the SUN!!!

Are you a teacher? Professor Walter Williams, of George Mason University, stated that education majors scored lower on their SAT tests than any other major.
Teachers graduated, on average, in the bottom third of their college class.

You simply cannot criticize Walter Williams. He is black, and any such criticism would brand you as a "racist".

 

[Starman]

If education is a socialist plot, then I don't think it is a stretch to say the tendrils of this sinister conspiracy have yet to reach you, and perhaps never will.

I posted quotations of note and demonstrable facts, and so therefore you call me uneducated.
Brilliant, well and truly. Yours is the intellect of liberal *genius.* [You must have voted for Obama. Twice.]

"His Vein, ironically grave
Expos'd the Fool and lash'd the Knave:" - Jonathan Swift

 

[Starman]

Thank you dystopian.

And another thing.

If Educational (sic) achievement is inversely proportional to educational spending, explain Andonver, Exeter, or Fieldston.

Oh, I'll do better than that, teacher. Graphs, such as the one I presented, show aggregate statistics and data. Data are not contradicted by points which do not lie precisely, or even far from, the line(s). For example, one could draw a line of the median per capita income over time. Would you also demand an explanation for people who earn a great deal more, or less, than this median value, which of course is DEFINED as the one which represents the 50th percentile? Teacher?

On the subject of teachers, the Union Boss of New York City shot his mouth off that if teachers were unshackled from the demands of school headquarters, and had their own experimental school to run as they see fit, by golly then you would see what a stellar job they would do!

And it was so. Teachers were given the UFT (United Federation of Teachers) Charter School. It educated kids at the 5th percentile.



Last time I read, it was on probation. How inexcusable of authorities to allow children to continue suffering under such deplorable conditions. Child endangerment.
Cruelty. Who here would want their children going to a school performing at the 5th percentile? You, teacher?

Now there is a very wealthy investor, named Carl Icahn. Mean and evil, he is because he is not a flaming leftist, like George Soros.
He runs four charter schools in New York City. In contrast to UFT Charter School, at the 5th percentile, Carl Ican Charter Schools
operate at 88th through 100th percentiles.

Facts are to liberals as Kryptonite is to Superman. - Larry Elder (He's also black, so you can't criticize him either.)

 

[laughing dog]

"It's not 100%, there are a few outlier, there are a few minor exception. So we can't call it socialism unless it's 100%".

Gotcha. Education in the US is mostly socialism, so therefore it isn't socialism at all.

It is a technical argument - you are the one who injected technicality in the argument.

 

[RavenSky]

If education is a socialist plot, then I don't think it is a stretch to say the tendrils of this sinister conspiracy have yet to reach you, and perhaps never will.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I think someone needs to go back to school to learn was "inversely proportional" means.

Also, what is the graph plotting regarding science/math results?