The Pope, The Donald, The Wall.

[AthenaAwakened]

ABOARD THE PAPAL AIRLINER — Inserting himself into the Republican presidential race, Pope Francis on Wednesday suggested that Donald J. Trump “is not Christian” because of the harshness of his campaign promises to deport more immigrants and force Mexico to pay for a wall along the border.

“A person who thinks only about building walls, wherever they may be, and not building bridges, is not Christian,” Francis said when a reporter asked him about Mr. Trump on the papal airliner as he returned to Rome after his six-day visit to Mexico.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/19/world/americas/pope-francis-donald-trump-christian.html

Mr. Trump responded immediately at a campaign rally in Kiawah Island, S.C. Discussing the Islamic State, “their primary goal is to get to the Vatican.”

“If and when the Vatican is attacked,” he said, “the pope would only wish and have prayed that Donald Trump would have been elected president.”

Earlier in his remarks, he said, “I like the pope.”

In the days before Francis arrived at the border, Mr. Trump criticized the visit, calling the pope a political person and accusing him of acting at the behest of the Mexican government. “I think that the pope is a very political person,” he said.

Mr. Trump, in an interview with Fox Business Network, said: “I don’t think he understands the danger of the open border that we have with Mexico. I think Mexico got him to do it because they want to keep the border just the way it is. They’re making a fortune, and we’re losing.”

 

[Derec]

Now actually protecting one's borders is not "Christian"?
Trump is totally right on this one.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Mr. Pope! Tear down those Vatican City walls!

 

[thebeave]

As the saying goes, people who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones:

http://www.tmz.com/2016/02/18/donald-trump-pope-walls-vatican-city/

It's been pointed out that Vatican City -- Pope Francis' HQ -- has been surrounded by a massive protective wall for centuries. In fact, the wall was first built in 852 A.D. to fend off Muslim attackers.

It was expanded to its current size in the 1640s. The wall, in all, measures 2 miles ... surrounding 109 acres.

Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2016/02/18/donald-trump-pope-walls-vatican-city/#ixzz40YnFAHwh

 

[dismal]

Mr. Pope! Tear down those Vatican City walls!

Seriously, when I heard about this on the news I wondered what the Vatican's immigration policies were. I don't recall any reports of St Peter's being overrrun by groping immigrants.

The Pope should probably stick to his religion gig because as a head of state he's going to have trouble living up to his own supposed principles.

 

[funinspace]

Jokes aside…Just a small problem with some of the logic here. The Vatican in Rome is akin to the Whitehouse, but say set at Camp David. Of thousands of places the RCC owns, I suspect that they have lots of facilities all over the world that help immigrants, legally or illegally within said country…

 

[Derec]

Jokes aside…Just a small problem with some of the logic here. The Vatican in Rome is akin to the Whitehouse,

The Quirinal Palace in Rome is akin to the White House.

but say set at Camp David. Of thousands of places the RCC owns, I suspect that they have lots of facilities all over the world that help immigrants, legally or illegally within said country…

The Vatican is its own sovereign country. Why aren't they helping immigrants, legally and illegally within their country, instead of telling other countries they shouldn't do anything to stop illegals from coming in? Especially when, like in this case with largely Catholic Mexicans and Central Americans, the RCC has a vested interest in more of them flooding into US.

 

[TV and credit cards]

The Quirinal Palace in Rome is akin to the White House.

but say set at Camp David. Of thousands of places the RCC owns, I suspect that they have lots of facilities all over the world that help immigrants, legally or illegally within said country…

The Vatican is its own sovereign country. Why aren't they helping immigrants, legally and illegally within their country, instead of telling other countries they shouldn't do anything to stop illegals from coming in? Especially when, like in this case with largely Catholic Mexicans and Central Americans, the RCC has a vested interest in more of them flooding into US.

I think Catholic Charities has an entire department dedicated to refugee resettlement and googling "catholic charities refugee resettlement" brings up various locations. Should the Pope house them at the Vatican simply to make a statement or should they go about doing real substantive work to help solve a problem?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

You know what else isn't Christian? Covering up the rape of children.

I'm confused by this one. I like the fact that someone is dissing a Trump but, at the same time, I don't like the fact that I'd be agreeing with the Pope. I don't know how to react ...

 

[Derec]

I think Catholic Charities has an entire department dedicated to refugee resettlement and googling "catholic charities refugee resettlement" brings up various locations.

That's my point. They are setting people in countries with very different culture and then expecting the host countries to change to accommodate the millions newcomers. I.e. women of cologne should dress more modestly, people eating at Subways in Bristol should just not expect to find anything non-halal etc.

Should the Pope house them at the Vatican simply to make a statement or should they go about doing real substantive work to help solve a problem?

That presupposes that you think that settling many millions of Syrians, Afghans, Iraqis, North Africans etc. in EU and US is a substantive solution to the problem.

 

[Angry Floof]

You know what else isn't Christian? Covering up the rape of children.

I'm confused by this one. I like the fact that someone is dissing a Trump but, at the same time, I don't like the fact that I'd be agreeing with the Pope. I don't know how to react ...

What, you've never seen a Loony Tunes cartoon?? Don't they have those up there in the desolate wastes of Canadia?

 

[TV and credit cards]

That's my point. They are setting people in countries with very different culture and then expecting the host countries to change to accommodate the millions newcomers. I.e. women of cologne should dress more modestly, people eating at Subways in Bristol should just not expect to find anything non-halal etc.

If so, that is wrong. Individually, people of the host country can be accommodating as they choose but the burden is upon the refugee to assimilate into the society joined.

Should the Pope house them at the Vatican simply to make a statement or should they go about doing real substantive work to help solve a problem?

That presupposes that you think that settling many millions of Syrians, Afghans, Iraqis, North Africans etc. in EU and US is a substantive solution to the problem.

It's a substantive solution to dying.

 

[Deepak]

You know what else isn't Christian? Covering up the rape of children.

I'm confused by this one. I like the fact that someone is dissing a Trump but, at the same time, I don't like the fact that I'd be agreeing with the Pope. I don't know how to react ...

I'll admit I don't follow this nonsense as much as I should but I thought the latest dude was better than rat-face on this point

 

[Derec]

If so, that is wrong. Individually, people of the host country can be accommodating as they choose but the burden is upon the refugee to assimilate into the society joined.

And that hasn't been happening with Muslim migrants to Europe for decades. Just think of the suburbs of of Paris and Marseilles and is not happening with the millions of Muslim migrants entering Europe now. It's not even happening with many hispanics in the US as many are not learning English even after decades and are living in isolated ethnic enclaves. Not allowing illegal aliens to come in would also allow those that come in legally to integrate better.

t's a substantive solution to dying.

Nobody is disputing that it is a good deal for the migrants, even if they are not facing death at home, but what about the host countries? There are three problems with current EU (especially German) migrant policy
- sheer numbers. Million migrants entered Germany alone in 2015. That is almost 1% of the population. That is to be added to the Muslim population that entered Germany before and that will enter Germany in the future and of course Muslims have huge birth rates. Eurabia is a real danger here.
- their culture is very different than German/European culture
- there has been virtually no vetting to weed out non-refugees, violent criminals, terrorists etc.
It is by now quite evident that Merkel's policy has been a huge disaster.

 

[Keith&Co.]

You know what else isn't Christian? Covering up the rape of children.

I'm confused by this one. I like the fact that someone is dissing a Trump but, at the same time, I don't like the fact that I'd be agreeing with the Pope. I don't know how to react ...

Actually, you can agree with the Pope on a bullet-point-by-bullet-point basis easily enough. It's even moral.
I mean, if you were to preannounce that you were going to disagree with the Pope, no matter who he nominated what he said, you'd be among the most childish people on the planet.

 

[untermensche]

Tho only people who really care about the Pope are Catholics.

And Trump and his sycophants can yammer all they want.

Catholics will side with the Pope on this one.

 

[bilby]

I know of at least one asylum seeker who has been given protection at the Vatican.

Archbishop George Pell, who is so far successfully avoiding being returned to Australia to face the Royal Commission into child abuse by the Catholic Church.

I suspect that the proportion of rapists and their sympathisers in the Vatican's refugee intake is high enough to satisfy even the hardened xenophobes in the 'Europe submits voluntarily' thread.

I say send them back where they came from.

 

[Derec]

satisfy even the hardened xenophobes in the 'Europe submits voluntarily' thread.

I find it amazing how everybody who opposes throwing the doors open to the unrestricted flood of Muslim migrants (only some of whom are refugees) whose sheer numbers (one million in Germany alone in one year alone) will inevitably change Europe for the worse and make it look more like a Middle Eastern society (hence "Eurabia") are dismissed as "xenophobes".
Not wanting to sacrifice European culture so Muslim (mostly Arab) culture can spread is not xenophobia.
This demonization of dissent is not a good thing for a discussion forum like this one or for the wider political discussion.

 

[funinspace]

<snipped silly pic>
The Quirinal Palace in Rome is akin to the White House.

but say set at Camp David. Of thousands of places the RCC owns, I suspect that they have lots of facilities all over the world that help immigrants, legally or illegally within said country…

The Vatican is its own sovereign country. Why aren't they helping immigrants, legally and illegally within their country, instead of telling other countries they shouldn't do anything to stop illegals from coming in? Especially when, like in this case with largely Catholic Mexicans and Central Americans, the RCC has a vested interest in more of them flooding into US.

I'll bet the Pope would make a deal, that they will take 1 immigrant into their sovereign country's 109 acres, for the 23 million the US takes into its 2.3 billion acres. Work for you?

Now actually protecting one's borders is not "Christian"?
Trump is totally right on this one.

What of Christian theology gives a rats ass about national borders? Yeah, US evangelicals think the US is some stupid shinning beacon on a hill or golden eagle, so so special in the eyes of their sky beast. Do you?

 

[dismal]

You know what else isn't Christian? Covering up the rape of children.

I'm confused by this one. I like the fact that someone is dissing a Trump but, at the same time, I don't like the fact that I'd be agreeing with the Pope. I don't know how to react ...

You can avoid the whole conundrum by remembering it's not the government's mission to "be christian".

If someone wants to live up to this principle on their own time they can take their front door off its hinges and let whomever wants to come in and eat the food from their refrigerator.

Also, if you're going this route, if possible stock some pizza and beer. I may come by.