City attorney charges parents of teens who reportedly threatened schools

[RavenSky]

Good.

The Los Angeles city attorney on Monday announced charges against two parents who kept unsecured guns in their homes and whose children threatened violence against their schools and peers, officials said.

City Atty. Mike Feuer filed the charges last week against San Fernando Valley parents Robert Christy and Dazo Esguerra accusing both fathers of keeping firearms easily accessible to teenage sons who made threats in February, Feuer's office said.

Christy, 59, faces three misdemeanor counts of unlawful storage of a firearm and faces up to six months in jail and a $1,000 fine for each count, officials said. Prosecutors say that on Feb. 5, Christy's 16-year-old son made threats to other students that he was going to shoot up Chatsworth Charter High School and had made "numerous references" to his parents' guns.

Esguerra, 50, faces one count each of criminal storage of a firearm and unlawful storage of a firearm and faces up to six months in jail and $1,000 in fines for each count.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...rges-teen-parents-threats-20180311-story.html

 

[Underseer]

I can't wait to hear the "I'm being persecuted" complaints from the right after this.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I hate the jail time stuff on this. Convict him and have him do community service with families that have been victims of gun violence. Get this idiot to understand.

 

[Playball40]

They should lose their guns too.

Good.

Esguerra, 50, faces one count each of criminal storage of a firearm and unlawful storage of a firearm and faces up to six months in jail and $1,000 in fines for each count.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...rges-teen-parents-threats-20180311-story.html

 

[Toni]

I hate the jail time stuff on this. Convict him and have him do community service with families that have been victims of gun violence. Get this idiot to understand.

I agree, although I don't think they will ever understand or accept any potential responsibility or see any connection.

FWIW, I grew up in a home filled with guns used for hunting, mostly small game. None were semi-automatic. None were locked up. Also, none were kept loaded. Ever. I and any of my siblings had easy access to any of these guns whenever we wanted. Now, it wouldn't have been worth the beating I surely would have taken if I had ever gotten any of them out without express permission. Not that it ever came up: they were my father's guns and he was the only person allowed to get them out for any reason. The reasons were always the same: to clean them, to get them ready for a hunting trip or the occasional target practice. Once to mount a new scope.

My husband and I made what was for us an easy decision to not have firearms in our home. I had decided long before we met that I didn't want to hunt and hunting was never an interest of my husband's or his family. We lived in more than one lousy neighborhood when we were first married, one where I was regularly accosted on my way to the bus stop on my way to work, where someone tapped on my window in the wee hours of the morning so that I would turn and see him masturbate right up against the glass, and where I would not go out after I got home from work unless accompanied by my husband. It never crossed either of our minds that we needed a gun for protection.

 

[LordKiran]

Good.

Esguerra, 50, faces one count each of criminal storage of a firearm and unlawful storage of a firearm and faces up to six months in jail and $1,000 in fines for each count.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...rges-teen-parents-threats-20180311-story.html

Because nothing sets a troubled teen on the right path like imprisoning their parents. I'll agree that state action is warranted and that said parents should definitely lose their firearms. I don't agree that the situation is improved in the long run by imprisoning anyone. But then that might not even happen so I dunno.

 

[TSwizzle]

I doubt the parents will get any jail time, perhaps they will just to send out a message. there probably isn't a law for this but I'd like to see the guns confiscated and the people banned from owning/purchasing guns. Maybe if convicted they will be precluded from buying guns but it seems they are only guilty of a misdemeanor. They are not responsible gun owners.

 

[Derec]

Keeping your guns secured at all times should be necessary condition for being allowed to keep weapons. A constitutional right does not mean that there can't be any restrictions.

 

[James Brown]

Keeping your guns secured at all times should be necessary condition for being allowed to keep weapons. A constitutional right does not mean that there can't be any restrictions.

How would that be enforced?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Keeping your guns secured at all times should be necessary condition for being allowed to keep weapons. A constitutional right does not mean that there can't be any restrictions.

How would that be enforced?

I suppose that if we require that gun owners be stored safely with their guns, that if they are seen walking, we know they are breaking the law.

 

[coloradoatheist]

Keeping your guns secured at all times should be necessary condition for being allowed to keep weapons. A constitutional right does not mean that there can't be any restrictions.

I think that depends though. If you declare their purpose to be self defense then you can't make the requirements unable to carry out that function. But I haven't seen the NRA complaining about them in California so I'm not sure what they are.

 

[RavenSky]

I hate the jail time stuff on this. Convict him and have him do community service with families that have been victims of gun violence. Get this idiot to understand.

I don't know how much gun-nuts will ever understand, but I agree with you; and I agree with LordKiran. Prison time for the gun-owner parent simply leaves teens who are already displaying violent antisocial tendencies with even less supervision and potentially more misplaced resentment.

Conviction, community service and loss of their guns is a better penalty, imo.

They should lose their guns too.

agree!

 

[RavenSky]

Keeping your guns secured at all times should be necessary condition for being allowed to keep weapons. A constitutional right does not mean that there can't be any restrictions.

Agree! What is rather terrifying is that:

Massachusetts is the only state that generally requires that all firearms be stored with a lock in place; California, Connecticut, and New York impose this requirement in certain situations.

http://lawcenter.giffords.org/gun-laws/policy-areas/child-consumer-safety/safe-storage/#federal

- - - Updated - - -

I hate the jail time stuff on this. Convict him and have him do community service with families that have been victims of gun violence. Get this idiot to understand.

Keeping your guns secured at all times should be necessary condition for being allowed to keep weapons. A constitutional right does not mean that there can't be any restrictions.

How would that be enforced?

Exactly as California is enforcing their laws now.

 

[Bronzeage]

I wonder what the actual law is on gun storage in the home. After all, an unloaded gun is a useless gun, and an unloaded gun in a locked cabinet, even more so.

This is the crux of the matter. People who feel a need to have a gun for personal or home defense, will not feel safe if their gun is not quickly and easily accessible. It really doesn't matter what the law says about gun storage, it will just be an after the fact discovery.

 

[RavenSky]

I wonder what the actual law is on gun storage in the home. After all, an unloaded gun is a useless gun, and an unloaded gun in a locked cabinet, even more so.

This is the crux of the matter. People who feel a need to have a gun for personal or home defense, will not feel safe if their gun is not quickly and easily accessible. It really doesn't matter what the law says about gun storage, it will just be an after the fact discovery.

California's law is relatively lax (though still far better than most other states), which would seem to indicate that the parents in the OP didn't meet even these low standards:

http://lawcenter.giffords.org/child-access-prevention-in-california/

 

[TSwizzle]

I wonder what the actual law is on gun storage in the home. After all, an unloaded gun is a useless gun, and an unloaded gun in a locked cabinet, even more so.

This is the crux of the matter. People who feel a need to have a gun for personal or home defense, will not feel safe if their gun is not quickly and easily accessible. It really doesn't matter what the law says about gun storage, it will just be an after the fact discovery.

That's a fair point. I'm just thinking, the guns that Cruz used were under lock and key but Cruz had a copy of the key which his guardians did not know about. The NRA bang on about gun safety but there are so many dimwits that leave their loaded guns lying around for kids to get their hands on. How often do we hear about little Johnny shooting his sibling after finding his parent's gun lying around. It's weird, every bottle of paracetamol has a child proof cap but guns are kind of neglected.

 

[Bronzeage]

I wonder what the actual law is on gun storage in the home. After all, an unloaded gun is a useless gun, and an unloaded gun in a locked cabinet, even more so.

This is the crux of the matter. People who feel a need to have a gun for personal or home defense, will not feel safe if their gun is not quickly and easily accessible. It really doesn't matter what the law says about gun storage, it will just be an after the fact discovery.

That's a fair point. I'm just thinking, the guns that Cruz used were under lock and key but Cruz had a copy of the key which his guardians did not know about. The NRA bang on about gun safety but there are so many dimwits that leave their loaded guns lying around for kids to get their hands on. How often do we hear about little Johnny shooting his sibling after finding his parent's gun lying around. It's weird, every bottle of paracetamol has a child proof cap but guns are kind of neglected.

Several years ago, I read a report from a gun safety for children research project. The researchers had children from the ages of 4 to 7 in the study group. Each age group was given the basic lesson, which was "if you see a gun, don't touch it, tell and adult." Every child was able to recite the rule.

Then, as expected, they put the child in laboratory simulated home, where a pistol was in plain site. The girls of all ages and to boys aged 6 and 7, all reported the pistol to an adult. Every single 4 and 5 year old boy picked up the pistol and pulled the trigger.

There did not seem to be any warning, lesson, or threat, which could prevent this. In my life, I have lost count of how many times I have heard someone say, "My kids know not to touch my gun."

 

[RavenSky]

I'm just thinking, the guns that Cruz used were under lock and key but Cruz had a copy of the key which his guardians did not know about. The NRA bang on about gun safety...

In the Parkland 17 shooting, Cruz legally (thanks to the NRA) owned the guns he used for his mass murder. He didn't need to hide a spare key; the key was his. The family he lived with had him lock up his guns for the safety of the younger children in the household.

As for the NRA being about gun safety, they used to be all about gun safety up until the mid-1970's. Now they fight every single gun safety measure no matter how small. They don't always win, but they always fight against gun safety.

I do think it is interesting that almost everyone on this thread is in agreement that guns should not be left unsecured for children to find. Given how vehemently opposed we (collectively) tend to be on every other topic, I think the apparent agreement here is a microcosm of the U.S. (and the world) at large.

 

[Trausti]

Isn't the distinction to draw between the OP and the Parkland shooting that law enforcement in this instance actually did its job? The Broward Police Department and the school R.O. were Keystone incompetent cowards. No need for new laws. Just enforce the laws we already have. Fire the incompetents.

 

[RavenSky]

Isn't the distinction to draw between the OP and the Parkland shooting that law enforcement in this instance actually did its job? The Broward Police Department and the school R.O. were Keystone incompetent cowards. No need for new laws. Just enforce the laws we already have. Fire the incompetents.

While it does sound like the police in California did their jobs, I have yet to see any factual evidence that Broward PD failed in their duties prior to the shooting. Yes, "everyone" seemed to "know" Cruz was weird, and had been expelled from school.But no one has yet provided factual evidence that police failed to arrest him for crimes.

Do I think he should have been allowed to own an AR-15 and other weapons plus a shit-ton of ammunition? Absolutely not. But he owned them legally and had not yet done anything that Broward PD could have acted on.

The teenagers in California posted videos of themselves directly threatening to shoot up their schools and bragging about access to their parents' guns.