Kapaernick

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

PEOPLE forced and pressured others by enacting legislation. PEOPLE made the government do it to others. Back to basics: if an individual takes away your liberty to do as you please with your body that is still your freedom.

I agree on your first two statements when the government did it. And the answer on the last sentence is no. When you trade your freedom for voluntary complensation they can tell you what to do. It's called work. If you don't like it, you don't have to do it. Hey McDonalds, you are taking away my freedom by making me show up for my shifts.

As explained before he did not trade his freedom as his freedom was not what was traded in his contract, only the work he agreed to and to be respectful while doing it which he was.

If it were true that employees had to do whatever employers wanted, then waitresses would be getting pregnant from their male bosses by obligation. Employees retain their rights to their bodies and only agree to do what the job is. In this case, it's playing football and being respectful while doing it.

 

[untermensche]

All the people who were against his freedom to kneel during the anthem as a player. Some thought he should be fired, for example. Were you seriously not paying attention to this story? I think you were and so you're trying to frame it differently somehow. I just don't get what you're trying to say.

That's not opposing his freedom to make a statement. That's opposing your freedom to make a non-job related statement while working and wearing his employer's uniform. Big difference there. He has always been free to make whatever statements he wanted in his spare time.

Your belief that people lose their rights at work is a just worship of a form of tyranny.

You are part of the miserable sycophants of illegitimate power.

 

[coloradoatheist]

All the people who were against his freedom to kneel during the anthem as a player. Some thought he should be fired, for example. Were you seriously not paying attention to this story? I think you were and so you're trying to frame it differently somehow. I just don't get what you're trying to say.

That's not opposing his freedom to make a statement. That's opposing your freedom to make a non-job related statement while working and wearing his employer's uniform. Big difference there. He has always been free to make whatever statements he wanted in his spare time.

Your belief that people lose their rights at work is a just worship of a form of tyranny.

You are part of the miserable sycophants of illegitimate power.

So when Kaepernick didn't stand, did the government put him a cell, did the fine him, did they put him under house arrest?

 

[coloradoatheist]

PEOPLE forced and pressured others by enacting legislation. PEOPLE made the government do it to others. Back to basics: if an individual takes away your liberty to do as you please with your body that is still your freedom.

I agree on your first two statements when the government did it. And the answer on the last sentence is no. When you trade your freedom for voluntary complensation they can tell you what to do. It's called work. If you don't like it, you don't have to do it. Hey McDonalds, you are taking away my freedom by making me show up for my shifts.

As explained before he did not trade his freedom as his freedom was not what was traded in his contract, only the work he agreed to and to be respectful while doing it which he was.

If it were true that employees had to do whatever employers wanted, then waitresses would be getting pregnant from their male bosses by obligation. Employees retain their rights to their bodies and only agree to do what the job is. In this case, it's playing football and being respectful while doing it.

And that can apply to anything they are asked to do for their job. Don't want to stand behind a cash register and take orders, just say that you couldn't rape me so I don't have to take orders.

Was asking to stand for the anthem a legal order? Was it one that affected the product or image that the team was paying him for?

It's also interesting, every play that Kaepernick was out there, he was either assaulted or somebody attempted to assault him, but he volunteered for it, and something that is at great risk to his short and long term health.

 

[RavenSky]

Kaepernick has emerged a hero and a man to be respected.

The miserable people who opposed his freedom to make a statement about unjust action will be miserable for the rest of their miserable worthless lives.

Who has opposed his freedom to make a statement about what he believes was an unjust action?
Name one person.

That fucking fat orange toad squatting in the White House, for one. He tried to use the political power of the highest government office to have Kaepernick suspended.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...have-suspended-colin-kaepernick-for-kneeling/

But that is irrelevant to the fact that Kaepernick is being honored and recognized by the world as the hero he is - and I am happy for him.

 

[Underseer]

Just want to make sure I'm clear on this. The guy protests racial inequality, and now the police are protesting his actions by refusing to participate in a pre game ceremony.

Instead of saying "Yes, we must stop racism and shooting unarmed people within our ranks", they are saying "F*** you fof having a problem with that".

Just wanted to be clear.

Welcome to America, where begging for your life is considered a controversial political position.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

As explained before he did not trade his freedom as his freedom was not what was traded in his contract, only the work he agreed to and to be respectful while doing it which he was.

If it were true that employees had to do whatever employers wanted, then waitresses would be getting pregnant from their male bosses by obligation. Employees retain their rights to their bodies and only agree to do what the job is. In this case, it's playing football and being respectful while doing it.

And that can apply to anything they are asked to do for their job. Don't want to stand behind a cash register and take orders, just say that you couldn't rape me so I don't have to take orders.

Was asking to stand for the anthem a legal order? Was it one that affected the product or image that the team was paying him for?

It's also interesting, every play that Kaepernick was out there, he was either assaulted or somebody attempted to assault him, but he volunteered for it, and something that is at great risk to his short and long term health.

What the heck are you talking about?

 

[untermensche]

Your belief that people lose their rights at work is a just worship of a form of tyranny.

You are part of the miserable sycophants of illegitimate power.

So when Kaepernick didn't stand, did the government put him a cell, did the fine him, did they put him under house arrest?

The government is not the only power.

And it is not the only place illegitimate power can exist.

The right to protest and the right to freedom of speech should not be controlled by some pea brain employer.

 

[JohnG]

I dont think a lot of people realize the hard costs of inequality on society. I think most of us are aware that there are study after study that illustrates racism in our culture. People of color get hired less (sending out 1000s of identical resumes with different color faces attached), loan application studies, school application experiments, etc....We have data that is not anecdotal.

When we oppress anyone, including by gender, they are not as productive in socetty. They become a liability which further perpetuates the issue.

Of course, this is beside it just being a real shitty attitide that is gross to be around.

For those of you who don't understand, It is simply this: CK is taking action to improve american socety. If you don't recognize that, you are part of the problem with american society. So...wise up!

 

[coloradoatheist]

Your belief that people lose their rights at work is a just worship of a form of tyranny.

You are part of the miserable sycophants of illegitimate power.

So when Kaepernick didn't stand, did the government put him a cell, did the fine him, did they put him under house arrest?

The government is not the only power.

And it is not the only place illegitimate power can exist.

The right to protest and the right to freedom of speech should not be controlled by some pea brain employer.

Except an employer isn't paying you to protest and they aren't paying you so you tarnish their product or service.

 

[coloradoatheist]

As explained before he did not trade his freedom as his freedom was not what was traded in his contract, only the work he agreed to and to be respectful while doing it which he was.

If it were true that employees had to do whatever employers wanted, then waitresses would be getting pregnant from their male bosses by obligation. Employees retain their rights to their bodies and only agree to do what the job is. In this case, it's playing football and being respectful while doing it.

And that can apply to anything they are asked to do for their job. Don't want to stand behind a cash register and take orders, just say that you couldn't rape me so I don't have to take orders.

Was asking to stand for the anthem a legal order? Was it one that affected the product or image that the team was paying him for?

It's also interesting, every play that Kaepernick was out there, he was either assaulted or somebody attempted to assault him, but he volunteered for it, and something that is at great risk to his short and long term health.

What the heck are you talking about?

You were the one that made the argument that since an employer can't force you to have sex on the job they can't do anything with your body which is obviously false.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

I dont think a lot of people realize the hard costs of inequality on society. I think most of us are aware that there are study after study that illustrates racism in our culture. People of color get hired less (sending out 1000s of identical resumes with different color faces attached), loan application studies, school application experiments, etc....We have data that is not anecdotal.

When we oppress anyone, including by gender, they are not as productive in socetty. They become a liability which further perpetuates the issue.

Of course, this is beside it just being a real shitty attitide that is gross to be around.

For those of you who don't understand, It is simply this: CK is taking action to improve american socety. If you don't recognize that, you are part of the problem with american society. So...wise up!

Well, unfortunately, very unfortunately, there are tens upon tens of millions of americans who do not possess that level of intellect.

There is a better future out there that will never ever occur to them even in their wildest dreams.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The government is not the only power.

And it is not the only place illegitimate power can exist.

The right to protest and the right to freedom of speech should not be controlled by some pea brain employer.

Except an employer isn't paying you to protest and they aren't paying you so you tarnish their product or service.

We step back to the question, is kneeling during the national anthem tarnishing anything. Talk about snowflaking!

Kaepernick: Lots of unarmed African Americans are being gunned down by police and nothing is changing. I'm going to kneel during the anthem to bring attention to it.
Alt-Right: Oh my fucking god... did you see him? He kneeled. He fucking kneeled!
Some other person: Why did he kneel?
Alt-Right: Does it matter?! He might as well have burned the flag. I'm never watching another football game again.
Some other person: Isn't that a bit unfair of an extrapolation.
Alt-Right: AMERICA! AMERICA! AMERICA!

 

[coloradoatheist]

The government is not the only power.

And it is not the only place illegitimate power can exist.

The right to protest and the right to freedom of speech should not be controlled by some pea brain employer.

Except an employer isn't paying you to protest and they aren't paying you so you tarnish their product or service.

We step back to the question, is kneeling during the national anthem tarnishing anything. Talk about snowflaking!

Kaepernick: Lots of unarmed African Americans are being gunned down by police and nothing is changing. I'm going to kneel during the anthem to bring attention to it.
Alt-Right: Oh my fucking god... did you see him? He kneeled. He fucking kneeled!
Some other person: Why did he kneel?
Alt-Right: Does it matter?! He might as well have burned the flag. I'm never watching another football game again.
Some other person: Isn't that a bit unfair of an extrapolation.
Alt-Right: AMERICA! AMERICA! AMERICA!

Doesn't matter to you or me. It matters to the fans of NFL football games and whether or not the team is losing fans because of his behavior. A business is there to sell a product they way they feel is the best and they pay people for that.

 

[Derec]

I dont think a lot of people realize the hard costs of inequality on society. I think most of us are aware that there are study after study that illustrates racism in our culture.

Yes, there is some racism. Not as much as claimed by SJWs and race activists though. And there is racism from all sides. Unfortunately we are hypervigilent toward white racism (many false positives) while ignoring and excusing even blatant black racism (calling white people "cave beasts" and the like).

People of color get hired less (sending out 1000s of identical resumes with different color faces attached), loan application studies,

I remember the resume name study, and it is extremely flawed. It used normal, common American names than people of all races may have, and compared them to very ghetto names. Why not compare ghetto names with hillbilly names or names from predominately white countries with unusual names like immigrants from those places may have?

school application experiments, etc....We have data that is not anecdotal.

On the contrary. Black (and hispanic) applicants get admitted with far worse scores/grades than whites and Asians thanks to so-called "affirmative action" (more accurate term would be "racial discrimination").
A particularly blatant example are medical schools.

When we oppress anyone, including by gender, they are not as productive in socetty. They become a liability which further perpetuates the issue.

True, but it is important for the pendulum not to swing too far in the opposite direction either.

For those of you who don't understand, It is simply this: CK is taking action to improve american socety. If you don't recognize that, you are part of the problem with american society. So...wise up!

I disagree. I think he has the right to voice his opinion (preferably in his own time and not wearing his employer's laundry),but I disagree that the content of his speech is positive. He has adopted the standard #BLM narrative that does not distinguish between justified and unjustified police shootings.

 

[Derec]

Kaepernick: Lots of unarmed African Americans are being gunned down by police and nothing is changing. I'm going to kneel during the anthem to bring attention to it.

Several problems with this.
- What is "lots"? People killed by police is a very small fraction of all homicides. And even #BLM admits that most police shootings are justified.
- Unarmed does not mean the perp wasn't a threat or that the shooting was unjustified. Michael Brown was technically unarmed, but he attacked the police officer and the shooting was thus justified.
- #BLM also protests shootings where the perp was armed - for example Korryn Gaines or Keith Lamont Scott or Quanice Hayes.
- White people etc. also get shot by police. Why are black people special?

 

[laughing dog]

- White people etc. also get shot by police. Why are black people special?

What prompted the non-sequitur of "Why are black people special?" or do you think people need your approval of what causes to champion?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

We step back to the question, is kneeling during the national anthem tarnishing anything. Talk about snowflaking!

Kaepernick: Lots of unarmed African Americans are being gunned down by police and nothing is changing. I'm going to kneel during the anthem to bring attention to it.
Alt-Right: Oh my fucking god... did you see him? He kneeled. He fucking kneeled!
Some other person: Why did he kneel?
Alt-Right: Does it matter?! He might as well have burned the flag. I'm never watching another football game again.
Some other person: Isn't that a bit unfair of an extrapolation.
Alt-Right: AMERICA! AMERICA! AMERICA!

Doesn't matter to you or me.

It does, because it is the alleged public perception of the kneeling that is driving this idea that kneeling during the anthem is treasonous. It is a bit like NippleGate when hundreds of thousands of Americans rushed to the FCC to complain (turned out it was just a couple dozen).

This is the point when we ask ourselves, should this being going so far and is an extremely non-violent method of protest that last the unbearable length of the national anthem something worth getting worked up about, especially when we know why it is being done?

I can appreciate the NFL and teams wanting to keep political speech to a minimum for their players, that makes sense. But when in the heck did raising the issue of unarmed people being shot to death by cops become a political issue?

 

[Derec]

- White people etc. also get shot by police. Why are black people special?

What prompted the non-sequitur of "Why are black people special?" or do you think people need your approval of what causes to champion?

Jimmy was singling out black people getting shot by police when in reality people of all races get shot by police. So, again, what makes black people special that they should be emphasized like that?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Unarmed. Granted, unarmed white people also probably get shot, but white people don’t seem to care.