Price Waterhouse analyst murdered in his home by police

[dismal]

Assuming the facts turn out as currently reported, this was a woman in (what she thought) was her apartment with an unknown stranger at night. The fact she was a police officer is largely irrelevant. She was not acting in the capacity of a police officer.

The reality is if she had been inside her own apartment this would be a non-story. The reaction, if we ever heard about it at all, would be "looks like this dude picked the wrong woman to prey upon". The #metoo crowd would probably hold her up for some sort of empowered female of the week award.

The unique and tragic thing is that she was not in her own apartment. She made a mistake that destroyed her life and his.

The normal human reaction is to wonder how she could have made that mistake. When I talk about this with normal people at work or in public that's what they talk about.

But unfortunately there is a disgusting element who must shoehorn a tragic incident into their "white cops love to shoot black people" narrative. They've never met this woman, but they can be sure she's a racist without any evident to suggest it because it helps their narrative.

Assuming that the facts are as reported: she was not in any apartment at all. She was trying to open to her own apartment but she made an honest mistake. Fair enough: could happen to anyone.

The actual resident of the apartment hears someone struggling to open a door and opens the door to offer assistance.

The woman who was in the wrong place immediately assumed that she was under attack and fired her weapon, killing the lawful resident who opened his door to help a stranger.

That she was a police officer matters. Most other people would not be armed, for one thing. Additionally, much has been made of the fact that she was just coming off a full shift. I assume most of us work full shifts routinely or have done so. I assume most of us have had terrible days at work and are ending our day over tired and in need of some dinner and a bit of relaxation. I doubt that any of us are primed or armed to shoot any perceived threat on sight.

Why are police officers trained to shoot at any perceived threat? There are other options. We’ve all read far too many stories of police offers shooting unarmed victims, including unarmed children, within seconds of encountering them. Black people of all ages, from children to elderly, male, female, are killed by police on a daily basis for simply existing. Playing in a park or opening the door to your own apartment is somehow sufficiently threatening to warrant nearly instantaneous death at the hands of police officers who are sworn to serve and protect others—not themselves.

There are explanations for this shooting but these are not justifications.

Wh

I am not sure where you are getting your facts.

Botham Jean's door was unlocked, lights were off when Officer Amber Guyger mistook his apartment for hers, official says


The Dallas police officer who killed 26-year-old Botham Jean in his own apartment got inside because the door wasn’t locked, a law enforcement official said Sunday.

Officer Amber Guyger had just ended a 15-hour shift when she parked on the wrong level of the South Side Flats garage— the fourth floor instead of the third, where she lived, according to the official who has direct knowledge of the case but is not authorized to discuss it publicly.

...

Guyger, who was still in uniform, put her key in the door, which was unlocked, and the door opened, the official said. The lights were out. She saw a figure in the darkness and thought her apartment was being burglarized, the official said. Guyger pulled her gun and fired twice.

When she turned on the lights, she realized she was in the wrong apartment. Jean, who worked for PricewaterhouseCoopers, was shot once in the chest.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/dal...-amber-guyger-mistook-apartment-official-says

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Assuming this is true, and we don't have to assume that because this is an unsubstantiated police source and another source said he opened the door for her after she fiddled with it and why would he be walking around his apartment in the dark or have left the door unlocked (is that even possible), there are still some issues to deal with:
1. Police working a 15 hour shift having guns. This is like surgeons working 48 hour shifts;
2. She should have recognized his big lighted room number, different color mats in the hall, the red light that went off when she put her key in the door, etc;
3. Police shooting people unnecessarily (right in the chest with a kill shot to top it off). This remains a big issue. When all you have is a hammer, is everything a nail? What ever happened to stop or I'll shoot? To put your hands up or I'll shoot?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It seems to me that there are a lot of people here who are extremely angry about people bringing up the race angle to this shooting. However, being angry that an innocent person was unnecessarily shot to death by a person, off-duty cop or otherwise, who to all appearances was clearly overreacting? Not so much.

Why do we conclude she was clearly overreacting?

She faced an intruder who almost certainly wasn't complying with her instructions. Had it been her place people wouldn't be upset if she pulled the trigger--where's the overreaction?

This is a horrible "Oh, shit!" moment that a bunch of race agitators want to pretend was racial in nature.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

It seems to me that there are a lot of people here who are extremely angry about people bringing up the race angle to this shooting. However, being angry that an innocent person was unnecessarily shot to death by a person, off-duty cop or otherwise, who to all appearances was clearly overreacting? Not so much.

Why do we conclude she was clearly overreacting?

She faced an intruder who almost certainly wasn't complying with her instructions. Had it been her place people wouldn't be upset if she pulled the trigger--where's the overreaction?

This is a horrible "Oh, shit!" moment that a bunch of race agitators want to pretend was racial in nature.

Jebus Loren. Do you always have to lower the bar? Race involved or not, this person was killed in his own home, having done no wrong. This is worse than “Oh shit!”

The officer fucked up so badly that she was incapable of identifying her own home.

 

[ruby sparks]

She faced an intruder who almost certainly wasn't complying with her instructions. Had it been her place people wouldn't be upset if she pulled the trigger--where's the overreaction?

This is a horrible "Oh, shit!" moment that a bunch of race agitators want to pretend was racial in nature.

First, he wasn't an intruder. Second, I personally haven't read anything yet about instructions. The police media release says she saw a figure in the dark and shot?

But in any case, we need to separate issues out here, imo. As to race, I personally don't think this is a particularly good case to segue into race.

As to the awful tragedy, that has more to do with her having seriously, badly bungled. And I expect she'll be charged and will be found guilty. Not that that will give him his life back.

 

[ZiprHead]

It seems to me that there are a lot of people here who are extremely angry about people bringing up the race angle to this shooting. However, being angry that an innocent person was unnecessarily shot to death by a person, off-duty cop or otherwise, who to all appearances was clearly overreacting? Not so much.

Why do we conclude she was clearly overreacting?

She faced an intruder who almost certainly wasn't complying with her instructions. Had it been her place people wouldn't be upset if she pulled the trigger--where's the overreaction?

How do you know this?

Shit, look who I'm asking.

 

[Elixir]

First, he wasn't an intruder.

Apparent intruder, then. A heartfelt "Ooops!" should suffice to get her off the hook.

The police report says she saw a figure in the dark and shot.

Not that there's anything wrong with that, but if I did that my pets would all be dead and my home really well ventilated.

As to the awful tragedy, that has more to do with her having seriously, badly bungled.

Hence the need for that heartfelt "Ooops!"

And I expect she'll be charged and will be found guilty. Not that that will give him his life back.

Maybe just take her gun away? Oh, right. 2nd amendment and all that.
Senseless tragedy that wouldn't have happened in Denmark, Iceland, Australia or any other country where cops don't carry guns.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

At a bare minimum, this is manslaughter. The shooter negligently attempted to enter the wrong apartment. Her genuine belief that she was not wrong as to whose apartment it was may show she did not act with intent, but doesn't excuse the negligence which created the event. At best, it was a negligent taking of life due to the shooter's failure to reasonably determine the apartment was not her own.

Yet the discussion will all turn on whether her killing should be excused. "She didn't know." "It was a mistake." "He scared her." Goodness forbid anyone actually care that a guy minding his own business at home was needlessly killed.

I don't think anyone is saying it's not manslaughter. What's going on is a bunch of people trying to make it murder because the victim was black.

 

[prideandfall]

Is there any act of police brutality that you can't cook up a just-so story for?

is there any post by one of this forum's most ragingly liberal anti-racist anti-cop members that you can't somehow manage to misconstrue as the literal exact opposite of what i just said?

given your consistent and lengthy history of not having a clue what my posts mean i would think by now you'd learn to just shut up.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Assuming this is true, and we don't have to assume that because this is an unsubstantiated police source and another source said he opened the door for her after she fiddled with it and why would he be walking around his apartment in the dark or have left the door unlocked (is that even possible), there are still some issues to deal with:
1. Police working a 15 hour shift having guns. This is like surgeons working 48 hour shifts;
2. She should have recognized his big lighted room number, different color mats in the hall, the red light that went off when she put her key in the door, etc;
3. Police shooting people unnecessarily (right in the chest with a kill shot to top it off). This remains a big issue. When all you have is a hammer, is everything a nail? What ever happened to stop or I'll shoot? To put your hands up or I'll shoot?

You really think she could judge if the first round stopped him in the dark?

 

[repoman]

Assuming this is true, and we don't have to assume that because this is an unsubstantiated police source and another source said he opened the door for her after she fiddled with it and why would he be walking around his apartment in the dark or have left the door unlocked (is that even possible), there are still some issues to deal with:
1. Police working a 15 hour shift having guns. This is like surgeons working 48 hour shifts;
2. She should have recognized his big lighted room number, different color mats in the hall, the red light that went off when she put her key in the door, etc;
3. Police shooting people unnecessarily (right in the chest with a kill shot to top it off). This remains a big issue. When all you have is a hammer, is everything a nail? What ever happened to stop or I'll shoot? To put your hands up or I'll shoot?

Remember when Tracy Morgan was hit by the exhausted truck driver who was pressured with the loss of his job to work inhuman hours?

 

[repoman]

I saw this on black twitter a couple days ago:

 

[Horatio Parker]

Assuming this is true, and we don't have to assume that because this is an unsubstantiated police source and another source said he opened the door for her after she fiddled with it and why would he be walking around his apartment in the dark or have left the door unlocked (is that even possible), there are still some issues to deal with:
1. Police working a 15 hour shift having guns. This is like surgeons working 48 hour shifts;
2. She should have recognized his big lighted room number, different color mats in the hall, the red light that went off when she put her key in the door, etc;
3. Police shooting people unnecessarily (right in the chest with a kill shot to top it off). This remains a big issue. When all you have is a hammer, is everything a nail? What ever happened to stop or I'll shoot? To put your hands up or I'll shoot?

Yeah, count on the cops to come up with a scenario where the victim is at fault.

In NY, there's a "48 hour rule" meaning a cop involved in a possible crime can't be questioned for 48 hours. Time to get all the ducks in a row. Not that anyone would ever say a door was unlocked when it was or lights off when they were on...

 

[Toni]

It seems to me that there are a lot of people here who are extremely angry about people bringing up the race angle to this shooting. However, being angry that an innocent person was unnecessarily shot to death by a person, off-duty cop or otherwise, who to all appearances was clearly overreacting? Not so much.

Why do we conclude she was clearly overreacting?

She faced an intruder who almost certainly wasn't complying with her instructions. Had it been her place people wouldn't be upset if she pulled the trigger--where's the overreaction?

This is a horrible "Oh, shit!" moment that a bunch of race agitators want to pretend was racial in nature.

What instructions??????

Why the fuck does anyone have to comply with the instructions from a stranger trying to enter their apartment????

SHE was the intruder, Loren!!!!!!

Why do you believe that people who are minding their own business, doing nothing wrong must immediately understand and comply with police shouting orders???

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Wow, so now a bunch of people in the thread are being labeled "race agitators." Anything to not deal with the actual issue of laying blame on someone who committed an unnecessary killing...

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I saw this on black twitter a couple days ago:

View attachment 17495

 

[zorq]

Why do we conclude she was clearly overreacting?

She faced an intruder who almost certainly wasn't complying with her instructions. Had it been her place people wouldn't be upset if she pulled the trigger--where's the overreaction?

Frankly, I would be just as upset if it was her home and she fired on him too. If he had accidentally walked into her home and she shot him to death it would be just as much of a tragedy. You want to live in a world where it's okay for people to pay the ultimate price for simple mistakes, but that is a horrible world to live in.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I saw this on black twitter a couple days ago:

View attachment 17495

Maybe he is employed by the dept of Public Works??

White Power (hand sign)

Some white supremacists, particularly in California, may use a two-handed handsign in which one hand forms the letter "W" and the other hand forms the letter "P," to represent WP or "White Power."

https://www.adl.org/education-and-resources/resource-knowledge-base/hate-symbols?cat_id[153]=153

 

[JohnG]

On the surface I find this story a bit too extreme of an example of zoning out to be credible, but crazy 1-in-a-billion stuff does happen.

I think when you dump a massive amount of guns into a population it's not so 1-in-a-billion anymore. Granted she was a cop, but even still, a cop pulls a gun faster when there is a good chance the other person has one too.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

A good guy with a gun is a threat to no one except bad people... except if that good person is an idiot... then you could be fucked.