January 6 Hearings Live

[fromderinside]

WOPR: "Do you want to play a game?"

 

[jab]

Trump’s statement today:

We all know why Joe Biden is rushing to falsely pose as the winner, and why his media allies are trying so hard to help him: they don’t want the truth to be exposed. The simple fact is this election is far from over. Joe Biden has not been certified as the winner of any states, let alone any of the highly contested states headed for mandatory recounts, or states where our campaign has valid and legitimate legal challenges that could determine the ultimate victor. In Pennsylvania, for example, our legal observers were not permitted meaningful access to watch the counting process. Legal votes decide who is president, not the news media.

“Beginning Monday, our campaign will start prosecuting our case in court to ensure election laws are fully upheld and the rightful winner is seated. The American People are entitled to an honest election: that means counting all legal ballots, and not counting any illegal ballots. This is the only way to ensure the public has full confidence in our election. It remains shocking that the Biden campaign refuses to agree with this basic principle and wants ballots counted even if they are fraudulent, manufactured, or cast by ineligible or deceased voters. Only a party engaged in wrongdoing would unlawfully keep observers out of the count room – and then fight in court to block their access.

“So what is Biden hiding? I will not rest until the American People have the honest vote count they deserve and that Democracy demands.”

He’s betting on the Supreme Court that he’s stacked. I don’t trust them either after Bush v. Gore. Kavanaugh especially. I don’t see how exactly they can reverse the results, but damn they will try.

They won't get a chance to try, unless there's some hard evidence of widespread fraud or cheating by the Democratic campaign. And if the GOP had that evidence, they would be shouting it from the rooftops.

In the absence of any evidence, a legal challenge will be dismissed in the lower courts, and will never get to the Supremes.

The courts - at every level - aren't interested in unsubstantiated claims of unspecified unlawful activity. Sure, you can pay a lawyer to take a baseless brief and start proceedings in the lower courts; But without evidence, that brief will be laughed out of court in short order.

Trump's MO is to sue everyone and everything, whenever he doesn't get his way. But in this situation, all that will achieve is to make DJT poorer, and his lawyers richer. It's not going to achieve anything else.

The court cases are delaying tactics, to delay the certifaction of the vote and delay, perhaps even so long as to cancel the gathering of the electors, and throwing the election to the House of Reps.

 

[jab]

The easy answer to that is that cheating only happened in Philadelphia, Atlanta and Detroit.

Easy, but it makes no sense.
Stealing the presidency for Biden does nothing if we don't steal at least the Senate at the same time. We'd surely have spent as much time and money crucifying McConnell.

Sure, but it may not have been feasible. Ramping up democratic votes in the few states, actually counties/cities, that are typically democratic would be much easier than flipping republican seats all around the country.

So how could the Dems rig Arizona Pres but not Senate?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Time for Biden to start requesting restraining orders against this sort of garbage, and then keep throwing the people in jail for contempt if they continue the non-compliance.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Sure, but it may not have been feasible. Ramping up democratic votes in the few states, actually counties/cities, that are typically democratic would be much easier than flipping republican seats all around the country.

So how could the Dems rig Arizona Pres but not Senate?

Kelly did win in Arizona, right?

 

[Shadowy Man]

They won't get a chance to try, unless there's some hard evidence of widespread fraud or cheating by the Democratic campaign. And if the GOP had that evidence, they would be shouting it from the rooftops.

In the absence of any evidence, a legal challenge will be dismissed in the lower courts, and will never get to the Supremes.

The courts - at every level - aren't interested in unsubstantiated claims of unspecified unlawful activity. Sure, you can pay a lawyer to take a baseless brief and start proceedings in the lower courts; But without evidence, that brief will be laughed out of court in short order.

Trump's MO is to sue everyone and everything, whenever he doesn't get his way. But in this situation, all that will achieve is to make DJT poorer, and his lawyers richer. It's not going to achieve anything else.

The court cases are delaying tactics, to delay the certifaction of the vote and delay, perhaps even so long as to cancel the gathering of the electors, and throwing the election to the House of Reps.

I think some lawyers need to be fined and/or disbarred for frivolous lawsuits. You can’t sue saying they weren’t allowed to have people in the room and then admit in the hearing that they had people in the room. How much better use of court time is being wasted on these fools? Consequences!!

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Time for Biden to start requesting restraining orders against this sort of garbage, and then keep throwing the people in jail for contempt if they continue the non-compliance.

Biden's been around the block, he's the least concerned of anyone.

Has anyone seen even a single credible case of election fraud? Members of the GOP in many states have said their elections were legit and claims of fraud are baseless.

 

[blastula]

It was originally reported he was paid. Here's one that's still up.

Postal Worker Admits GOP Donors Paid Him $130K to Lie About Vote Tampering

They set up a GoFundMe page but GoFundMe took it down before he got paid.

But apparently it's been moved to a Christian crowdfunding site and Christians are much more ethical.

https://givesendgo.com/bebrave

And oh dear is this guy a total fuckup.

Audio recording shows Pa. postal worker recanting ballot-tampering claim - WaPo

During the recorded interview, however, federal agents repeatedly reminded Hopkins that his cooperation was voluntary, and Hopkins agreed to sign a document stating that he was not coerced.

Asked by an agent whether he had legal representation, Hopkins said Project Veritas had a lawyer on retention “in case there’s anything that happens.” The agent told Hopkins that if he had a personal lawyer, “I would make whatever efforts possible to have that person here.” Hopkins said he didn’t have a lawyer.

Hopkins also repeatedly expressed regret for signing the initial affidavit because it overstated what he knew and witnessed, according to the recording.

And he made the recording himself for the scam Project Veritas and the idiots released it claiming it showed coercion.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

He is almost to $250,000! And this is after Project Veritas releases 2 hours of audio that includes the guy saying Project Veritas wrote up the affidavit!

 

[ZiprHead]

He is almost to $250,000! And this is after Project Veritas releases 2 hours of audio that includes the guy saying Project Veritas wrote up the affidavit!

Ooh, he's making money.

If I was the postmaster he lied about, I would sue him for every penny for defamation.

 

[jab]

Sure, but it may not have been feasible. Ramping up democratic votes in the few states, actually counties/cities, that are typically democratic would be much easier than flipping republican seats all around the country.

So how could the Dems rig Arizona Pres but not Senate?

Kelly did win in Arizona, right?

yep, sorry--I confused the loser in Arizona with Ernst. Also, Dems couldn't apparently rig Maine--which Collins appears to have won by a surprising margin.

 

[Elixir]

I don't understand how Trump can get any headway in this quest to "win" the election without unprecedented, even for Republicans, blunt force against democracy and the American people. Even the cases where they might have some legal standing in questioning some of the votes, they are not enough to surpass Biden even if they do throw them out.

He just needs the courts to side with him. The same Supreme Court he has stacked in his favor. The coup scenario is simple. Barr calls for an investigation into what he claims are massive irregularities in the election. He creates a big enough furor to throw it all into doubt at least to Trump supporters. They go to the streets to demand that their local legislators pick the electors. Lawsuits and counter filed to stop this. But the Supreme Court says the legislators will controls. They pick the electors. Republicans control the legislatures in Arizona, Pennsylvania and Georgia. Guess who they pick? Trump is declared victor.

The question is what happens then. Major riots would break out in virtually all major cities. Washington DC, Atlanta, New York, Seattle, San Francisco, Chicago, even Birmingham. Trump will ask his new defense chief to repress the riots. Will the troops obey?

Don’t think it won’t happen. Americans are naive. I hope it doesn’t, but don’t think for a minute that’s fuckface won’t try. It all depends on the Supreme Court - the one dominated by Republicans 6 - 3.

That's the scenario I'm thinking about as well. That's the unprecedented blunt force against democracy I mentioned.

I don't believe any of them actually think Trump is going to get another term - in fact I don't think they even want that. They just want to gin up the "stolen election" narrative to re-engage the rage that has always underpinned Republican success. They are only doing this ridiculous charade in order to retain the Senate.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Kelly did win in Arizona, right?

yep, sorry--I confused the loser in Arizona with Ernst. Also, Dems couldn't apparently rig Maine--which Collins appears to have won by a surprising margin.

Maybe they really thought she would lose on her own. She’s like a tick burrowed deep In Maine’s skin

 

[Angry Floof]

That's the scenario I'm thinking about as well. That's the unprecedented blunt force against democracy I mentioned.

I don't believe any of them actually think Trump is going to get another term - in fact I don't think they even want that. They just want to gin up the "stolen election" narrative to re-engage the rage that has always underpinned Republican success. They are only doing this ridiculous charade in order to retain the Senate.

I don't know. Given the efforts of some (like Barr) and the fact that very few if any Republicans say a word about it or outright support it, I think they want not a second term, but a permanent term. I think they want to subvert democracy in favor of theocracy or dictatorship or whatever their deluded heads imagine. And why would they care if Trump is the one to assume such a kingship? He's old and will die soon, and one of their less stinky and more competent zealots would step into his place. Hell, given the utter lack of conscience and humanity of right wing disease, they could easily just dispose of him themselves and move on to their goal, for which Trump only served as a tool.

 

[ZiprHead]

That's the scenario I'm thinking about as well. That's the unprecedented blunt force against democracy I mentioned.

I don't believe any of them actually think Trump is going to get another term - in fact I don't think they even want that. They just want to gin up the "stolen election" narrative to re-engage the rage that has always underpinned Republican success. They are only doing this ridiculous charade in order to retain the Senate.

I don't know. Given the efforts of some (like Barr) and the fact that very few if any Republicans say a word about it or outright support it, I think they want not a second term, but a permanent term. I think they want to subvert democracy in favor of theocracy or dictatorship or whatever their deluded heads imagine. And why would they care if Trump is the one to assume such a kingship? He's old and will die soon, and one of their less stinky and more competent zealots would step into his place. Hell, given the utter lack of conscience and humanity of right wing disease, they could easily just dispose of him themselves and move on to their goal, for which Trump only served as a tool.

As far fetched as them being successful at turning this country into a dictatorship, if it did happen, the first thing the new right wing overlord would do would be to disarm the population. The schadenfreude would be beautiful.

 

[ZiprHead]

Snell & Wilmer withdraws from election lawsuit as Trump contests Arizona results

The largest law firm representing the Trump campaign or its allies in post-election litigation challenging votes in key states has withdrawn from an election lawsuit in Maricopa County, Arizona.

Associate Presiding Civil Judge Daniel Kiley on Tuesday granted Snell & Wilmer’s request to withdraw as counsel of record for the Republican National Committee. The RNC had teamed-up with the Trump campaign and the Arizona Republican Party in the case, which alleges that Maricopa County incorrectly rejected some votes cast on Election Day.

 

[laughing dog]

That's the scenario I'm thinking about as well. That's the unprecedented blunt force against democracy I mentioned.

I don't believe any of them actually think Trump is going to get another term - in fact I don't think they even want that. They just want to gin up the "stolen election" narrative to re-engage the rage that has always underpinned Republican success. They are only doing this ridiculous charade in order to retain the Senate.

I think they are more afraid of enraging Trump's base. This way they can say they stood with Trump while the deep state took him down.

 

[southernhybrid]

I have read several articles that claim that the reason the Republicans in the Senate are pretending to support Trump is due to the Georgia runoff race in January. They are fearful that since Trump isn't on the ballot, a lot of Republicans in Georgia won't bother to vote, so they are acting as if he has a chance of overturning the election results even thought they know that's bullshit. For some reason, they seem to think that this tactic will get all the Trump supporters out to vote in January. They just don't want to upset his base.

I'm more worried about Democrats not showing up in January, but I know that Stacey Abrams will do everything she can to get out the vote. Warnock is constantly putting out commercials on the local stations, and I've yet to see one from the Republicans. I've seen a couple from Ossoff. The two Republicans are telling obnoxious lies to reporters about both Democratic candidates. For example, they are claiming if the two Dems win, it will be the end of our democracy. That seems rather Orwellian to me, coming from those two assholes.

 

[ZiprHead]

This is not a coup, it's just koo koo.

..

 

[TV and credit cards]

This article helped ease some of my fear: http://https://www.lawfareblog.com/how-hard-it-overturn-american-election.

In other words, to appoint a pro-Trump slate of electors, a state legislature would have to proceed in the face of (1) a known popular vote that went for Biden by some thousands of votes, (2) official certification of that result by the elected officials of the state, (3) public statements by responsible state officials conceding that the election had not seen substantial irregularities, let alone fraud, (4) court actions rejecting challenges to any claims of fraud, (5) in some states, state law obstacles to such a course, (6) possible federal constitutional law obstacles to such a course, and (7) the clear preference in federal statute for electoral votes certified under rules established in advance of the election.

Ignoring all that, we're talking sedition. Is Mitch going to take Donald's hand and walk down that path?