No one in this thread wants to lock all people of a particular group away forever against their will, to be given all sorts of draconian, evil-scientist shock therapy or lobotomies.
I wish that were so. But nearly all of our conservative leaning posters see incarcerations as a one trick solution to nearly all social ills. Homelessness? Mental illness? Illegal immigration? Voter fraud? Lock them up, lock them up, lock them all up. Moderates are more likely to insist that this isn't supposed to be the end goal, that jails are really "rehabitilation centers", asylums are really "treatment facilities", deported asylum seekers can simply reapply next year. But the impulse is the same. You know how you know? Because if you point out that sending people to jails does
not in fact rehabilitate them, that the few treatment options available in most long-term facilities are limited if they exist at all, or that asylum seekers sent "back" to hostile nations most often immediately disappear never to be seen as living persons again, they do not want to talk about it. They get angry you even brought it up. How dare you challenge their
belief that their solutions are benevolent? Are you saying they are a Bad Person? As opposed to being genuinely concerned about the victims of their policies, and being as fervent in demanding prison reform as they were about demanding mass incarceration. Conservatives want to torture evil people like God in His heavens. Moderates don't, but they won't lift a fucking finger to stop it, because their end goal is for problems to disappear, not for them to be addressed. Anyone who wants the government to take concrete actions to improve society is a Progressive Woke and danger to the precious status quo. How things used to be, we're informed! The Good Old Days when the Good Old Boys just "took care of things" and we all had peace as long as we didn't ask too many questions.
The result of this unholy alliance between Right and Center is a carceral state extreme beyond any other nation on earth, in which over 1% of the national adult population is imprisoned either in the penal or healthcare system at any one time, the well-documented abuses within those systems are a hot button issue that no poltician will touch with a ten foot pole, and a proposal to deport 11-14 milllion people over the course of the next year is treated as a serious policy proposal.
You've certainly stereotyped a huge number of people, but the real reason I'm posting in this crazy thread is to explain a few things about the treatment of the severely mentally ill and how much better it was for those who needed hospitalization back in the 70s and 80s when we had lots of large state supported mental hospitals. I agree that what's left of them are usually horrific, under staffed, under funded places, based on what little I've read but that wasn't always the case.
The one I did I did my psych clinical as as student nurse was in Texas, and it was a very nice place, all on one level with beautiful grounds where the residents could walk. Some of the patients were there short term to help stabilize them, while others probably were so sick and had no place to go, so they were likely there for life, unless a family member was willing and able to care for them, which is almost never the case.
When Iived in SC, one of my Home Health patients had a breakdown and was acting erratic. My guess is that part of it was due to social isolation as she lived with her older sister who may have been in the early stages of dementia. I convinced her to go to a mental health clinic for an assessment and then she was transferred to a mental hospital for about a month. I felt bad but there was no other option. Surprisingly, when she got back, she thanked me for sending her to the clinic. She admitted she needed to be in the mental hospital and they helped her get back to herself. We moved or I changed jobs, so I don't know what happened to her after that. She might have needed nursing home care since she was almost totally dependent and her sister was reaching the point where she could no longer cook and help care for her.
After we moved to NC, I considered working in a large state owned mental hospital. I had an interview and took a tour. I was amazed at how caring and competent the nurses were and the patients/residents seemed content. I especially respected the nurses who chose to work on the unit for the so called criminally insane. These were people who had violent tendencies and had committed crimes but were sent to this hospital instead of a prison. These nurses wore alarm buttons in case they were attacked. They were courageous, but kind and caring.
I had planned on working in the geriatric part of the hospital since I didn't feel experienced enough yet to work in a unit for the seriously mentally ill. The geriatric section was more like a little nursing home. The residents often had dementia after a long battle with other forms of mental illnesses. But, once again, we moved so I never worked there.
Some of my former patients in the personal care home where I worked prior to retirement were seriously mentally. ill. I've mentioned the queen before and I probably mentioned Ron, who had constant hallucinations and almost constantly talked to the voices in his head. There were some others but those two always come to mind. Ron was only in his 40s, but since most of the large mental hospitals have closed down, people like him often end up in long term care. What else is there for people like Ron? He had no family that was able to care for him. If he was homeless, he would likely not survive long at all. The queen was happy with her delusions and her son wasn't willing or able to care for her.
I strongly support prison reform, but society must be protected from violent people. I don't even know of a politician these days who ever mentions prison reform, and I've read enough investigations to know that most of our prisons are hell holes, often run by gang members who pay off guards. They are usually understaffed and unsafe. Sometimes the prisoners are only fed twice a day. Georgia does use prisoners for outside work for very little pay and I have mixed feelings about that. I think they should be paid more so they could have some money to set themselves up once their sentence is over. But, I also know that a lot of them would much rather be outside all day, working at our senior center, the animal shelter, etc. compared to sitting in a prison cell all day.
Of course no homeless person, or immigrant should be locked up. And, since voter fraud is so rare, I don't even know why you mentioned it. The few cases I've read about were mistakes and ultimately the person was found innocent, including the woman in Florida.
Let me add that my late father chose to have ECT for his severe depression and while he said it didn't help, I think it did at least for awhile because he seemed much more content after the ECT. That was in the 90s btw, I don't know if they still use it but when they did in recent decades, it was only with the permission of the patient. The person is heavily sedated so they don't feel a thing. If I remember correctly, some research in the 90s gave evidence that it sometimes helped people with depression. He had it in New Jersey, a very blue state. I just checked. ECT is still used mostly for bipolar disorder and severe depression when other treatments don't help. My father also had bipolar disorder, primarily with mania.
We certainly don't do enough for people who suffer from mental illnesses, which I prefer to call brain disorders. A lot of funding was taken away when Reagan was in office and I doubt much was ever restored. When most large mental hospitals were closed down, one idea was to have visiting nurses check on these patients to see if they were taking their meds and having any exacerbations of their symptoms, but that didn't work out. A good mental hospital isn't a prison any more than a good nursing Home is a prison. Is it better to have severely ill people living on the street, unable to get enough to eat, unable to provide hygiene, or have a safe place to eliminate, get meds etc. compared to living in a place where they will receive care, food and meds? There is no easy answer as how to care for those who suffer from severe illnesses of the brain and are unable to care for themselves. I'm not talking about homeless people who aren't ill or are mildly ill. I wish we'd do more for these people like offer them safe housing, and other help.
Let me add that my sister was in a mental hospital briefly during her late teens after she was arrested for vagrancy. She was given the option of going to a mental hospital in exchange for the charges to be dropped. My father had her released early because he thought she was having too much fun and he had to pay the bill. My sister eventually got her act together although in her 70s, she still suffers from anxiety.
Things are complicated and solutions aren't always easy, even when we think they are.