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A conversion story in the politics forum

Bronzeage

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I have a friend I have known more than 30 years. Except for a few relatives, this makes his friendship my oldest surviving relationship.

His story is not unusual. I know of a few other people in his situation. He is a lifelong bachelor who never left home. Life was comfortable, but one day he realized, instead of living with his parents, his parents were now living with him. Suddenly becoming the caretaker of two elderly people is a strange experience for anyone and it dictates one's life decisions.I've never seen a personal ad that says, "Must like old People." There were a few relationships along the way, but each eroded away. Your basic 30 to 40 something woman is going to wary from the start. She knows he's not moving in with her and she certainly doesn't want to move in with him. The end result is a 50 something man who now lives alone.

My friend has always been conservative in his politics and religion, but in a fairly superficial sense. His religion is Sunday School level and his politics comes from Fox. It makes for interesting lunch conversations. He won't admit it anymore, but I think he still believes President Obama was born in Kenya. I think he is a homophobic racist asshole and he thinks I am a liberal libertine with no personal morals. It's a beautiful friendship.

In the past five years or so, things have not gone well. It started with diabetes, progressing to liver problems, gout, partial kidney failure, and chronic pain. All of these problems are the result of a life of obesity. He is very tall, which masked his weight for a long time, but it eventually caught up with him. This makes life difficult for a man who repairs transmissions. He applied for disability two years ago, but was rejected. It's difficult to convince the government that your are disabled, while working 40 hours a week. But. once the real decline began, it was sure and steady. Two months ago, he developed a staph infection in his ankle, which quickly moved up to his groin. The doctor wanted to admit him to the hospital, but this was not an option. Several years of declining income, combined with unreimbursed medical expenses have depleted his savings. There was no money for a co-pay which would be about $2000. The next best thing was out-patient antibiotic infusions and bed rest at home, for at least four weeks.

This was incentive to try for disability again. His lawyer looked over the case and said it was open and shut. He might have his first check in a month or so. He applied for food stamps(it's actually a debit card) and met a very sympathetic government bureaucrat who fast tracked his paperwork, because his situation was so dire. He's eligible for a $150/month food credit.

All this time, his biggest worry is medical insurance. His employer provided a major medical policy which covered prescriptions and he would be eligible for a Cobra plan. This was a problem. The Cobra premium would be about $650 a month. There simply wasn't any money for this. I sent him to the Blue Cross sales agent who handles my medical insurance. My friend's projected income makes him eligible for a considerable Obama care subsidy for his insurance premium. He now has a Gold level policy, for a monthly cost of $149.

We had lunch together yesterday. He is now a Democrat.
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.
Pretty much.
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.

Hanlon's Razor:

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.

Yup. While the right is right that people should take more personal responsibility they ignore the fact that there are cases where that's not an option. For example, pre-ACA health insurance.
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.

I have never seen any behavior in my friend which could be considered "sociopathic." He does have three dachshunds, and cried when the fourth one died a month ago.
 
Used to be, the saying was that a liberal was a conservative who's been arrested. Maybe it needs to be updated to a liberal is a poor conservative who needed to buy health care.

Once opposed to ACA, now a convert

Leinhauser, 55, a retired firefighter and nurse, drove him to a doctor's office. "Dean only saw a doctor when he needed to because it made a big difference in his finances," Leinhauser said.

From time to time, Leinhauser would urge Angstadt to buy a plan through the ACA marketplace. And each time, Angstadt refused.

"We argued about it for months," Angstadt said. "I didn't trust this Obamacare. One of the big reasons is it sounded too good to be true."

January came, and Angstadt's health continued to decline. His doctor made it clear he urgently needed valve-replacement surgery. Leinhauser had seen enough and insisted his friend get insured.

"The only thing he was ever really adamant about was that Obamacare was the real deal," Angstadt said. "I trusted him to at least take a look at it."

Leinhauser went to Angstadt's house, and in less than an hour, the duo had done the application. A day later, Angstadt signed up for the Highmark Blue Cross silver PPO plan and paid his first monthly premium: $26.11.

"All of a sudden, I'm getting notification from Highmark, and I got my card, and it was actually all legitimate," he said. "I could have done backflips if I was in better shape."

Angstadt's plan kicked in on March 1. It was just in time. Surgery couldn't be put off any longer. On March 31, Angstadt had life-saving valve-replacement surgery.

"I probably would have ended up falling over dead" without the surgery, Angstadt said. "Not only did it save my life, it's going to give me a better quality of life."
 
Used to be, the saying was that a liberal was a conservative who's been arrested. Maybe it needs to be updated to a liberal is a poor conservative who needed to buy health care.

The usual saying is that a conservative is a liberal that was mugged.

Once opposed to ACA, now a convert

Someone we used to know (haven't seen them in some months) was a Ted Cruz supporter. His business had gotten destroyed by the collapse, he was uninsured. Doc: Throat cancer. He was lucky that he was within the enrollment window--I'm sure he wouldn't have enrolled otherwise. (Not that it's going to save him.)
 
Used to be, the saying was that a liberal was a conservative who's been arrested. Maybe it needs to be updated to a liberal is a poor conservative who needed to buy health care.

The usual saying is that a conservative is a liberal that was mugged.

Once opposed to ACA, now a convert

Someone we used to know (haven't seen them in some months) was a Ted Cruz supporter. His business had gotten destroyed by the collapse, he was uninsured. Doc: Throat cancer. He was lucky that he was within the enrollment window--I'm sure he wouldn't have enrolled otherwise. (Not that it's going to save him.)

Stories like this and the story of my friend doom all chances to repeal Obamacare, for much the same reason the GOP's crusade against same sex marriage is doomed. Everyone knows someone who desperately needs healthcare. It's a friend or relative and anyone who wants to take away their insurance will make a life long enemy.
 
This kind of selfishness that's inherent in the conservative attitude really does annoy me. When it's someone else who's benefitting, they're useless leeches who aren't worth the cost. When it's their turn to benefit, however, all of a sudden it's the best idea ever.
 
@bronzeage: I'm sorry to hear about your friend's predicament but I'm glad he was able to start getting what he needs.
 
@bronzeage: I'm sorry to hear about your friend's predicament but I'm glad he was able to start getting what he needs.

Thank you. This is the first time I have seen him truly happy in years.
 
Sounds about right.

You're both Alabama, right?

One of my biggest disappointments about this year is Sessions is getting a free ride for Senate. The fact is that there are a LOT of people like your friend who the Democrats could sweep up if they made the effort. Maybe not enough to unseat Sessions in Alabama, but in combination with the high Black populations poor Whites properly appealed to and mobilized could take back the South for the Dems, especially in the Appalachian counties. Not in a generation, but in a few years.
 
Sounds about right.

You're both Alabama, right?

One of my biggest disappointments about this year is Sessions is getting a free ride for Senate. The fact is that there are a LOT of people like your friend who the Democrats could sweep up if they made the effort. Maybe not enough to unseat Sessions in Alabama, but in combination with the high Black populations poor Whites properly appealed to and mobilized could take back the South for the Dems, especially in the Appalachian counties. Not in a generation, but in a few years.

Excuse me? We are both in Baton Rouge. I will accept your apology in advance. As you are in Philadelphia, I am sure you have no idea the significance of what you just said.
 
Sounds about right.

You're both Alabama, right?

One of my biggest disappointments about this year is Sessions is getting a free ride for Senate. The fact is that there are a LOT of people like your friend who the Democrats could sweep up if they made the effort. Maybe not enough to unseat Sessions in Alabama, but in combination with the high Black populations poor Whites properly appealed to and mobilized could take back the South for the Dems, especially in the Appalachian counties. Not in a generation, but in a few years.

Excuse me? We are both in Baton Rouge. I will accept your apology in advance. As you are in Philadelphia, I am sure you have no idea the significance of what you just said.

Eep.

Profound apologies.

The practical upshot is the same though. Landrieu is in much less danger than popularly believed.
 
This kind of selfishness that's inherent in the conservative attitude really does annoy me. When it's someone else who's benefitting, they're useless leeches who aren't worth the cost. When it's their turn to benefit, however, all of a sudden it's the best idea ever.

They know their own back stories. Know that they have been good citizens and that circumstances have put them in the situation.

What bugs me is that they don't have enough empathy to credit others with the same, or the imagination to see social complexities.

Of course, the other thing that will never cease to amaze me is that the richest country in the world, and the most self righteous, lets its citizens die of preventable causes because they don't have enough money.
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.

I have never seen any behavior in my friend which could be considered "sociopathic." He does have three dachshunds, and cried when the fourth one died a month ago.

Great. So he can feel empathy for dachshunds. How much empathy did he show for other human beings back when he was quoting right wing talking points?
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.



I have never seen any behavior in my friend which could be considered "sociopathic." He does have three dachshunds, and cried when the fourth one died a month ago.

Great. So he can feel empathy for dachshunds. How much empathy did he show for other human beings back when he was quoting right wing talking points?
Quite a bit.
Humans are complicated creatures, and my friend is on of the more complicated I have ever met. He talks politics in the abstract, but on a personal level he is a kind and generous person. I've always been amazed how despite his abrasive personality, so many people genuinely like him. I could go on and tell about his kindness and compassion to defend his reputation in your eyes, but there is no real need. We are all Henry's spotted soldiers.

If I were to limit myself to perfect friends, or just those who agreed with me, I would be a lonely person.
 
Remember keep you gumbermint hands off of my Medicare!

It is amazing of the vitriolic hatred for anything Obama and especially the 30 or so republican governors who refuse the medicaid expansion under the ACA umbrella. Fregin assholes. With the powerful monied interest bankrolling the more moving to the right GOP/republican party it looks like the future seems bleaker. And I am most certainly not an Obama apologist either.

Money can not only buy you votes Bronzeage it can buy you the minds of the illiterate masses. The programs and policies that actually help you are transformed into this surreal libertarian monster. SS is bad and needs to be changed. Medicare is bad and needs to be changed. Taxes need to be lowered for the wealthy and the corporate interests and so on and so forth.

Thanks again for the good story. Our nation is being torn apart and the monied interest are laughing all the way to the bank!

Peace

Pegasus
 
That's the really sickening thing about rightists.

When he saw these things happening to other people, he did not re-examine his political views. Once these things started happening to him, then suddenly it was time to re-examine his political views.

It's as if they are sociopaths with no capacity for basic human empathy.

Mmmm... I'd say it's the tribal instinct. The other nationality, race, etc, is always the devil. You cannot betray tribe, leader and hearth. It would send you down to subjective hell, you would not be a son nor a comrade anymore, you would be less than a man.

Some people are simply further down the ladder of cultural evolution. It takes a serious personal blow to shake that crap out of some people's heads.


I like to call it "geeks versus jocks". They haven't realized yet that brawn beats brain isn't the rock-paper-scissors game we're playing now.
 
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