Bernie's vision would result in half the workforce effectively employed by the government

[Axulus]

All told, Sanders’s current plans would cost as much as $97.5 trillion over the next decade, and total government spending at all levels would surge to as high as 70 percent of gross domestic product. Approximately half of the American workforce would be employed by the government. The ten-year budget deficit would approach $90 trillion, with average annual deficits exceeding 30 percent of GDP.

The $97.5 trillion price tag is made up mostly of the costs of Sanders’s three most ambitious proposals. Sanders concedes that his Medicare For All plan would increase federal spending by “somewhere between $30 and $40 trillion over a 10-year period.” He pledges to spend $16.3 trillion on his climate plan. And his proposal to guarantee all Americans a full-time government job paying $15 an hour, with full benefits, is estimated to cost $30.1 trillion. The final $11.1 trillion includes $3 trillion to forgive all student loans and guarantee free public-college tuition—plus $1.8 trillion to expand Social Security, $2.5 trillion on housing, $1.6 trillion on paid family leave, $1 trillion on infrastructure, $800 billion on general K-12 education spending, and an additional $400 billion on higher public school teacher salaries.

This unprecedented outlay would more than double the size of the federal government. Over the next decade, Washington is already projected to spend $60 trillion, and state and local governments will spend another $29.7 trillion from non-federal sources. Adding Sanders’s $97.5 trillion—and then subtracting the $3 trillion saved by state governments under Medicare For All—would raise the total cost of government to $184 trillion, or 70 percent of the projected GDP over ten years.

https://www.city-journal.org/bernie-sanders-expensive-spending-proposals

Pie in the sky

 

[PyramidHead]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

 

[Axulus]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

So the numbers are wrong? How? Some of the estimates come from Bernie himself. How about demonstrating why the numbers are wildly off rather than attacking your enemies all the time.

 

[Toni]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

Yeah, bring it! The bros ain’t got nothin’ except fingers in their ears and nanananana. With a foot stomp and threat to hold their breath for added emphasis.

 

[PyramidHead]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

So the numbers are wrong? How? Some of the estimates come from Bernie himself. How about demonstrating why the numbers are wildly off rather than attacking your enemies all the time.

I will do the opposite, and pay it no mind except as a right-on-cue hit piece by a capitalist mouthpiece that can only mean Bernie is making that class worried enough to publish it.

 

[Axulus]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

So the numbers are wrong? How? Some of the estimates come from Bernie himself. How about demonstrating why the numbers are wildly off rather than attacking your enemies all the time.

I will do the opposite, and pay it no mind except as a right-on-cue hit piece by a capitalist mouthpiece that can only mean Bernie is making that class worried enough to publish it.

I see Bernie's delusion is contagious. So we have deluded Trumpists and deluded Bernie Bros. The future of the country is bright.

 

[PyramidHead]

I will do the opposite, and pay it no mind except as a right-on-cue hit piece by a capitalist mouthpiece that can only mean Bernie is making that class worried enough to publish it.

I see Bernie's delusion is contagious. So we have deluded Trumpists and deluded Bernie Bros. The future of the country is bright.

You are going to vote for Trump (probably again) because you don't want your taxes to go up, it's okay to be honest

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

So the numbers are wrong? How? Some of the estimates come from Bernie himself. How about demonstrating why the numbers are wildly off rather than attacking your enemies all the time.

The first nitpick is the $16 trillion for infrastructure/green is 15 years, not ten.

$31 trillion for 10 years for full employment. A run of the numbers indicates that it would cost $31 trillion ($15 an hour for 40 hrs for a year is a whomping $31,200), which means to reach $31 trillion, that'd employ 96 million Americans (10 million a year). The current active US work force is 160 million.

The Medicare for all would generally be swapping existing premiums to insurance to Medicare taxes. So that $30 to $40 trillion is misleading as it wouldn't be unaccounted for.
.

 

[Politesse]

Someone's got to do it.

 

[Toni]

I will do the opposite, and pay it no mind except as a right-on-cue hit piece by a capitalist mouthpiece that can only mean Bernie is making that class worried enough to publish it.

I see Bernie's delusion is contagious. So we have deluded Trumpists and deluded Bernie Bros. The future of the country is bright.

You are going to vote for Trump (probably again) because you don't want your taxes to go up, it's okay to be honest

I would truly appreciate some honesty from Sanders supporters. Why vote for Sandra except that you believe that Trump is the only other option?

 

[Axulus]

The famously evenhanded Manhattan Institute throwing their weight on the train tracks as Bernie's train gains momentum? Bring it on. Let's hear from the CATO people and Third Way while it's still January.

So the numbers are wrong? How? Some of the estimates come from Bernie himself. How about demonstrating why the numbers are wildly off rather than attacking your enemies all the time.

The first nitpick is the $16 trillion for infrastructure/green is 15 years, not ten.

$31 trillion for 10 years for full employment. A run of the numbers indicates that it would cost $31 trillion ($15 an hour for 40 hrs for a year is a whomping $31,200), which means to reach $31 trillion, that'd employ 96 million Americans (10 million a year). The current active US work force is 160 million.

The Medicare for all would generally be swapping existing premiums to insurance to Medicare taxes. So that $30 to $40 trillion is misleading as it wouldn't be unaccounted for.
.

According to sources I found, the proposed climate plan is to spend the money over 10 years, but the revenue to pay for it will occur over 15 years:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...new-deal-follow-costs-16-trillion/2081655001/

Also, the full employment living wage includes benefits, not just the $15/hour money wage.

Finally, the $30 to $40 trillion medical spending is still government spending, which is what the analysis focused on: how much will government spending go up, and what percent of the economy will government spending make up if all of Bernie's proposals were actually implemented?

 

[ZiprHead]

The $30 to $40 trillion medical spending is still government spending, which is what the analysis focused on.

And that's exactly why it's dishonest. It's lying by omission.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The first nitpick is the $16 trillion for infrastructure/green is 15 years, not ten.

$31 trillion for 10 years for full employment. A run of the numbers indicates that it would cost $31 trillion ($15 an hour for 40 hrs for a year is a whomping $31,200), which means to reach $31 trillion, that'd employ 96 million Americans (10 million a year). The current active US work force is 160 million.

The Medicare for all would generally be swapping existing premiums to insurance to Medicare taxes. So that $30 to $40 trillion is misleading as it wouldn't be unaccounted for.
.

According to sources I found, the proposed climate plan is to spend the money over 10 years, but the revenue to pay for it will occur over 15 years:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...new-deal-follow-costs-16-trillion/2081655001/

Also, the full employment living wage includes benefits, not just the $15/hour money wage.

Finally, the $30 to $40 trillion medical spending is still government spending, which is what the analysis focused on: how much will government spending go up, and what percent of the economy will government spending make up if all of Bernie's proposals were actually implemented?

First, the scare number to begin with is heavily reliant on ignoring the revenue from what was private insurance premiums. So that isn't particularly something that should be ignored. It was ignored for a reason.

Seeing that most of this wouldn't even be implemented, I'm not really concerned. It is a bit of scare tactics. I mean after all of the circle jerkin' over Obama's deficits from people who'd write the OP article link... I haven't heard a fucking peep out of those assholes, so seriously... don't give a fuck what they think.

 

[Derec]

Pie in the sky

Not to worry. DNC will never allow Sanders to win the nomination. If Biden can't pull it off, there is always Bloomberg waiting in the wings.

Personally, I am waiting for Sanders to cross $0.45 on PredictIt. Then it's buy, baby buy, a lot of Sanders No shares. Easy money.

 

[PyramidHead]

Pie in the sky

Not to worry. DNC will never allow Sanders to win the nomination. If Biden can't pull it off, there is always Bloomberg waiting in the wings.

Personally, I am waiting for Sanders to cross $0.45 on PredictIt. Then it's buy, baby buy, a lot of Sanders No shares. Easy money.

We have to crush the opposition so decisively that it becomes too politically inconvenient for them to ratfuck him again. Every Bernie volunteer out there is operating under the following rules: until Iowa, regardless of what the polls say, organize like he's behind 10 points.

 

[PyramidHead]

lol at "Sandra" btw

 

[fromderinside]

Yak, yak, yak. Bluster et cetera. It's primary season and only democrats are making choices. We'll use whatever works for us to pick the one we want to run for president. Then we'll adjust for what is needed to bring independants along for the general election. If we pick Bernie we'll pick a balance as VP candidate and write a platform suited to the overall political flavor we will expect we need to have the best chance for democrats coming to power.

We will write a platform introducing Medicare for all which will include taking advantage of existing mechanisms - a bit like Warren is proposing - for providing coverage. It will be limited by what medicare already provides, that will be a huge cut to insurance companies, so we'll have to replace those that give up with a federal option and a luxury option for those who want face lifts.

As for being expensive. Not really. We have a national medical budget that is about $20 trillion over ten years higher than even Bernie suggests we'd need to pay. So we'll suck up that surplus at a bargain in the private sector.

It's not really about socialism. It's the US moving forward as a social democracy becoming a member of what other democratic republics are today.

We've got the Republican party in freefall. We won't be stupid.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Time to break out the Sanders - Bloomerberg 2020 stickers?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

You are going to vote for Trump (probably again) because you don't want your taxes to go up, it's okay to be honest

I would truly appreciate some honesty from Sanders supporters. Why vote for Sandra except that you believe that Trump is the only other option?

Bread and circuses.

 

[marc]

I would truly appreciate some honesty from Sanders supporters. Why vote for Sandra except that you believe that Trump is the only other option?

1. he doesn’t take corporate donations (bribes) so would actually be working for the people instead of corporate donors
2. Medicare for all
3. He wants to move away from perpetual wars in the Middle East
4. For minimum wage to be something people could actually live on without taking 3 jobs
5. For a tax system that doesn’t move money to the top
6. Actually cares about climate change
7. Was for these same positions 30 years ago. He doesn’t follow political winds, he stands on his principals
8. Was arrested when protested for equal rights waaay back in his college years