Charlie Kirk shot at (shot?) in Utah

[crazyfingers]

Radical Christianity is just as incompatible with US culture (as set out in your constitution) as radical Islam, and only the former is an existential threat to the USA.

No. Radical Islam is a few orders of magnitude more out there than radical Christianity.
But Islamism gets defended by the far left because of the latter's rigid oppressor-oppressed paradigm that identifies Muslims as "the oppressed" because they are not western.

It has been pointed out to you consistently that the left doesn't defend "Islamism" but rather we just happen not to believe every single Muslim is an evil terrorist. You just conflate the two things because you're an idiot.

The problem is that the left ends up refusing to believe the danger of radical Islam. It's not all Muslims, it's that most Muslims will not oppose the radicals.

Possibly true. However I believe that most Christians are also unwilling to oppose the radical right-wing Christian Taliban.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

OMG. the horrors. And I thought Texans were supposed to tough. But they are fucking snowflakes.

How does "tough" enter the issue that this young woman committed a misdemeanor assault while police were watching her meltdown?

FFS, hat grabbing should not be assault. The police overreacted to her overreaction.

The attempt to grab a hat is both assault and battery. That being said, likely they were being selective about who they went after.

It should be neither assault nor battery.

So it should be legal to go around knocking people's hats off? Could the deniers go around ripping people's masks off?

The reality is that a realistic threat of harm is assault. An attempt to accomplish it is battery even if that attempt fails. I've seen someone arrested this way, they couldn't understand how they were being arrested for assault and battery because they had missed when spitting.

 

[Elixir]

The reality is that a realistic threat of harm is assault. An attempt to accomplish it is battery even if that attempt fails.

To accomplish what? Harm?
Does knocking someone’s hat off constitute harm or is the alarm factor sufficient?

 

[Shadowy Man]

Possibly true. However I believe that most Christians are also unwilling to oppose the radical right-wing Christian Taliban.

well it definitely seems the grieving of Charlie Kirk is not limited to extreme fundamentalist Christians, despite those being his views.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Roe never had an actual law in place, it was ONLY an interpretation.

Ah yes, the infamous emanations from the penumbrae. That sounds more like Gnostic theogony and cosmology than sound constitutional jurisprudence.
And the "right to privacy" that Roe was based on was not consistently applied. It should have applied to things like gay sex (decades before Lawrence), consumption of marijuana in private, and also (probably most controversially on here because of illiberal feminists like Toni) also to sex work.
By tailoring "right to privacy" very narrowly, that right squandered a lot of appeal. Had more people had a stake in the decision, it would have been less controversial, I think.
The "pro choice" movement of the following decades continued this by only caring about one choice, not seeking broader pro-Individual-liberty coalition.

Society wasn't ready for the rest of it.

As far as I'm concerned it should apply to the private consumption of any substance whose misuse does not harm others. (Thus most prescription medicine, but not antibiotics or the like.) I have come to the unpleasant discovery that compounding pharmacies have basically been regulated out of existence for what they supposedly existed to do: provide alternative packaging for drugs when the patient can't tolerate the standard packaging.

And, yes, sex work.

And there should not be the concept of obscene material. Consenting provider, consenting recipient, fine. (Yes, this is a privacy issue even though it masquerades as a free speech issue. It's about what happens in private, not what happens in public.)

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I point this out because some people are inclined to ignore the differences in motivations for the crimes and of the shooters. Some people want to paint only persons of color as being violent while ignoring the fact that white males kill a lot of children.

If you want to focus on the great divide with respect to violent crime, you could point out that most violent crime is committed by males, period. I don’t think that would make you any happier.

Not only that, but violent crime is far more about socioeconomic conditions than skin color. There's more black murder because there are more blacks in the inner city than whites in the messes in the rural southeast.

Oh, ffs, Loren. There is poverty in every single state, not just in the southeast. There are more poor people who do NOT live in urban areas than who do live in inner cities. Not all black people live in urban areas much less in impoverished inner cities. White middle class people also engage in violent crime, including murder. My town is a very good example of that.

I'm not saying it's exclusive to such areas, just that it's mostly in such areas. Plot murder by zip code, you'll see.

 

[Elixir]

Possibly true. However I believe that most Christians are also unwilling to oppose the radical right-wing Christian Taliban.

well it definitely seems the grieving of Charlie Kirk is not limited to extreme fundamentalist Christians, despite those being his views.

“He may be a little bit of a wacko, but he’s OUR wacko and we love(d) him. 95 percent of what he said was true.”

The MAGAtropolis houses both the Christofascist fundy and the Prosperity Gospel folk, among others. They all gotta grieve and give praise like hell right now in case anyone’s looking.

 

[Elixir]

Consenting provider, consenting recipient, fine. (Yes, this is a privacy issue even though it masquerades as a free speech issue. It's about what happens in private, not what happens in public.)

You haven’t heard her!

 

[Derec]

The Constitution says what the Supreme Court says it says. Not the other way around. Haven't you been paying any attention? They just said it's ok to racially profile.

Which decision is that?

 

[Toni]

The Constitution says what the Supreme Court says it says. Not the other way around. Haven't you been paying any attention? They just said it's ok to racially profile.

Which decision is that?

How the Supreme Court's Latest Decision Clears the Way for Racial Profiling During Immigration Raids - American Immigration Council

This week the U.S. Supreme Court issued a decision that clears the way for racial profiling during immigration raids and sweeps. Now we could see the Trump administration rapidly expand the racially discriminatory ICE practices we have already seen terrorize families, workplaces, and communities...

www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org

 

[GenesisNemesis]

The Constitution says what the Supreme Court says it says. Not the other way around. Haven't you been paying any attention? They just said it's ok to racially profile.

Which decision is that?

How the Supreme Court's Latest Decision Clears the Way for Racial Profiling During Immigration Raids - American Immigration Council

This week the U.S. Supreme Court issued a decision that clears the way for racial profiling during immigration raids and sweeps. Now we could see the Trump administration rapidly expand the racially discriminatory ICE practices we have already seen terrorize families, workplaces, and communities...

www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org

Conservatives have a big problem with reading comprehension, so it probably isn't going to do much.

 

[Bomb#20]

Did even one of you make a stink about it when that professor got fired for saying everyone's life matters?

not familiar with that one. Was the firing a result of coercion by the federal government?

No, she was fired by the government of Massachusetts. Does it make a difference?

No. It doesn’t. As I said I wasn’t familiar with that one. Do you have a link to read?

Here are a couple:

Nursing dean fired after telling students ‘everyone’s life matters’ | The College Fix

University claims statement was not reason for termination.

www.thecollegefix.com

University of Massachusetts Nursing Dean Fired After Saying “Everyone’s Life Matters” [Updated]

We have been discussing the growing fear of professors and students over the loss of free speech on campuses for years, but recently those concerns have been greatly magnified with the investigatio…

jonathanturley.org

 

[Loren Pechtel]

How old are you? Is your living memory defective, or just short?

Yeah it's not like leftists haven't been continually sounding the alarm about Project 2025's threats to free speech, which conservatives routinely ignore.

Dude, objecting to your outgroup censoring your ingroup is not the same thing as giving a rat's ass about free speech. Throughout the time leftists have been sounding the alarm about Project 2025 they've been enthusiastically cancelling non-leftists. Did even one of you make a stink about it when that professor got fired for saying everyone's life matters?

You're focusing on the leftist mound while ignoring Everest on the right. And most of what the left has been doing has been pointing out that many people aren't as nice as they portray themselves/have been portrayed as.

As far as my alleged stereotyping goes, you stereotyped vegans. There's a commonality in the thought processes that cause people to become leftists; vegans are vegan for lots of different reasons. "I'm not vegan because I love animals; I'm vegan because I HATE PLANTS!". You know perfectly well stereotyping an ideology is entirely different from stereotyping some random personal characteristic. To wit...

Meat eaters kill more plants than vegans.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It wasn't name-calling, it was simply reality. A reality that has come to pass. We have troops in the streets, we have a government that no longer respects the rule of law.

Truly, a person would have to live under a rock to fail to realize that.

Survivorship bias.

Everything will be ok because every time there have been dire predictions in the past they have not come to be.....because when those dire predictions actually happened they were only noted by the archeologists.

 

[Arctish]

OMG. the horrors. And I thought Texans were supposed to tough. But they are fucking snowflakes.

How does "tough" enter the issue that this young woman committed a misdemeanor assault while police were watching her meltdown?

FFS, hat grabbing should not be assault. The police overreacted to her overreaction.

The attempt to grab a hat is both assault and battery. That being said, likely they were being selective about who they went after.

It should be neither assault nor battery.

So it should be legal to go around knocking people's hats off? Could the deniers go around ripping people's masks off?

It shouldn't be legal.

It might be a misdemeanor or it might be a felony depending on circumstances.

But to have the Governor of Texas bragging about the arrest of the hat-knocker and saying it was because they made a taunt is a ridiculous overreaction. It's like Gov. Abbot celebrating the arrest of someone who smashed a pumpkin. Yes, it's a civil offense. No, it doesn't deserve the attention of the highest levels of state governance even if what was carved on the pumpkin was offensive to someone.

The reality is that a realistic threat of harm is assault. An attempt to accomplish it is battery even if that attempt fails. I've seen someone arrested this way, they couldn't understand how they were being arrested for assault and battery because they had missed when spitting.

It might have been an assault. Or it might have been the result of careless contact in a crowd. Or it might have been the result of a defensive move, like putting up hands to ward off someone screaming in your face.

We don't know enough of the details to even guess which is more likely. But we do know better than to underestimate the power of rightwing media to exaggerate harmless contact or to downplay an actual threat.

 

[bilby]

Radical Christianity is way out there, also. It's just we haven't seen much of their insanity.

Speak for yourself because your eyes must be wide shut.

We do not see a lot with the level of wrongness that we see from Islam. Where is the Christian equivalent to the Iranian-backed genocides of Africa?

Also in Africa.

I am surprised you were unaware of this.

Islam and Christianity have been fighting a very bloody war there for control of various territories (often asynchronous with national boundaries, as is true of so much of post-colonial Africa) for a couple of centuries now.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Did even one of you make a stink about it when that professor got fired for saying everyone's life matters?

not familiar with that one. Was the firing a result of coercion by the federal government?

No, she was fired by the government of Massachusetts. Does it make a difference?

No. It doesn’t. As I said I wasn’t familiar with that one. Do you have a link to read?

Here are a couple:

Nursing dean fired after telling students ‘everyone’s life matters’ | The College Fix

University claims statement was not reason for termination.

www.thecollegefix.com

University of Massachusetts Nursing Dean Fired After Saying “Everyone’s Life Matters” [Updated]

We have been discussing the growing fear of professors and students over the loss of free speech on campuses for years, but recently those concerns have been greatly magnified with the investigatio…

jonathanturley.org

Yeah. Thats pretty bad. The university claims it wasn’t for those reasons but apparently never gave her a chance to know what Their issues were with her or for her to defend herself.

Presumably she would file a lawsuit against the university. Do you know what came of that?

 

[Shadowy Man]

I was also against the firing of that mandalorian actress by Disney even though that was a private company.

 

[laughing dog]

OMG. the horrors. And I thought Texans were supposed to tough. But they are fucking snowflakes.

How does "tough" enter the issue that this young woman committed a misdemeanor assault while police were watching her meltdown?

FFS, hat grabbing should not be assault. The police overreacted to her overreaction.

The attempt to grab a hat is both assault and battery. That being said, likely they were being selective about who they went after.

It should be neither assault nor battery.

So it should be legal to go around knocking people's hats off? Could the deniers go around ripping people's masks off?

Get a grip. It’s rude and childish to knock a hat off. Unless it causes actual harm, it should not be a crime

The reality is that a realistic threat of harm is assault. An attempt to accomplish it is battery even if that attempt fails. I've seen someone arrested this way, they couldn't understand how they were being arrested for assault and battery because they had missed when spitting.

Spitting is disgusting, and that alone should make it a misdemeanour, But a realistic threat of harm? Get a grip,

 

[GenesisNemesis]

OMG. the horrors. And I thought Texans were supposed to tough. But they are fucking snowflakes.

How does "tough" enter the issue that this young woman committed a misdemeanor assault while police were watching her meltdown?

FFS, hat grabbing should not be assault. The police overreacted to her overreaction.

The attempt to grab a hat is both assault and battery. That being said, likely they were being selective about who they went after.

It should be neither assault nor battery.

So it should be legal to go around knocking people's hats off? Could the deniers go around ripping people's masks off?

Get a grip. It’s rude and childish to knock a hat off. Unless it causes actual harm, it should not be a crime.

I'm just wondering what the punishment should be for knocking a hat off given how these people are acting like it's such a serious crime.

Also false equivalence as knocking a hat off doesn't endager anyone else's life.