Climate Change(d)?

[robnisch]

My alma mater.

OIT Klamath Fall recognized for its geothermal power plant

U.S. Department of Energy recognizes the Oregon Institute of Technology (OIT) for its efforts to not only be heated but also powered by a geothermal power plant.

www.thinkgeoenergy.com

They do have a lot of maintenance issues. The heat exchangers must be cleaned every year or so.
It was cool there because all the walkways were heated, no ice.

 

[TV and credit cards]

A big boost for a climate solution: electricity made from the heat of the Earth

One method of making electricity cleanly to address climate change has been quietly advancing and just hit a milestone.

apnews.com

Horizontal drilling for geothermal.
It complements wind and solar for when the wind doesn't blow and the sun doesn't shine because word has it the earth is always hot.

Technology - Fervo Energy

Our breakthrough technology leverages over a decade of innovation in drilling and production from modern oil and gas development, leading to major

fervoenergy.com

California Energy Commission Chair David Hochschild said the state is committed to clean, zero-carbon electricity. He said geothermal complements wind and solar farms by providing steady power when it’s not windy or sunny, and that is key to ensuring reliability as the state cuts fossil fuels.

Geothermal does not complement wind and solar. It is a 24/7 energy source. Be great if they can up scale it. We certainly have some warm places underground in the west. They also happen to be large National Parks as well.

Yeah, geothermal is pretty good. It certainly beats burning coal.

It's not very clean though - it often releases a lot of highly corrosive, toxic, and/or smelly chemicals, particularly sulphur compounds, and it tends to be limited (like hydropower) by the small amount of really suitable terrain.

It also suffers from the corrosiveness and other issues with the working fluid - all those dissolved minerals tend to clog up the works, or eat holes in the equipment, so the maintainence costs (and associated environmental loads) are high.

And, as you point out, there's nothing that "complements" wind and solar, except storage systems - and yhey aren't so much "complementary" as they are "an essential component whose costs are so eye-wateringly high that we would like to pretend they aren't part of our proposed system".

It claims to be load following flexible geothermal power with storage capacity in excess of five days. Using hydraulic fracturing, pumping cold water in, they create an underground radiator, a closed system with an injection and production well. No permeable rock required. They build up pressure within the radiator and release it as needed when wind/solar is unavailable.

Princeton Engineering - Flexible geothermal power approach combines clean energy with a built-in ‘battery’

Flexible geothermal power shows big promise for a decarbonized grid, according to a Princeton-led study in collaboration with Fervo Energy.

engineering.princeton.edu

This geothermal startup showed its wells can be used like a giant underground battery

If Fervo Energy’s field results work at commercial scale, it could become cheaper and easier to green the grid.

www.technologyreview.com

They have an agreement with Southern California Edison for 320MW by 2028.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The military has another reason for a PWR design: Military stuff is meant to go in harms way. Somehow I think they would prefer when that line catches some shrapnel that it spills steam rather than liquid sodium. Our navy is obsessive about damage control. (And clearly the Russians are not--otherwise they would not have lost the Moskova. It sank long enough after the hit that it had to be a damage control failure.)

Yeah, maybe. I rather doubt that a live steam leak in a confined space is particularly fun to try to deal with.

Live steam would not be fun. Flaming sodium would be even more not fun.

And once you've fixed your system you can replace the water and continue. (Nuclear powered ships have distillers anyway.) No replacing the sodium.

Liquid sodium has some pretty big downsides for the navy.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

A big boost for a climate solution: electricity made from the heat of the Earth

One method of making electricity cleanly to address climate change has been quietly advancing and just hit a milestone.

apnews.com

Horizontal drilling for geothermal.
It complements wind and solar for when the wind doesn't blow and the sun doesn't shine because word has it the earth is always hot.

Technology - Fervo Energy

Our breakthrough technology leverages over a decade of innovation in drilling and production from modern oil and gas development, leading to major

fervoenergy.com

California Energy Commission Chair David Hochschild said the state is committed to clean, zero-carbon electricity. He said geothermal complements wind and solar farms by providing steady power when it’s not windy or sunny, and that is key to ensuring reliability as the state cuts fossil fuels.

Geothermal does not complement wind and solar. It is a 24/7 energy source. Be great if they can up scale it. We certainly have some warm places underground in the west. They also happen to be large National Parks as well.

But there's not that much heat down there. In the big picture geothermal will be small even if it can be widely used in niche situations like Iceland.

And there's a downside I wouldn't have thought of: We have some local opposition to geothermal--because they expect it would wreck the hot springs in the area.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Do you see this, Swizzle, from NASA? Can you really not process the meaning of this? Or do you think this is “fake news” because NASA is part of the “deep state”?

View attachment 46570

I think @TSwizzle may have missed your post, pood, since he has not responded.
Or perhaps there’s just nothing he can say about this:
View attachment 46585

You did it as a .jpeg. The original was .webp and the board doesn't inline that.

 

[bilby]

The military has another reason for a PWR design: Military stuff is meant to go in harms way. Somehow I think they would prefer when that line catches some shrapnel that it spills steam rather than liquid sodium. Our navy is obsessive about damage control. (And clearly the Russians are not--otherwise they would not have lost the Moskova. It sank long enough after the hit that it had to be a damage control failure.)

Yeah, maybe. I rather doubt that a live steam leak in a confined space is particularly fun to try to deal with.

Live steam would not be fun. Flaming sodium would be even more not fun.

And once you've fixed your system you can replace the water and continue. (Nuclear powered ships have distillers anyway.) No replacing the sodium.

Liquid sodium has some pretty big downsides for the navy.

Sure. But naval vessels nevertheless carry plenty of stuff that is seriously hazardous, when the mission calls for it.

Munitions are dangerous. Rocket propellants are dangerous. Aviation fuel is dangerous. If a sodium cooled reactor had some particular advantage over a PWR for naval use, they wouldn't resile from it.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The military has another reason for a PWR design: Military stuff is meant to go in harms way. Somehow I think they would prefer when that line catches some shrapnel that it spills steam rather than liquid sodium. Our navy is obsessive about damage control. (And clearly the Russians are not--otherwise they would not have lost the Moskova. It sank long enough after the hit that it had to be a damage control failure.)

Yeah, maybe. I rather doubt that a live steam leak in a confined space is particularly fun to try to deal with.

Live steam would not be fun. Flaming sodium would be even more not fun.

And once you've fixed your system you can replace the water and continue. (Nuclear powered ships have distillers anyway.) No replacing the sodium.

Liquid sodium has some pretty big downsides for the navy.

Sure. But naval vessels nevertheless carry plenty of stuff that is seriously hazardous, when the mission calls for it.

Munitions are dangerous. Rocket propellants are dangerous. Aviation fuel is dangerous. If a sodium cooled reactor had some particular advantage over a PWR for naval use, they wouldn't resile from it.

Are we concerned about our domestic nuclear power plants going to war at sea at some point? I honestly think that is unlikely. If it gets that bad, the Malls would go first.

 

[pood]

You did it as a .jpeg. The original was .webp and the board doesn't inline that.

I was wondering why it did not show. Thanks.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Extremely rare tropical storm develops out in Atlantic in June. Forecast is mixed as to whether it becomes a major hurricane as the water conditions are absurdly good for intensification. Very very early for June. Yes, it is almost July, but it is very rare for July too. The good news is SW California looks like it will be unharmed due to the storm's anticipated trajectory.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The military has another reason for a PWR design: Military stuff is meant to go in harms way. Somehow I think they would prefer when that line catches some shrapnel that it spills steam rather than liquid sodium. Our navy is obsessive about damage control. (And clearly the Russians are not--otherwise they would not have lost the Moskova. It sank long enough after the hit that it had to be a damage control failure.)

Yeah, maybe. I rather doubt that a live steam leak in a confined space is particularly fun to try to deal with.

Live steam would not be fun. Flaming sodium would be even more not fun.

And once you've fixed your system you can replace the water and continue. (Nuclear powered ships have distillers anyway.) No replacing the sodium.

Liquid sodium has some pretty big downsides for the navy.

Sure. But naval vessels nevertheless carry plenty of stuff that is seriously hazardous, when the mission calls for it.

Munitions are dangerous. Rocket propellants are dangerous. Aviation fuel is dangerous. If a sodium cooled reactor had some particular advantage over a PWR for naval use, they wouldn't resile from it.

Are we concerned about our domestic nuclear power plants going to war at sea at some point? I honestly think that is unlikely. If it gets that bad, the Malls would go first.

No, why the navy trains people on PWR reactors. Civilian industry likes to get pre-trained people from the military rather than do their own training.

 

[TSwizzle]

One of the largest residential solar installers in the nation has abruptly shut its doors and filed for bankruptcy in the latest blow to a troubled industry. Titan Solar, which installed thousands of systems across the U.S., informed its employees June 13 that it was “closing its doors,” having failed to secure a buyer for the company, according to an email obtained by TIME. Titan is not the only solar installer to close up shop lately. The company, which could not be reached for comment for this story—its website has shut down—is one of 16 major solar outfits that have filed for bankruptcy in 2023 and 2024, according to Solar Insure, which offers warranties and monitoring for homeowners who have solar. They include Pink Energy and Vision Solar, which like other operators in the industry faced regulatory action and numerous consumer complaints. Customers are left with solar panels on their homes that they may or may not want.

Time

I don’t think solar is going to save California from bad weather.

Now that I think of it, what about all these great, well paying “green” jobs that Obama promised and Brandon’s “build back better” economy? lol.


It is a catastrophic 82 degrees in Santa Monica today. Oh the humanity!!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Beryl to likely be a Cat 4 before landfall, which is unheard of at this time of year.

This rapid intensification is likepy going to need to require mods to Saffir Simpson as the quick development typically means a more compact storm, not quite as much surge.

Life in the Carribean is going to be tougher if the tropical storm season is going to add 12 to 18 months.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Going from unusual to unprecedented, and a second wave could form into a storm behind it. With the churn of Beryl, could limit its potential, but we are already seeing activity outside the expected areas at this point.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Beryl is approaching Cat 5, 150 mph winds. Earliest Atlantic storm on record to do that was Emily back in '93, into the second week of July. The good news with Beryl is it is a relatively compact hurricane, so the hurricane wind field is suppressed in size. With luck, this is an asterisk and the rest of the hurricane season ends up being a non-issue.

 

[Swammerdami]

Goodnews: IIUC, Beryl, Chris, Debby, Ernesto, Francine, Gordon, Helene AND Isaac are all expected to give a wide berth to balmy Santa Monica.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Earliest Cat 5 on record. Second tropical storm and it got to Cat 5. Rapid intensification out in the middle of the Atlantic, in late June. Jamaica is next.

 

[Swammerdami]

It is a catastrophic 82 degrees in Santa Monica today. Oh the humanity!!

I came across this image just now. It's only about 3 miles from Portola to the San Francisco Golf Club, but the temperature drops by a whopping 32° from one to the other!

Perhaps we should take up a collection and buy Mr. Swizz half a tank of gas. Then he could drive up to Woodland Hills and give us a report from there.

 

[Politesse]

I'm fucking melting. I have A/C, but it was clearly not designed for a challenge of this magnitude. Seriously considering hopping on the BART and going to one of those colder neighborhoods for the rest of the morning, only everyone else is also going to be doing that...

 

[Swammerdami]

It is a catastrophic 82 degrees in Santa Monica today. Oh the humanity!!

Perhaps we should take up a collection and buy Mr. Swizz half a tank of gas. Then he could drive up to Woodland Hills and give us a report from there.

We all know that Mr. Swizz is intensely interested in science, and would be happy to drive to and check out anywhere that the half-tank would take him, e.g. Edwards Air Force Base. But we needn't impose on his busy schedule. Edwards Air Force Base, unlike Woodland Hills, has a weather station with records freely available at the NOAA website.

From that website we learn that the AFB had four days in June with temperatures of 106° or more, and 19 days in June above 100°. 46 days this year above 90°. That's not counting July 3 or 4 -- scorchers -- NOAA takes a few days to update their site.

The humanity!

Perhaps the AF should relocate its B from Edwards to Santa Monica.

 

[Shadowy Man]

It is a catastrophic 82 degrees in Santa Monica today. Oh the humanity!!

Perhaps we should take up a collection and buy Mr. Swizz half a tank of gas. Then he could drive up to Woodland Hills and give us a report from there.

You might want to check on gas prices in California before committing to a half tank.