Climate Change(d)?

[GenesisNemesis]

And Tswizzle still hasn't explained exactly how the amount of natural carbon dioxide is enough to account for warming when we know far more has been added to the atmosphere by human made things. It's 100% wishful thinking to suggest human caused warming isn't happening....

Even Mr. Swizz isn't as stupid as he seems. He has at least a glimmering awareness that anthropogenic climate change is real but somehow enjoys portraying a moronic Trumpist on this message board.

I think many of us role-play on a message board. I, for example, appear to be a sarcastic asshole here, but in real life I'm a sarcastic but friendly buffoon.

"Stupid as he seems" is uncalled for. There seems to be a very nasty streak among some members here, that is getting worse.

Such as with the guy who immediately suggested the person who shot the national guardsmen may be trans, despite there being no actual overall trend of trans shooters?

(Edit) accidentally quoted myself in first one.

I'm talking about how members here treat one another, here.

I am referring to a member here:

Suspect in custody. A they/them perhaps?

I understand the instinct to call for civility, but look at it from my perspective. I am a Jew by birth, I am (diagnosed) on the autism spectrum, I am bisexual, and, on top of all of that, I happen to have been born with a genetic condition. There are many things some people hate me simply for being, and many people on the right would even claim I am somehow making it up, to score "wokeness points" or whatever. It gets a little tiring having to be polite all the time particularly when so many people hate me for so many things I am, and will readily claim I'm just making up what I am.

Those people tend to be on the right wing, and now we have people like RFK Jr dehumanizing autistic people and making absurd negative generalizations about them. There are people on the right who seemingly don't care about this, and will claim no matter what that RFK Jr is actually a good guy.

How am I, as a person on the spectrum, supposed to react to that? What RFK Jr is doing is really no different than bullying, and denying it's bullying is no different than protecting the bully. Am I supposed to be polite to the people protecting the bully and to bullies? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. So my first instinct is simply to be more understanding of those in marginalized groups and their negative reactions to what's going on. Not to be polite to people defending a guy making absurd generalizations about autistic people, for instance.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

Saw that eyeroll coming from a mile away, even though everything I said is correct, and you don't have a rebuttal to it.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

Hey Tswizzle, do you happen to know what it's like to be choking on food when you're a kid because you were born with a genetic condition that resulted in that? No? You're still just going to eyeroll that away like the sociopath you are, I suppose.

 

[bilby]

"Stupid as he seems" is uncalled for.

I agree. Nobody is that stupid.

 

[steve_bank]

Yes civility is important as any of you a-holes know... Hee Hee Heee

Synonyms for "stupid" include foolish, unintelligent, dense, idiotic, and silly. Other options that are more informal include dumb, daft, and dim-witted.

Daft or dense may be more appropriate for the sensitive politically correct types.

If you read and engage with science for a long tie you start to look trough science. What is the data? Logic.

The vast majority of people do not think that way. It is all about feelings and emotions.

 

[WAB]

And Tswizzle still hasn't explained exactly how the amount of natural carbon dioxide is enough to account for warming when we know far more has been added to the atmosphere by human made things. It's 100% wishful thinking to suggest human caused warming isn't happening....

Even Mr. Swizz isn't as stupid as he seems. He has at least a glimmering awareness that anthropogenic climate change is real but somehow enjoys portraying a moronic Trumpist on this message board.

I think many of us role-play on a message board. I, for example, appear to be a sarcastic asshole here, but in real life I'm a sarcastic but friendly buffoon.

"Stupid as he seems" is uncalled for. There seems to be a very nasty streak among some members here, that is getting worse.

Such as with the guy who immediately suggested the person who shot the national guardsmen may be trans, despite there being no actual overall trend of trans shooters?

(Edit) accidentally quoted myself in first one.

I'm talking about how members here treat one another, here.

I am referring to a member here:

Suspect in custody. A they/them perhaps?

I understand the instinct to call for civility, but look at it from my perspective. I am a Jew by birth, I am (diagnosed) on the autism spectrum, I am bisexual, and, on top of all of that, I happen to have been born with a genetic condition. There are many things some people hate me simply for being, and many people on the right would even claim I am somehow making it up, to score "wokeness points" or whatever. It gets a little tiring having to be polite all the time particularly when so many people hate me for so many things I am, and will readily claim I'm just making up what I am.

Those people tend to be on the right wing, and now we have people like RFK Jr dehumanizing autistic people and making absurd negative generalizations about them. There are people on the right who seemingly don't care about this, and will claim no matter what that RFK Jr is actually a good guy.

How am I, as a person on the spectrum, supposed to react to that? What RFK Jr is doing is really no different than bullying, and denying it's bullying is no different than protecting the bully. Am I supposed to be polite to the people protecting the bully and to bullies? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. So my first instinct is simply to be more understanding of those in marginalized groups and their negative reactions to what's going on. Not to be polite to people defending a guy making absurd generalizations about autistic people, for instance.

I was designated SMI in Arizona (Serious Mental Illness), I've been in two mental hospitals, twice in one of them, I've attempted suicide twice, was sexually assaulted by a friend in high school on a camping trip, and for years was emotionally and physically abused by a family member. I've struggled with alcoholism, and drug addiction, and have been homeless. Add to that a disastrous marriage and divorce, and just general anxiety and depression for most of my life.

I grew especially sensitive to the word stupid. I was called stupid for years by the family member I referred to. I got "triggered" by Swammi's very passive aggressive "not as stupid as he seems", especially since it seemed to be in reference to TSwizzle's views on climate change. I understand there are actual climatologists who dissent from the accepted view of it, and I do not believe that this dissent means they are stupid. Maybe they are, but I'm not qualified to judge. Maybe TSwizzle is stupid, but I don't know him and I am not qualified to judge.

I do agree that his remark about the DC shooter maybe being trans was silly and offensive. I hadn't noted that comment, but that's neither here nor there.

I share your dislike of bullies. I was small and slight and utterly non-aggressive as a kid, and was occasionally bullied in school.

I have never said we should be polite to bullies, but I don't like calling people stupid for having an opinion, however unpopular. I can say, "hey that's a stupid thing to say", but lots of very smart people say very stupid things sometimes. There are very smart people here who have said monumentally stupid things.

I am truly sorry if I've said anything to offend you.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Observations are an imperceptible increase in global average temperature.

Not sure why you put so much emphasis on "imperceptible" here {snip}.

Because that’s what the propaganda bleats on about!

“WE MUST NOT GO OVER 1.5 DEGREES BECAUSE etc !!11!!!1111!!!! “

I’m not the one obsessed with an imperceptible increase in average global temperature.

Well, you are half right. There is no magic about 1.5C. Humans have a stupid obsession with even numbers.

But that doesn't mean it's imperceptible. You're thinking of the normal temperature, you very well might not notice 1.5C. But at the extremes 1.5C matters--extreme heat becomes far more common, extreme cold far less common. The zone in which a species can live is often defined by heat kills or cold kills. That 1.5C translates into quite a bit of distance on the ground.

Look at the brutal wildfires we have been seeing in the west. There are two factors going on:

1) A bit more warmth means hotter, drier summers and thus the forest is more likely to go up.

2) Pine forests rely upon cold to kill their pests. We are seeing more and more kills from bugs that didn't get killed by winter. And dead trees are even more of a fire risk.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Imperceptible? We used to grow peaches and plums where I live. Now we grow mangoes and pineapples. Peaches and plums won’t set fruit without the requisite chill-hours. The plants perceive something.

We haven't lost them yet, but people in the lower parts of the valley have even before the recent jump. But still too much frost for the tropical stuff.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

You're still claiming Santa Monica remaining a specific temperature is evidence of anything, when average doesn't mean the temperature increases everywhere to begin with.

Ok, for the last fucking time, the Santa Monica reference is a retort to the dumbass posts on here about how growing mangoes or such bullshit is evidence of some sort of climate crisis.

And? You can't use one data point as evidence that a climate crisis isn't happening. I'm not even going to bother trying to interpret your vague claim that people are claiming "growing mangoes or such bullshit is evidence of some sort of climate crisis", because how often you just make shit up.

Growing mangoes means nothing. Growing mangoes where peaches used to grow means a lot.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

A heatwave, in the desert, in summer?!! Oh my gosh!! It gets worse, hurricanes, in the Caribbean, during hurricane season?!! Oh Lordy, whatever next, blizzards in winter?!!

How about addressing what he said?

The term was "unprecedented". You realize heat waves already kill an awful lot of people? It used to be thought the survival limit was 35C wet bulb, but it has been shown that in most realms that's optimistic, the actual survival limit is generally lower, especially amongst the elderly. And an awful lot of people in the world live in places where it comes close. And note the survival limit assumes laying down in the shade, plenty of properly salted water to drink. How many outside workers are going to die from this?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I don't know the exact links to climate change

That’s correct, you don’t know.

You sound like the Challenger launch decision.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Well COP30 ended just like all the previous COP meetings.

The 30th conference of the parties (Cop30), the annual climate summit of all nations party to the UNFCCC, just ended. Stakeholders are out in the media trying spin the outcome as a win. Simon Stiell, climate change executive secretary for the UN is, for instance, praising Cop30 for showing that “climate cooperation is alive and kicking, keeping humanity in the fight for a liveable planet”. But let us be clear. The conference was a failure.

The very week of Cop30, Iran’s president, Masoud Pezeshkian, announced that Tehran, Iran’s capital city of 16 million, would need to be abandoned and re-established elsewhere, because, after years of climate-fuelled drought, its water has finally run out.

Teh Gruaniad

What absolute nonsense this woman spouts.

Are you not aware of what's been happening?

Yes, it's mostly the government fucked up, but the problem is very real--more demand, less supply, the aquifer was depleted.

 

[Shadowy Man]

I understand there are actual climatologists who dissent from the accepted view of it, and I do not believe that this dissent means they are stupid. Maybe they are, but I'm not qualified to judge. Maybe TSwizzle is stupid, but I don't know him and I am not qualified to judge.

it’s not the dissent itself that is being criticized. It is the lack of rationality behind the defense of the dissent.

I’m sure those “actual climatologists” have a rational basis for their dissent. And with no citation provided by you we can’t assess what exactly they are disagreeing with or the basis for their putative disagreements. If such exist I hope they argue in good faith, in contrast to what is happening here.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

I understand there are actual climatologists who dissent from the accepted view of it, and I do not believe that this dissent means they are stupid. Maybe they are, but I'm not qualified to judge. Maybe TSwizzle is stupid, but I don't know him and I am not qualified to judge.

it’s not the dissent itself that is being criticized. It is the lack of rationality behind the defense of the dissent.

And the refusal to actually learn anything, with blatant mischaracterizations of what scientists claim (which is another very tiring thing ultimately leading to things like the demonization of experts). It'd be one thing if someone's interested in learning, but based on Tswizzle's responses, he's not,

 

[steve_bank]

WAB

Sorry if the discussions has triggered some bad feelings, but we can all have triggers.

Back in the 70s I was riding in a car with a black guy I knew and inadvertently referred to him as boy. I knew it was a sore point for black men but I did not think.

He got angry.


The threshold is genially high for moderation and as you know some do get banned for chronic abusive language..

I use the word ignorant for TSwizzle. Willfully ignorant.

It seems obvious Tswizzle tries to provoke people, and sometimes he succeeds.

We can only speculate as to why.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

How am I, as a person on the spectrum, supposed to react to that? What RFK Jr is doing is really no different than bullying, and denying it's bullying is no different than protecting the bully. Am I supposed to be polite to the people protecting the bully and to bullies? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. So my first instinct is simply to be more understanding of those in marginalized groups and their negative reactions to what's going on. Not to be polite to people defending a guy making absurd generalizations about autistic people, for instance.

Bullying? He wants to destroy them. "Work" camps that would be death camps.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

How am I, as a person on the spectrum, supposed to react to that? What RFK Jr is doing is really no different than bullying, and denying it's bullying is no different than protecting the bully. Am I supposed to be polite to the people protecting the bully and to bullies? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. So my first instinct is simply to be more understanding of those in marginalized groups and their negative reactions to what's going on. Not to be polite to people defending a guy making absurd generalizations about autistic people, for instance.

Bullying? He wants to destroy them. "Work" camps that would be death camps.

(I'm still vaguely hoping it won't happen), but yup, worse than bullying of course.

 

[Swammerdami]

Even Mr. Swizz isn't as stupid as he seems. He has at least a glimmering awareness that anthropogenic climate change is real but somehow enjoys portraying a moronic Trumpist on this message board.

I think many of us role-play on a message board. I, for example, appear to be a sarcastic asshole here, but in real life I'm a sarcastic but friendly buffoon.

"Stupid as he seems" is uncalled for. There seems to be a very nasty streak among some members here, that is getting worse.

I apologize for my frequent complaints which sometimes become uncontrolled and even abusive. Trying to make excuses for my behavior would be pointless.

Everyone posting here is above average in intelligence; and most of you are exceptionally intelligent. That's why it's enjoyable to interact here. and why it's frustrating when communication fails.

And note that "stupid as he seems" is a misquote. I wrote that the poster was "NOT as stupid as he seems," suggesting that he was play-acting rather than actually unwilling to learn.

But anyway, I do apologize. I will try to tone down some of my posts in future.

 

[robnisch]

IGNORant

 

[WAB]

I understand there are actual climatologists who dissent from the accepted view of it, and I do not believe that this dissent means they are stupid. Maybe they are, but I'm not qualified to judge. Maybe TSwizzle is stupid, but I don't know him and I am not qualified to judge.

it’s not the dissent itself that is being criticized. It is the lack of rationality behind the defense of the dissent.

I’m sure those “actual climatologists” have a rational basis for their dissent. And with no citation provided by you we can’t assess what exactly they are disagreeing with or the basis for their putative disagreements. If such exist I hope they argue in good faith, in contrast to what is happening here.

I didn't bother to cite anything because I only looked at a few articles and there seemed to be general agreement that not all climatologists, meteorologists, or scientists, are on board with the overall consensus with regard to climate change. I didn't dig very deeply because 1) I have no problem trusting the great majority of scientists, meteorologists, and climatologists, and am not a denialist; and 2) I am not heavily involved in that conversation. My mentioning the subject at all was only to support my claim that making assumptions of stupidity about people one interacts with, and especially declaring them on a message board, is uncalled for. Or maybe what I mean is, even if it's true, it's mean-spirited and too easy.

I agree that TSwizzle's method of expressing his objection to the subject is irrational, but one can be intelligent and still behave irrationally, and have irrational opinions. It happens all the time, especially on Internet message boards.

By and large, the general thought I'm trying to convey requires a whole thread in itself, but I don't dare start one because I know what would happen, and all it would do is frustrate me.