Covid-19 miscellany

[DrZoidberg]

I agree with the sentiment. I also don't think anybody should be forced to get vaccinated. I'm extremly pro-vaccines. I'm just against forcing it on anyone. Liberalism is about fighting for freedom. The moment liberals stop fighting for freedom they've stopped being liberals IMHO

I got vaccinated, now we (the vaccinated) need to wear masks again because the unvaccinated spread the fucking disease instead of getting vaccinated. But fuck our liberty, right?

Yeah, that's the problem with freedom. People who are free might not do what you think they should be doing with their freedom. Tough titties.

 

[Learner]

I'm with them on this.

I agree with this too.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I agree with the sentiment. I also don't think anybody should be forced to get vaccinated. I'm extremly pro-vaccines. I'm just against forcing it on anyone. Liberalism is about fighting for freedom. The moment liberals stop fighting for freedom they've stopped being liberals IMHO

I got vaccinated, now we (the vaccinated) need to wear masks again because the unvaccinated spread the fucking disease instead of getting vaccinated. But fuck our liberty, right?

Yeah, that's the problem with freedom. People who are free might not do what you think they should be doing with their freedom. Tough titties.

Your argument is so hollow. This "liberty" or "freedom" is imposing on other people's liberty. I can't blast the speakers in my house in my neighborhood and make a public nuisance. And that isn't leading to anyone's death!

Another person's freedom and liberty stops well short of a second party's coffin.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Yeah, that's the problem with freedom. People who are free might not do what you think they should be doing with their freedom. Tough titties.

Your argument is so hollow. This "liberty" or "freedom" is imposing on other people's liberty. I can't blast the speakers in my house in my neighborhood and make a public nuisance. And that isn't leading to anyone's death!

Another person's freedom and liberty stops well short of a second party's coffin.

We've discussed this before. I think you're a fucking fascist. Sorry to be blunt. But there it is. Your idea of liberalism isn't liberalism at all IMHO.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

You're not alone doc, just come across news that the Italian vaccinated were burning their vax passports in solidarity with the unvaccinated.. reason being, going against division between people etc.

So you saw a Twitter feed that alleged something happened?

Link

The notion that Italy under Mr. Draghi is doing reasonable things to help bring Italy out of the pandemic and into recovery has translated into broad support for what is now Europe’s most expansive measure in countering the spread of the Delta variant.

A recent poll published in Italy’s largest newspaper, Corriere della Sera, showed that 66 percent of Italians support the Green Pass, and populist leaders who once cast doubt on vaccines have largely gotten with the program.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Yeah, that's the problem with freedom. People who are free might not do what you think they should be doing with their freedom. Tough titties.

Your argument is so hollow. This "liberty" or "freedom" is imposing on other people's liberty. I can't blast the speakers in my house in my neighborhood and make a public nuisance. And that isn't leading to anyone's death!

Another person's freedom and liberty stops well short of a second party's coffin.

We've discussed this before. I think you're a fucking fascist. Sorry to be blunt. But there it is. Your idea of liberalism isn't liberalism at all IMHO.

That's fine, name calling and all is perfectly acceptable derail maneuver. However, that doesn't actually address the subject at all. IE, where does one draw the line of liberty and freedom? Is it legitimate to allow one person to commit actions that needlessly harm others? Does a person's right extend beyond the coffin of another?

You can call me a fascist if you want again, but that won't address the viable limits of freedom in a civil society, especially where the viable limits are respective to those that trespass on the liberties (or even lives) of others.

 

[repoman]

So seeing Twitter righties saying vax passport infrastructure will morph via leftist mission creep into carbon footprint passport.

Sometimes using further what if slippery slope scenarios is valid, sometimes it is not.

Slippery slopes can 100% be a real tactic by those in power - more like boiling the frog/ thin edge of the wedge - such as Apple scanning for child exploitation images (a moral good) on iphones that may move into political dissidents in repressive countries having scanned phones.

Other times it is people using a far fetched straw man to not do what needs to be done NOW.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Yeah, that's the problem with freedom. People who are free might not do what you think they should be doing with their freedom. Tough titties.

Your argument is so hollow. This "liberty" or "freedom" is imposing on other people's liberty. I can't blast the speakers in my house in my neighborhood and make a public nuisance. And that isn't leading to anyone's death!

Another person's freedom and liberty stops well short of a second party's coffin.

We've discussed this before. I think you're a fucking fascist. Sorry to be blunt. But there it is. Your idea of liberalism isn't liberalism at all IMHO.

How did being extremist libertarian work out for Sweden in WW2?

 

[Learner]

You're not alone doc, just come across news that the Italian vaccinated were burning their vax passports in solidarity with the unvaccinated.. reason being, going against division between people etc.

So you saw a Twitter feed that alleged something happened?

I did better than that. I saw the "alleged" videos and there are a variety of them from different sources!

Link

The notion that Italy under Mr. Draghi is doing reasonable things to help bring Italy out of the pandemic and into recovery has translated into broad support for what is now Europe’s most expansive measure in countering the spread of the Delta variant.

A recent poll published in Italy’s largest newspaper, Corriere della Sera, showed that 66 percent of Italians support the Green Pass, and populist leaders who once cast doubt on vaccines have largely gotten with the program.

As a sceptic, I would have thought you would have checked more than just the NYT feed ...to be sure. Using the the poll you provided. 30 or even 20 pecent is still a lot of people.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I did better than that. I saw the "alleged" videos and there are a variety of them from different sources!

That's super. Can I find a video of an evangelical supporting the vaccine and then say all Evangelicals are demanding America get vaccinated?

Link

The notion that Italy under Mr. Draghi is doing reasonable things to help bring Italy out of the pandemic and into recovery has translated into broad support for what is now Europe’s most expansive measure in countering the spread of the Delta variant.

A recent poll published in Italy’s largest newspaper, Corriere della Sera, showed that 66 percent of Italians support the Green Pass, and populist leaders who once cast doubt on vaccines have largely gotten with the program.

As a sceptic, I would have thought you would have checked more than just the NYT feed ...to be sure. Using the the poll you provided. 30 or even 20 pecent is a lot of people, agreeing with Doc Z.

20 to 30% of the people is nothing in a Democracy. 70 to 80% is considered broad consensus. If a candidate won with 67 to 80% of the vote in the US, it would be unprecedented. Generally the only things that gets that level of support are local parks and zoos.

 

[Learner]

That's super. Can I find a video of an evangelical supporting the vaccine and then say all Evangelicals are demanding America get vaccinated?

I've come across evangelicals, both for and against vaccinations, they're human after all.

As a sceptic, I would have thought you would have checked more than just the NYT feed ...to be sure. Using the the poll you provided. 30 or even 20 pecent is a lot of people, agreeing with Doc Z.

20 to 30% of the people is nothing in a Democracy. 70 to 80% is considered broad consensus. If a candidate won with 67 to 80% of the vote in the US, it would be unprecedented. Generally the only things that gets that level of support are local parks and zoos.

As I previously said to Doc Z, he was not alone. And besides, there is no deadline as if it were for someone to vote before some finality. People change their minds and easily get influenced by what they see and hear (in protests), so in this regard, the polls could vary each week or month continuing etc..

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I've come across evangelicals, both for and against vaccinations, they're human after all.

20 to 30% of the people is nothing in a Democracy. 70 to 80% is considered broad consensus. If a candidate won with 67 to 80% of the vote in the US, it would be unprecedented. Generally the only things that gets that level of support are local parks and zoos.

As I previously said to Doc Z, he was not alone.

Actually you seemed to have been implying Italians were in footstep, regarding Vax cards.

Italian vaccinated were burning their vax passports in solidarity with the unvaccinated.

And besides, there is no deadline as if it were for someone to vote before some finality. People change their minds and easily get influenced by what they see and hear (in protests), so in this regard, the polls could vary each week or month continuing etc..

Kind of a weak position to take there... the vast majority might change their mind...

 

[Learner]

Actually you seemed to have been implying Italians were in footstep, regarding Vax cards.

Ok, if that's what it seemed to you. I was trying to say the 'vaccinated' who burnt their passports, did not agree with this passport idea, in the thought that this idea would be potentially be 'unfair and discriminative' to those who were not vaccinated, causing division.

Italian vaccinated were burning their vax passports in solidarity with the unvaccinated.

And besides, there is no deadline as if it were for someone to vote before some finality. People change their minds and easily get influenced by what they see and hear (in protests), so in this regard, the polls could vary each week or month continuing etc..

Kind of a weak position to take there... the vast majority might change their mind...

No probs, fair viewpoint. 'Changing minds' etc., is not a thing I've thought to focus on, to defend.

 

[crazyfingers]

Sidney Powell- Walk Out!

Sidney Powell is promoting for all who are forced to decide to choose a jab or their job to Walk Out on Wednesday, August 11th at 12:00 noon!

Dear Patriots

NO ONE should be forced to get jabbed with an untested vaccine against their will or through threat of job loss or education opportunities.

Millions of people have researched the vaccine and have legitimate concerns about the vaccine’s safety and effectiveness.

Defending the Republic is asking you to take a stand and join us for Walk Out Wednesday, August 11 at Noon.

Peacefully walk out of your place of employment or school if you are being forced to get vaccinated.

Buh bye, fuckheads.

I agree with the sentiment. I also don't think anybody should be forced to get vaccinated. I'm extremly pro-vaccines. I'm just against forcing it on anyone. Liberalism is about fighting for freedom. The moment liberals stop fighting for freedom they've stopped being liberals IMHO

At this point, anyone who is not vaccinated but who can be vaccinated are the drunk drivers on the road. People who refuse vaccination and who can be vaccinated should stay home because otherwise they are a treat to everyone else.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Ok, if that's what it seemed to you. I was trying to say the 'vaccinated' who burnt their passports, did not agree with this passport idea, in the thought that this idea would be potentially be 'unfair and discriminative' to those who were not vaccinated, causing division.

So a few people didn't agree. You should have stated your claim better then by stating an allegedly unknown, but likely small, number of vaccinated people allegedly burned cards related to their vaccination in support of people that didn't get vaccinated.

Additionally, causing division? What happened to personal responsibility? It is a Tenet of so many people, except when it comes to spreading a disease that has killed millions. Then it isn't personal responsibility, it becomes a loss of freedom and causing division.

 

[repoman]

I live in Washington state and got my vaccine through Virginia Mason at a mass vax site.

I am in the state vaccine web site and also my vax record for last year's flu shot at Safeway was included. I had no idea that was the case before hand.

 

[Swammerdami]

Sidney Powell- Walk Out!

Sidney Powell is promoting for all who are forced to decide to choose a jab or their job to Walk Out on Wednesday, August 11th at 12:00 noon!

Millions of people have researched the vaccine and have legitimate concerns about the vaccine’s safety and effectiveness.

Buh bye, fuckheads.

I see others have already laughed at this, but the absurdity is mind-boggling. Thousands have researched the vaccine. There's no way to turn that to Millions without counting Trump-suckers reading Facebook as "researchers." Is Sidney Powell just a drunken idiot? To paraphrase [MENTION=228]Derec[/MENTION] , whose cum did she have to swallow to get a law degree?

Previous link with its title: Vocal anti-vaccine broadcaster dies from COVID-19 complications - "Friends say Dick Farrel encouraged them to get the vaccine after he was infected"

Help me understand something. There have been over 200 million covid-19 cases world-wide, many reporting serious long-term symptoms. And over 4 million deaths from the virus. (U.S.A. leads the world in virus deaths. Yay, Trump! He did Make America #1 Again!)

Yet "white Christian evangelists" have eagerly denied that the virus was a threat. Do they think it's all a hoax operated by Nancy Pelosi or the Illuminati? Or that it's God's Will — with the dying just sinners and pagans?

Their own parishes have people with Covid-19. Yet when the "preachers" get infected personally, they do a 180-degree turn?

I'd have much more respect for them if they said "God must want me in heaven sooner rather than later. Don't get vaccinated! Follow God's Plan."

 

[Toni]

I see others have already laughed at this, but the absurdity is mind-boggling. Thousands have researched the vaccine. There's no way to turn that to Millions without counting Trump-suckers reading Facebook as "researchers." Is Sidney Powell just a drunken idiot? To paraphrase [MENTION=228]Derec[/MENTION] , whose cum did she have to swallow to get a law degree?

Previous link with its title: Vocal anti-vaccine broadcaster dies from COVID-19 complications - "Friends say Dick Farrel encouraged them to get the vaccine after he was infected"

Help me understand something. There have been over 200 million covid-19 cases world-wide, many reporting serious long-term symptoms. And over 4 million deaths from the virus. (U.S.A. leads the world in virus deaths. Yay, Trump! He did Make America #1 Again!)

Yet "white Christian evangelists" have eagerly denied that the virus was a threat. Do they think it's all a hoax operated by Nancy Pelosi or the Illuminati? Or that it's God's Will — with the dying just sinners and pagans?

Their own parishes have people with Covid-19. Yet when the "preachers" get infected personally, they do a 180-degree turn?

I'd have much more respect for them if they said "God must want me in heaven sooner rather than later. Don't get vaccinated! Follow God's Plan."

My observation is more like: “I’m pretty sure I already had Covid back in last spring so I don’t need no vaccination. Please pray for my wife and daughter who have it now and are hurtin purty bad.” This is not a hypothetical but actually what a relative (by marriage) is saying.

And…some do come out of their near death experiences urging everyone to get vaccinated.

 

[repoman]

I see others have already laughed at this, but the absurdity is mind-boggling. Thousands have researched the vaccine. There's no way to turn that to Millions without counting Trump-suckers reading Facebook as "researchers." Is Sidney Powell just a drunken idiot? To paraphrase [MENTION=228]Derec[/MENTION] , whose cum did she have to swallow to get a law degree?

Previous link with its title: Vocal anti-vaccine broadcaster dies from COVID-19 complications - "Friends say Dick Farrel encouraged them to get the vaccine after he was infected"

Help me understand something. There have been over 200 million covid-19 cases world-wide, many reporting serious long-term symptoms. And over 4 million deaths from the virus. (U.S.A. leads the world in virus deaths. Yay, Trump! He did Make America #1 Again!)

Yet "white Christian evangelists" have eagerly denied that the virus was a threat. Do they think it's all a hoax operated by Nancy Pelosi or the Illuminati? Or that it's God's Will — with the dying just sinners and pagans?

Their own parishes have people with Covid-19. Yet when the "preachers" get infected personally, they do a 180-degree turn?

I'd have much more respect for them if they said "God must want me in heaven sooner rather than later. Don't get vaccinated! Follow God's Plan."

My observation is more like: “I’m pretty sure I already had Covid back in last spring so I don’t need no vaccination. Please pray for my wife and daughter who have it now and are hurtin purty bad.” This is not a hypothetical but actually what a relative (by marriage) is saying.

And…some do come out of their near death experiences urging everyone to get vaccinated.

That is rough and it puts REAL immunity from actual covid infections in doubt for no good reason.

"I think I got covid months ago" Fuck off with that wishful thinking bullshit. Get tested for antibodies/t-cells or assume you did not get infected at all.

There is good evidence that infection gives good immunity, but it has to be a real infection with real testing and preferably antibody testing to see that you put up a good response.

If one of the rare vaccine susceptible people who DID have a lab verified covid infection is now lumped in with this chucklehead that would suck. Not everyone who does not get vaccinated is an antivaxxer evil monster.

It is up to us all to anti-lump these situations and people to be able to maintain perspective and nuance.

Some asshole on the other side is an idiot lumper and now you become one as well. The world is going to hell!

 

[crazyfingers]

Back in May when it looked like vaccinations would go smoothly I got tickets for my two boys and me to go see the Dead and Company at the Xfinity Center in Mansfield MA on Sept 2 and 3. 19K capacity.

This is a mostly outside venue but there are still seat assignments. We are in the open air sections. We are vaccinated but my wife might be home from Canada then finally and she has not been able to get the shots in Canada. So she would be vulnerable and we know that there are breakthroughs and none of us want to get it.

There are many outside concerts around Boston this summer. Concerts at Fenway Park and the Xfinity Center. I'm watching the news on anything about the risks.

I am preparing myself that I will probably decide that I need to just eat the $800 I spend on the tickets if I think that I don't want to risk it.

And FUCK the anti-vaxers. Make them stay home.