Day without stupid: redux

[lpetrich]

Truth Details | Truth Social - "NO TAX ON TIPS! DJT"

(Potentially NSFW) Showing a woman wearing a crucifix and a very low-cut dress.

I found that funny because of what the Religious Right thinks about revealing clothing.

 

[Patooka]

Truth Details | Truth Social - "NO TAX ON TIPS! DJT"

(Potentially NSFW) Showing a woman wearing a crucifix and a very low-cut dress.

I found that funny because of what the Religious Right thinks about revealing clothing.

Yeah, but if you squint your eyes the woman looks like Trump's daughter so that's okay then.

 

[zorq]

I'm actually very opposed to this idea of "no tax on tips." The tax system is already too complicated and the reason the rich are able to avoid so much tax obligation is because of stupid loopholes like this.

Also, this would only serve to further cement the tipping culture so popular in North America. Every time I go back to the US I'm reminded how shitty tipping culture is.

Also, the past 8 years have taught me that Christian Republicans don't have any real principals or standards. As is said, if it weren't for double standards, they wouldn't have any at all.

 

[marc]

One commentary I heard said that people who rely on tips don't make enough to get taxed on it anyway. The likely scenario is there will be loopholes like commissions would be considered 'tips', or some other compensation for the wealthy redefined as such.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I thought tips were income.

 

[Shadowy Man]

One commentary I heard said that people who rely on tips don't make enough to get taxed on it anyway. The likely scenario is there will be loopholes like commissions would be considered 'tips', or some other compensation for the wealthy redefined as such.

The Supreme Court has already ruled that bribes of politicians are tips as long as they are given after the political action.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

One commentary I heard said that people who rely on tips don't make enough to get taxed on it anyway. The likely scenario is there will be loopholes like commissions would be considered 'tips', or some other compensation for the wealthy redefined as such.

The Supreme Court has already ruled that bribes of politicians are tips as long as they are given after the political action.

Funny though oversimplified (I'm guilty of that as well with Snyder v US).

Article on Snyder v US and the amazing contortion acts the right-wing on the bench is willing to perform.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I thought tips were income.

They are. It's a politically popular idea to reduce income tax on those with less income (but a lot of the people who would benefit aren't paying much tax anyway) but it's a loophole you could drive a supertanker through--a lot of professional services have relationships where people would likely go along with making part of the payment a tip.

 

[Swammerdami]

American tipping culture is absurd. Most of the rest of the world agrees. Here in Thailand tips are rare. (Exceptions include services for foreigners where Thais wouldn't tip!)

Is it true that robot kiosks now ask for tips when there's no human in sight?

And what about 20% tips at expensive restaurants where the bill is hundreds of dollars? In those cases the waitperson isn't being rewarded for good service, but for the "juice" they had to get the coveted job!

Question: Currently while tips ARE taxed, are employers like restaurants required to track employee tips? Or is it just "guesstimate it on your Form 1040" ?

What about restaurants with mandatory gratuities? Do those "tips" count as Tips?

I thought tips were income.

They are. It's a politically popular idea to reduce income tax on those with less income (but a lot of the people who would benefit aren't paying much tax anyway) but it's a loophole you could drive a supertanker through--a lot of professional services have relationships where people would likely go along with making part of the payment a tip.

Hmmm. I didn't think of that. Gakk! Will tickets to see Taylor Swift now include a mandatory gratuity for the backups and stage-hands?

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Speaking more generally, there are TWO types of policy change:
(1) Comprehensive programs which improve the social and/or financial system. Such changes are difficult, especially in the polarized post-rational Amerika.
(2) Small band-aids to improve things a bit. These can be politically popular.

Often a policy which would be very BAD when part of a major comprehensive reform, is GOOD when applied as a politically palatable band-aid.

And I will go so far as to say Harris-Walz should support whatever policies make their election more likely. Scream "Hypocrisy!" at me as loud as you want -- you'll just be showing your own ignorance. The stakes are too serious and dire for anything but the defeat of Trump and his Fascist allies to be the top priority.

 

[jonatha]

Question: Currently while tips ARE taxed, are employers like restaurants required to track employee tips?

Yes, if they total more than $20 in a month.

 

[Swammerdami]

Question: Currently while tips ARE taxed, are employers like restaurants required to track employee tips?

Yes, if they total more than $20 in a month.

Really? Pardon my French but this is perhaps the most asinine example of the caricature Amerika and its Rich-better-than-Poor mentality that I've ever seen.

Judges and Governors aren't required to report bribes even if in excess of $9 million. Wall St. traders get bonuses of up to $4 million IIRC before certain restrictions kick in.

Yet the lady at the cheapest diner lucky to get 75¢ a day in tips must report that. I clicked jonatha's link and find that that means report to her employer (so he can deduct the 75¢ from her paycheck?) She must report the tip to the IRS no matter how small it is. Elites routinely cheat the government out of billions(?) collectively in SocSec they do NOT deduct for their (often undocumented) servants. Bankers earn billions in bonuses every time the financial system almost collapses and needs a government bail-out. But the gummint sure wants to know about the 75¢ tip that waitress got!

Good grief.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Dude, you are old if a day's worth of tips to you means 75 cents.

This isn't about 75 cent tip days. Tips are income for servers. Servers are legally allowed to be paid less in lieu of the tips. My bonus got taxed (heck my cell phone stipend is taxed), tips can be taxed.

 

[Elixir]

Yet the lady at the cheapest diner lucky to get 75¢ a day in tips must report that.

She still gets the standard deduction ($14,600 for an individual filer).
She will never exceed that; at $.75/day she will have to tighten her belt and pull herself up by her bootstraps.
Maybe she can make herself a new belt out of bootstraps if she can't pull herself up by them.

This economy is WAY sicker than it needs to be.

 

[Swammerdami]

Dude, you are old if a day's worth of tips to you means 75 cents.

This isn't about 75 cent tip days. Tips are income for servers. Servers are legally allowed to be paid less in lieu of the tips. My bonus got taxed (heck my cell phone stipend is taxed), tips can be taxed.

Did you even read the post I responded to? It's the IRS and employer code, not me, that are concerned with tips as low as 75¢ per day. I may be old but even I knew that was ridiculously tiny (Hint: divide $20 by a plausible day-per-month count.)

What did you think "Good grief" meant?

 

[Shadowy Man]

Servers are legally allowed to be paid less in lieu of the tips.

not in California. (And several other states).

 

[Elixir]

Servers are legally allowed to be paid less in lieu of the tips.

not in California. (And several other states).

That’s everything that’s wrong with Santa Monica! You can’t get a decent lunch for under fifty bucks, and then you have to give them a “gratuity”, plus the tax on the gratuity you had to pay, plus the tax THEY have to pay. And what do you get for that?
A pier, an everlasting, wonderful pier.
It’s a wonder that all the people don’t end up sleeping on the sidewalks of San Francisco!

 

[Shadowy Man]

Servers are legally allowed to be paid less in lieu of the tips.

not in California. (And several other states).

That’s everything that’s wrong with Santa Monica! You can’t get a decent lunch for under fifty bucks, and then you have to give them a “gratuity”, plus the tax on the gratuity you had to pay, plus the tax THEY have to pay. And what do you get for that?
A pier, an everlasting, wonderful pier.
It’s a wonder that all the people don’t end up sleeping on the sidewalks of San Francisco!

Why would you sleep in your bathroom?

 

[Elixir]

Why would you sleep in your bathroom?

Too expensive in Santa Monica. Had to leave; too much tax on tips.

 

[thebeave]

Dude, you are old if a day's worth of tips to you means 75 cents.

This isn't about 75 cent tip days. Tips are income for servers. Servers are legally allowed to be paid less in lieu of the tips. My bonus got taxed (heck my cell phone stipend is taxed), tips can be taxed.

Did you even read the post I responded to? It's the IRS and employer code, not me, that are concerned with tips as low as 75¢ per day. I may be old but even I knew that was ridiculously tiny (Hint: divide $20 by a plausible day-per-month count.)

What did you think "Good grief" meant?

Good grief? Speaking of old, I think the last time I heard that phrase being used anywhere was by Charlie Brown in a comic strip from 1966. Back when, you know, tips were like 75 cents per day.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

And what about 20% tips at expensive restaurants where the bill is hundreds of dollars? In those cases the waitperson isn't being rewarded for good service, but for the "juice" they had to get the coveted job!

In such cases they're expected to share it with people like the hostess. And you'll find a much higher ratio of waiters to customers at a high end place.

Question: Currently while tips ARE taxed, are employers like restaurants required to track employee tips? Or is it just "guesstimate it on your Form 1040" ?

What about restaurants with mandatory gratuities? Do those "tips" count as Tips?

Yes, they are reported but obviously with cash and no sharing they have no way of knowing. Mandatory gratuities are still considered tips. AFIAK they are only imposed on groups above a certain size (decided by the place) as otherwise such groups rarely tip as expected.

I thought tips were income.

They are. It's a politically popular idea to reduce income tax on those with less income (but a lot of the people who would benefit aren't paying much tax anyway) but it's a loophole you could drive a supertanker through--a lot of professional services have relationships where people would likely go along with making part of the payment a tip.

Hmmm. I didn't think of that. Gakk! Will tickets to see Taylor Swift now include a mandatory gratuity for the backups and stage-hands?

Actually, I was thinking of things like doctors, lawyers etc. Anything where you are providing labor for the customer is considered a service profession. No idea on the status of performing arts.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Speaking more generally, there are TWO types of policy change:
(1) Comprehensive programs which improve the social and/or financial system. Such changes are difficult, especially in the polarized post-rational Amerika.

Agreed.

(2) Small band-aids to improve things a bit. These can be politically popular.

Often a policy which would be very BAD when part of a major comprehensive reform, is GOOD when applied as a politically palatable band-aid.

And I will go so far as to say Harris-Walz should support whatever policies make their election more likely. Scream "Hypocrisy!" at me as loud as you want -- you'll just be showing your own ignorance. The stakes are too serious and dire for anything but the defeat of Trump and his Fascist allies to be the top priority.

It's not a good band-aid. It's purely playing to the audience. The reality is that most tipped workers aren't paying much income tax in the first place. It's mostly FICA and he hasn't clarified whether that would be owed or not.

Likewise, The Felon's recent proposal to not tax social security benefits. Once again, those without all that much aren't taxed in the first place, the actual benefit falls to those with more. That being said, I would like to see it put back to 50% of the benefits are taxable. In the old days the tax code was pretty good about taxing a dollar exactly once. We have seen more and more examples of playing games with the tax code to raise money without it being a "tax increase". Like taxing I think it's 85% of social security once you're above a certain threshold. 50% of your FICA contribution was taxed, 50% was not. The part that wasn't taxed before should be taxed when paid out.

Donald Trump Now Plans To End Social Security Taxes For Retirees

Donald Trump now plans to end Social Security taxes for retirees, stating on his social media platform that seniors should not carry this burden.

franknez.com