Europe submits voluntarily

[Tammuz]

Germany says migrants/refugees coming to Europe can't choose place to live. Also they say there will be border control for migrants.
I guess German government agrees with me.

According to the UN charter for refugees they're to be granted asylum in the first EU country they report themselves to the authorities in. And then they're not allowed to travel from that country freely. It's weird though how Sweden is more popular than Germany for refugees. I think it's simply about that Sweden is more exotic sounding. Because if I was a refugee I'd go for Germany ever time. Seems awesome.

Let's be honest about that the refugees, while having escaped a brutal war, are by and large not going to have a bright future in Sweden. The majority of them are unemployable. Their children might be better off though, going through our school system and getting to understand our culture. But if they grow up in the slums their attitudes are in large proportions going to be so messed up that it won't help much.

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants. When it comes to integrating low-skilled immigrants, the Anglo-Saxon economic system works much better than the Scandinavian one. Read Why Iranian migrants succeed in the US but fail in Sweden. And among Middle Easterners, Iranians are probably the most successful group in Sweden.

 

[dystopian]

You're forgetting that all Swedish residents get a 15% discount at IKEA stores. That's invaluable when you're a poor refugee looking to furnish an apartment.

Ikea is actually controlled by a Dutch holding company called INGKA Holding, which controls most of the IKEA stores in the world, and which in turn is owned by a Dutch foundation known as Stichting INGKA Foundation, which is actually the largest nonprofit organization in the world (don't ask me how they can be non-profit if they own such a fantastically thriving multinational). The IKEA *trademark* and franchise however, is owned by yet *another* Dutch company called Inter IKEA Systems B.V; which receives 3% of all IKEA revenue in royalties. This company in turn, is owned by Inter IKEA Holding, which is registered in Luxembourg. And then *that* company in turn is owned by the Interogo Foundation which is located in Liechtenstein.

So in conclusion... Dutch people get the discount, and Liechtensteinians get to print Ikea logo's on anything they want?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

You're forgetting that all Swedish residents get a 15% discount at IKEA stores. That's invaluable when you're a poor refugee looking to furnish an apartment.

Ikea is actually controlled by a Dutch holding company called INGKA Holding, which controls most of the IKEA stores in the world, and which in turn is owned by a Dutch foundation known as Stichting INGKA Foundation, which is actually the largest nonprofit organization in the world (don't ask me how they can be non-profit if they own such a fantastically thriving multinational). The IKEA *trademark* and franchise however, is owned by yet *another* Dutch company called Inter IKEA Systems B.V; which receives 3% of all IKEA revenue in royalties. This company in turn, is owned by Inter IKEA Holding, which is registered in Luxembourg. And then *that* company in turn is owned by the Interogo Foundation which is located in Liechtenstein.

So in conclusion... Dutch people get the discount, and Liechtensteinians get to print Ikea logo's on anything they want?

Well, I learned something today. That makes it a good day.

However, my family was also killed in a car accident, which makes it a bad day.

All considered, I guess everything evened out.

 

[Jayjay]

You're forgetting that all Swedish residents get a 15% discount at IKEA stores. That's invaluable when you're a poor refugee looking to furnish an apartment.

Ikea is actually controlled by a Dutch holding company called INGKA Holding, which controls most of the IKEA stores in the world, and which in turn is owned by a Dutch foundation known as Stichting INGKA Foundation, which is actually the largest nonprofit organization in the world (don't ask me how they can be non-profit if they own such a fantastically thriving multinational). The IKEA *trademark* and franchise however, is owned by yet *another* Dutch company called Inter IKEA Systems B.V; which receives 3% of all IKEA revenue in royalties. This company in turn, is owned by Inter IKEA Holding, which is registered in Luxembourg. And then *that* company in turn is owned by the Interogo Foundation which is located in Liechtenstein.

So in conclusion... Dutch people get the discount, and Liechtensteinians get to print Ikea logo's on anything they want?

Welcome to the wonderful world of corporate tax evasion.

 

[DrZoidberg]

There is nothing weird about it. The "refugees" are well aware of Sweden's generous welfare programs.

Tell me more about Sweden's generous welfare system. How much more does an individual (single, no children) who has never worked in the country receive in Sweden than, say, in Austria or Germany, adjusting for the higher price level? How much more does a family (two adults, three children aged 2, 6, and 8) receive?

There's no difference between Sweden and Germany over-all. I'don't much rather be unemployed in Germany than Sweden for instance Sweden is better if you're pregnant. But overall same-same. Central and Northern Europe is all very similar when it comes to welfare.

 

[DrZoidberg]

According to the UN charter for refugees they're to be granted asylum in the first EU country they report themselves to the authorities in. And then they're not allowed to travel from that country freely. It's weird though how Sweden is more popular than Germany for refugees. I think it's simply about that Sweden is more exotic sounding. Because if I was a refugee I'd go for Germany ever time. Seems awesome.

Let's be honest about that the refugees, while having escaped a brutal war, are by and large not going to have a bright future in Sweden. The majority of them are unemployable. Their children might be better off though, going through our school system and getting to understand our culture. But if they grow up in the slums their attitudes are in large proportions going to be so messed up that it won't help much.

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants. When it comes to integrating low-skilled immigrants, the Anglo-Saxon economic system works much better than the Scandinavian one. Read Why Iranian migrants succeed in the US but fail in Sweden. And among Middle Easterners, Iranians are probably the most successful group in Sweden.

You have got to be kidding? The Syrian educational system is good, as well as having emphasised medicine and engineering since the 60'ies. Sweden is in dire need of importing just that type of competence, because Swedish students aren't interested in it. Which is stupid considering Sweden's main industry is high tech. And it's the educated elite that are leaving Syria. Not only are they desirable in Sweden. We need them. Yes, we should welcome them with open arms. They'll start generating big money for Sweden in no time. This is basically Syria giving Sweden free money. We'd have to be fucking stupid not to open our doors wide open.

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants because of systematic racism. Swedes aren't racist as such. But we have lots of tacit social norms, that you have to follow, to get employed here. But we don't tell them. Swedes are generally blind to this. But any Swede who has worked abroad and been around a bit can tell you all about it. I personally have worked with integrating foreign engineers into Swedish teams... from all over. So I'm an expert in just this. But I can tell you, that if you tell the immigrants how it works here they'll figure it out in no time. But usually we don't.

The problem is that Swedes generally don't understand that Sweden has a weird culture. We think that the Swedish way is normal, and assume immigrants will follow our customs. But without us having to tell them. Well... no shit that fails. And it's not hard to integrate people.

In USA and England people will straight up tell people how they need to behave in companies. Norms are openly stated and followed up. It's constantly re-enforced. In Sweden, hardly anyone every tells anybody anything on how to behave. You're just supposed to get it anyway. It's bizarre that we think that it'll work. Which it doesn't.

Anyhoo.. I've held lecture on this and have helped several major Swedish companies with integrating the off-shore staff. Sweden is so bad at this it's not even funny. The problem is not the immigrants. The problem is Sweden. And the solution is obvious. If we let enough immigrants in it'll change the Swedish culture from this inbred mono-culture to one that is a bit more multi-cultural and... well... frankly... useful in our modern interconnected world. This will be good for us, and especially our economy. People who think that it's a cost to allow Syrian refugees to settle here are morons. It's free money.

 

[whichphilosophy]

While I am generally against mass immigration and cautious with asylum seekers, this whole situation was instigated but the US and some of its European poodles to bring about regime change. The package involved mass destruction, death and injury which are ongoing even now.

Well, I'll be the contrarian here. Though it's fashionable to blame the West, and in particular the US, for every bad thing that happened ever, using the Syrian crisis to guilt trip the West is a bit tenuous. Modern Syria has been a power keg since it's formation. The majority Sunni Arab population has never quite accepted rule by a non-Sunni Arab political class. Assad, and his Alawite religious brethren, are apostates worthy of death. This religious hatred did not spring anew with the invasion of Iraq, it has been there pretty much forever. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Hama_Islamic_uprising

Europeans, and the West, should quit playing the fool.

Actually before we intervened in Iraq, Syria, and Libya the dictators kept their countries in order and there was no turmoil. We removed the leaders and that left a vacuum for the rats to infest the area.
True there was religious hatred, but at least these dictators kept a lid on it.

Look at the mess in Iraq. The USA is at fault. Blair poodled up to trot behind Bush and supplied some troops along with others. In fact the Americans could have retained the Iraqi army under newly appointed generals etc to keep the mobs in order.

There have been fanatics in the area long before these wars. However the sequence of events leading up to the growth of ISIS stems from our interference in the region.

 

[barbos]

Let's be honest about that the refugees, while having escaped a brutal war, are by and large not going to have a bright future in Sweden. The majority of them are unemployable. Their children might be better off though, going through our school system and getting to understand our culture. But if they grow up in the slums their attitudes are in large proportions going to be so messed up that it won't help much.

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants. When it comes to integrating low-skilled immigrants, the Anglo-Saxon economic system works much better than the Scandinavian one. Read Why Iranian migrants succeed in the US but fail in Sweden. And among Middle Easterners, Iranians are probably the most successful group in Sweden.

You have got to be kidding? The Syrian educational system is good, as well as having emphasised medicine and engineering since the 60'ies.

How do you know that?
My anecdotal experience does say that arabs are heavily tilted toward engineering. I mean I have not seen any arabs in more less pure science and there were shitload of them (including professors) in engineering departments, don't know how good they were though. My theory is that they don't consider pure science financially viable occupation in their countries, and I can see why.
Also, I think you are mistaken if you think that all these 200K refugees are engineers
It is true that Western higher education is seriously overrated, but to say that Syrian educational system is particularly good is a bit exaggeration.

 

[barbos]

Speaking of refugees and Europeans:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tish-hostages-online.html?ito=social-facebook

 

[Tammuz]

You have got to be kidding? The Syrian educational system is good, as well as having emphasised medicine and engineering since the 60'ies. Sweden is in dire need of importing just that type of competence, because Swedish students aren't interested in it. Which is stupid considering Sweden's main industry is high tech. And it's the educated elite that are leaving Syria. Not only are they desirable in Sweden. We need them. Yes, we should welcome them with open arms. They'll start generating big money for Sweden in no time. This is basically Syria giving Sweden free money. We'd have to be fucking stupid not to open our doors wide open.

About 10% of Syrian refugees in Sweden have a three-year (or more) post-high school education. 30% of Syrians in Sweden have some sort of education after high school. But that's not the same as a degree. The media has dishonestly been presenting it like that, and you believed it without checking your facts.

39% percent of Syrians in Sweden have not even high school education.

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants because of systematic racism. Swedes aren't racist as such. But we have lots of tacit social norms, that you have to follow, to get employed here. But we don't tell them. Swedes are generally blind to this. But any Swede who has worked abroad and been around a bit can tell you all about it. I personally have worked with integrating foreign engineers into Swedish teams... from all over. So I'm an expert in just this. But I can tell you, that if you tell the immigrants how it works here they'll figure it out in no time. But usually we don't.

Having social norms is not racism. Every society has it. That you think it is racist... you have been drinking so much kool aid!

Lots of immigrants have little education (see the numbers in the link), and there are very few low-paid jobs in Sweden.

The problem is that Swedes generally don't understand that Sweden has a weird culture. We think that the Swedish way is normal, and assume immigrants will follow our customs. But without us having to tell them. Well... no shit that fails. And it's not hard to integrate people.

In USA and England people will straight up tell people how they need to behave in companies. Norms are openly stated and followed up. It's constantly re-enforced. In Sweden, hardly anyone every tells anybody anything on how to behave. You're just supposed to get it anyway. It's bizarre that we think that it'll work. Which it doesn't.

Every society has its tacit norms.

Anyhoo.. I've held lecture on this and have helped several major Swedish companies with integrating the off-shore staff. Sweden is so bad at this it's not even funny. The problem is not the immigrants. The problem is Sweden. And the solution is obvious. If we let enough immigrants in it'll change the Swedish culture from this inbred mono-culture to one that is a bit more multi-cultural and... well... frankly... useful in our modern interconnected world. This will be good for us, and especially our economy. People who think that it's a cost to allow Syrian refugees to settle here are morons. It's free money.

You are clueless. Swedish companies are among the most well-managed in the world. And we have one of the lowest corruption levels in the world. Not the case with the Middle East.

If Sweden became culturally more like the Middle East, do you seriously think it would be better? Crazily religious, authoritarian regimes, endemic corruption. Yes, will surely make for a better country...

Lots of people in the Middle East want to leave it, even without war. Yet you advocate making our country more like it. You are clueless. You should be happy to be born in one of the best countries in the world, and not dismiss it as "Inbred mono-culture" like a spoiled child.

Also, do you live in one of our immigrant-dominated areas? You could alos try to leave for a Middle Eastern country (lots of people will want to switch place with you). The law doesn't stop anyone from leaving Sweden.

- - - Updated - - -

You have got to be kidding? The Syrian educational system is good, as well as having emphasised medicine and engineering since the 60'ies. Sweden is in dire need of importing just that type of competence, because Swedish students aren't interested in it. Which is stupid considering Sweden's main industry is high tech. And it's the educated elite that are leaving Syria. Not only are they desirable in Sweden. We need them. Yes, we should welcome them with open arms. They'll start generating big money for Sweden in no time. This is basically Syria giving Sweden free money. We'd have to be fucking stupid not to open our doors wide open.

About 10% of Syrian refugees in Sweden have a three-year (or more) post-high school education. 30% of Syrians in Sweden have some sort of education after high school. But that's not the same as a degree. The media has dishonestly been presenting it like that, and you believed it without checking your facts.

39% percent of Syrians in Sweden have not even high school education.

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants because of systematic racism. Swedes aren't racist as such. But we have lots of tacit social norms, that you have to follow, to get employed here. But we don't tell them. Swedes are generally blind to this. But any Swede who has worked abroad and been around a bit can tell you all about it. I personally have worked with integrating foreign engineers into Swedish teams... from all over. So I'm an expert in just this. But I can tell you, that if you tell the immigrants how it works here they'll figure it out in no time. But usually we don't.

Having social norms is not racism. Every society has it. That you think it is racist... you have been drinking so much kool aid!

Lots of immigrants have little education (see the numbers in the link), and there are very few low-paid jobs in Sweden.

The problem is that Swedes generally don't understand that Sweden has a weird culture. We think that the Swedish way is normal, and assume immigrants will follow our customs. But without us having to tell them. Well... no shit that fails. And it's not hard to integrate people.

In USA and England people will straight up tell people how they need to behave in companies. Norms are openly stated and followed up. It's constantly re-enforced. In Sweden, hardly anyone every tells anybody anything on how to behave. You're just supposed to get it anyway. It's bizarre that we think that it'll work. Which it doesn't.

Every society has its tacit norms.

Anyhoo.. I've held lecture on this and have helped several major Swedish companies with integrating the off-shore staff. Sweden is so bad at this it's not even funny. The problem is not the immigrants. The problem is Sweden. And the solution is obvious. If we let enough immigrants in it'll change the Swedish culture from this inbred mono-culture to one that is a bit more multi-cultural and... well... frankly... useful in our modern interconnected world. This will be good for us, and especially our economy. People who think that it's a cost to allow Syrian refugees to settle here are morons. It's free money.

You are clueless. Swedish companies are among the most well-managed in the world. And we have one of the lowest corruption levels in the world. Not the case with the Middle East.

If Sweden became culturally more like the Middle East, do you seriously think it would be better? Crazily religious, authoritarian regimes, endemic corruption. Yes, will surely make for a better country...

Lots of people in the Middle East want to leave it, even without war. Yet you advocate making our country more like it. You are clueless. You should be happy to be born in one of the best countries in the world, and not dismiss it as "Inbred mono-culture" like a spoiled child.

Also, do you live in one of our immigrant-dominated areas? You could alos try to leave for a Middle Eastern country (lots of people will want to switch place with you). The law doesn't stop anyone from leaving Sweden.

- - - Updated - - -

Actually before we intervened in Iraq, Syria, and Libya the dictators kept their countries in order and there was no turmoil. We removed the leaders and that left a vacuum for the rats to infest the area.

The West can't be blamed for the chaos in Syria. It's due to that merderous maniac named Assad.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Well, I'll be the contrarian here. Though it's fashionable to blame the West, and in particular the US, for every bad thing that happened ever, using the Syrian crisis to guilt trip the West is a bit tenuous. Modern Syria has been a power keg since it's formation. The majority Sunni Arab population has never quite accepted rule by a non-Sunni Arab political class. Assad, and his Alawite religious brethren, are apostates worthy of death. This religious hatred did not spring anew with the invasion of Iraq, it has been there pretty much forever. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Hama_Islamic_uprising

Europeans, and the West, should quit playing the fool.

Actually before we intervened in Iraq, Syria, and Libya the dictators kept their countries in order and there was no turmoil. We removed the leaders and that left a vacuum for the rats to infest the area.
True there was religious hatred, but at least these dictators kept a lid on it.

Look at the mess in Iraq. The USA is at fault. Blair poodled up to trot behind Bush and supplied some troops along with others. In fact the Americans could have retained the Iraqi army under newly appointed generals etc to keep the mobs in order.

There have been fanatics in the area long before these wars. However the sequence of events leading up to the growth of ISIS stems from our interference in the region.

I'd blame these three, in order of guilt:

1) The geography itself
2) The Ottoman Empire
3) The French

Explanation: The Middle-East is incredibly complicated and goes back... way back. Firstly... the location. The Middle-East is in between everything, which means that any Empire wishing to expand will eventually end up blasting through the Levant into wherever they are going. This has created an absurdly fractured ethnic make-up unparalleled anywhere else. There is no other place on Earth that is as ethnically diverse than the Middle-East. Every little ethnic group in the Middle-East all descend from some elite of one imperial dynasty or another.

Not to go too far back, but when the Ottoman empire first conquered the Middle-East they were first liberal, and the most glorious empire of the world. And then as the empire turned into a standard dynastic kingdom it fell into the same old destructive patterns of any feudal kingdom, playing out ethnic groups against each other to keep the ruling elite in power. The Ottomans kept the Middle-East backward, which meant that when they started to modernize in the 19'th century it all came as a great shock to them ripping the empire apart, quite literally. It culminated in the fall of the empire in 1922.

At that point they had centuries of neglect and infected conflicts to sort out. Not made any easier due to the fractured ethnic make-up of the empire. The colonial rulers had no clue what to do with it and didn't care about the sensibilities of the people they ruled. They ended up antagonising everybody. Each colonial power used one ethnic group within the country as their pawns to control it. The French in Syria used the Alawites. When Syria gained independence the Alawites were well situated to grab power. With they did.

In reality the Alawite take-over I think should be seen as just an extension of French rule. The fact that Alawites are native to Syria, I don't think matters a damn. It's still in minority dominating a vast majority using terror.

So even if the French deserves a lot of the blame, it's not like they came to a pristine and virgin Garden of Eden devoid of conflict. The French took over a volcano on the brink of eruption. The French just put a lid on it, as well as the Assad regime. And as long as Assad stays in power they are never going to sort out their ethnic conflicts. And just like the Ottomans before them, they're actively encouraging ethnic conflicts to keep themselves in power. Saying that they keep things in order is like saying that at least people with the flu aren't causing trouble because they're too sick.

I think Syria needs to be broken up into little bits. I think that's the only viable way to go. Whether it'll lead to peace is anyone's guess. But I think it's a necessary first step before that region will ever see peace. But Turkey is a major obstacle to that. They're afraid of the bit that will become Kurdistan.

 

[whichphilosophy]

The West can't be blamed for the chaos in Syria. It's due to that merderous maniac named Assad.

Yes it can by funding the Free Syrian Army

Not only that some of the funding ended up in Salfist hands and with ISIS
http://yalibnan.com/2012/07/28/us-authorizes-financial-support-to-free-syrian-army/

http://www.ibtimes.com/us-funds-trains-arms-moderate-opposition-syria-who-are-rebels-1685180
FSA rebels have for months now asked the U.S. to ramp up its support for them, claiming the weapons it possesses are no match against Assad's military forces. In May, the FSA lost control of Homs, once known as the "heart of the revolution" and one of the opposition's main strongholds


See also http://iainews.iai.tv/articles/geor...uspension-of-non-lethal-aid-to-syria-auid-293

 

[DrZoidberg]

About 10% of Syrian refugees in Sweden have a three-year (or more) post-high school education. 30% of Syrians in Sweden have some sort of education after high school. But that's not the same as a degree. The media has dishonestly been presenting it like that, and you believed it without checking your facts.

39% percent of Syrians in Sweden have not even high school education.

How about reading your own numbers and analysing them a bit? The Syrians are doing fine educationally. They do less arts and gender studies. They're good at maths!

Sweden sucks at integrating immigrants because of systematic racism. Swedes aren't racist as such. But we have lots of tacit social norms, that you have to follow, to get employed here. But we don't tell them. Swedes are generally blind to this. But any Swede who has worked abroad and been around a bit can tell you all about it. I personally have worked with integrating foreign engineers into Swedish teams... from all over. So I'm an expert in just this. But I can tell you, that if you tell the immigrants how it works here they'll figure it out in no time. But usually we don't.

Having social norms is not racism. Every society has it. That you think it is racist... you have been drinking so much kool aid!

I don't think having norms is racist. I think you're misunderstanding what I'm writing on purpose. Nobody is this stupid and/or bad at reading.

Lots of immigrants have little education (see the numbers in the link), and there are very few low-paid jobs in Sweden.

So what? It would be immoral to only let in the refugees that are well educated. They're refugees. They're NOT migrants.

The problem is that Swedes generally don't understand that Sweden has a weird culture. We think that the Swedish way is normal, and assume immigrants will follow our customs. But without us having to tell them. Well... no shit that fails. And it's not hard to integrate people.

In USA and England people will straight up tell people how they need to behave in companies. Norms are openly stated and followed up. It's constantly re-enforced. In Sweden, hardly anyone every tells anybody anything on how to behave. You're just supposed to get it anyway. It's bizarre that we think that it'll work. Which it doesn't.

Every society has its tacit norms.

Yes. But Sweden has taken this to an entirely different level. We don't demonstrate through disapproval when a foreigner is breaking taboos. We have no cultural way of informing others when they fuck up. Sweden really is very extreme. I think it's us an Japan who are on par as being as unhelpful to foreigners. But no culture is less impenetrable than the Swedish culture, simply down to tacit norms.

Anyhoo.. I've held lecture on this and have helped several major Swedish companies with integrating the off-shore staff. Sweden is so bad at this it's not even funny. The problem is not the immigrants. The problem is Sweden. And the solution is obvious. If we let enough immigrants in it'll change the Swedish culture from this inbred mono-culture to one that is a bit more multi-cultural and... well... frankly... useful in our modern interconnected world. This will be good for us, and especially our economy. People who think that it's a cost to allow Syrian refugees to settle here are morons. It's free money.

You are clueless. Swedish companies are among the most well-managed in the world.

It's not because of our culture. It's in spite of it.

And we have one of the lowest corruption levels in the world. Not the case with the Middle East.

And why do you think this is?

If Sweden became culturally more like the Middle East, do you seriously think it would be better? Crazily religious, authoritarian regimes, endemic corruption. Yes, will surely make for a better country...

I don't want Sweden to become culturally more like the Middle-East. I want it to become more multi-cultural.

There's lots of things that are bad about Arab culture. No culture is perfect. That's why it's in everybody's interest to mix cultures as much as possible. It causes us to constantly re-evaluate our own cultural norms. The more we do this the better. It makes us much better communicators. It makes us more humble, and better people generally... regardless of which culture we started out from.

BTW, their authoritarian regimes are not the result of their culture. It's the result of various historic factors. Religious militancy is the result of general instability. In stable and secure regions there's less militant religion.

Lots of people in the Middle East want to leave it, even without war. Yet you advocate making our country more like it. You are clueless. You should be happy to be born in one of the best countries in the world, and not dismiss it as "Inbred mono-culture" like a spoiled child.

Also, do you live in one of our immigrant-dominated areas? You could alos try to leave for a Middle Eastern country (lots of people will want to switch place with you). The law doesn't stop anyone from leaving Sweden.

I'm a cosmopolitan. I really don't care about nations. I've never been a patriot for anyone or anything. I think it is silly. I've travelled widely and worked all over. I enjoy it.

I do not live in an immigrant-dominated area. I'm upper middle class, and have always been. I have left Sweden, and come back again. I work in IT. It's the same kind of work all over the world. I only stay here because of family.

Like I said, I am an expert at leading cross-cultural teams of engineers. I can integrate any team with any members from anywhere on the planet in no time. I'm actually good at it. I can personally happily live anywhere on the planet. I enjoy the fact that cultures are different. I find cultural difference stimulating. Once you figure out how each culture works they're all the same... in my experience. All humans have the same basic needs. People only behave badly when communication breaks down.

 

[maxparrish]

Immigrants are one of major causes of the decline Swedish school performance. Swedes are not doing themselves any "favors" by importing people of lesser abilities, skills, and knowledge.

Why, then, are Swedish schools struggling? There are many hypotheses floating around, some more plausible than others. Yet there has been no hard evidence for any of them. Until now.

Two weeks ago, I published a paper at the Research Institute of Industrial Economics and an op-ed in the largest Swedish daily about the impact of immigration on Sweden’s Pisa scores. Quite a row followed. Why? Well, it turns out that the change in pupil demographics due to immigration explains almost a third of the average decline between 2000 and 2012: 19 per cent in mathematical literacy, 28 per cent in reading literacy, and 41 per cent in scientific literacy. The effect is especially pronounced in recent years, coinciding with accelerating refugee immigration. Indeed, between 2009 and 2012, 43 per cent of the average Pisa score decline is explained by altered demographics: a full 29 per cent in mathematical literacy, 45 per cent in reading literacy, and 62 per cent in scientific literacy.

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/gabrie...gration-helps-explain-swedens-school-trouble/

 

[maxparrish]

Staggering rape and assault rape statistics from Sweden from 1985-89 and 1997-2001. Rape committed by Swedish born rapists (blue) were 22.4%. Foreign rapists represent 77.6% of all figures divided into ‘normal’ representation (pink) at 665; over representation (red) at 3,752 rape cases; unregistered migrants (orange) at 653 rape cases. Note that the blue bracket of Swedish rapists include foreign born persons with Swedish citizenship as the statistics are only counted on citizenship, and not nationality.

https://themuslimissue.wordpress.co...uslims-commit-nearly-77-6-of-all-rape-crimes/

Isn't "multiculturalism" great or what?

 

[Jayjay]

The West can't be blamed for the chaos in Syria. It's due to that merderous maniac named Assad.

Yes it can by funding the Free Syrian Army

Not only that some of the funding ended up in Salfist hands and with ISIS
http://yalibnan.com/2012/07/28/us-authorizes-financial-support-to-free-syrian-army/

http://www.ibtimes.com/us-funds-trains-arms-moderate-opposition-syria-who-are-rebels-1685180
FSA rebels have for months now asked the U.S. to ramp up its support for them, claiming the weapons it possesses are no match against Assad's military forces. In May, the FSA lost control of Homs, once known as the "heart of the revolution" and one of the opposition's main strongholds


See also http://iainews.iai.tv/articles/geor...uspension-of-non-lethal-aid-to-syria-auid-293

So which one is it? Is the West to blame for funding the rebels, or for not funding them enough?

In any case, Assad's campaign started before the West had anything to do with it. The sunnis would have fought back anyway.

 

[Jayjay]

Like I said, I am an expert at leading cross-cultural teams of engineers. I can integrate any team with any members from anywhere on the planet in no time. I'm actually good at it. I can personally happily live anywhere on the planet. I enjoy the fact that cultures are different. I find cultural difference stimulating. Once you figure out how each culture works they're all the same... in my experience. All humans have the same basic needs. People only behave badly when communication breaks down.

While I appreciate your point of view, as an engineer myself, I think that the global corporate engineering culture is something that might give you (and myself) a blind spot when it comes to understanding how hard it is to integrate other types of people in a society. What you seem to be doing is taking competent engineers who already have useful skills and jobs, and make them work better together... but the problem on national scale in Sweden and other EU countries right now is how to utilize the talents of people who have rather modest education, poor language skills, are deeply religious, come with a lot of baggage from traumatic experiences of war and living in camps, and are high risk of beign marginalized in society.

 

[maxparrish]

I can personally happily live anywhere on the planet. I enjoy the fact that cultures are different. I find cultural difference stimulating. Once you figure out how each culture works they're all the same... in my experience. All humans have the same basic needs. People only behave badly when communication breaks down.

So you don't care if you live in Syria, North Korea or Canada - its all the same to you, right? Do you find it "stimulating" that the basic needs of violent, rowdy immigrant “youths” were to riot in Stockholm for five nights? Or that in 2010, a Muslim suicide bomber struck Stockholm, and in Malmo, firemen needed police protection to fight fires in Muslim neighborhoods?

Or perhaps its the raging anti-semitism against Jews, or that it take 6-8 years before they get a job, or does one ignore that multi-cultural aspect of a utopia ?

 

[whichphilosophy]

Yes it can by funding the Free Syrian Army

Not only that some of the funding ended up in Salfist hands and with ISIS
http://yalibnan.com/2012/07/28/us-authorizes-financial-support-to-free-syrian-army/

http://www.ibtimes.com/us-funds-trains-arms-moderate-opposition-syria-who-are-rebels-1685180
FSA rebels have for months now asked the U.S. to ramp up its support for them, claiming the weapons it possesses are no match against Assad's military forces. In May, the FSA lost control of Homs, once known as the "heart of the revolution" and one of the opposition's main strongholds


See also http://iainews.iai.tv/articles/geor...uspension-of-non-lethal-aid-to-syria-auid-293

So which one is it? Is the West to blame for funding the rebels, or for not funding them enough?

In any case, Assad's campaign started before the West had anything to do with it. The sunnis would have fought back anyway.

No the Free Syrian Army was funded by the West. Before that there was very little. Some are attacking Syria from Iraq, another US mess.
Now as a result hundreds of thousands are pouring into Europe. Following them are waves of economic migrants.
European governments are not dealing with the problem.
Syria is now a fragmented country that is worse off than before. Now that Gadaffi is gone Libya is now a route for illegals
I guess the hundreds of thousands of civilians caught in the cross fire are collateral damage.

 

[Jayjay]

So which one is it? Is the West to blame for funding the rebels, or for not funding them enough?

In any case, Assad's campaign started before the West had anything to do with it. The sunnis would have fought back anyway.

No the Free Syrian Army was funded by the West. Before that there was very little. Some are attacking Syria from Iraq, another US mess.
Now as a result hundreds of thousands are pouring into Europe. Following them are waves of economic migrants.
European governments are not dealing with the problem.
Syria is now a fragmented country that is worse off than before. Now that Gadaffi is gone Libya is now a route for illegals
I guess the hundreds of thousands of civilians caught in the cross fire are collateral damage.

But what does that have to do with the West? Syria and Libya are a mess because of Assad and Gaddafi respectively. The western aid to the rebels in either country was rather modest and only happened after the situations had reached point of no return, and the mess is largely the failure of Syrian and Libyan people to pull together. You might as well blame WW2 on the guy who shot arch duke Ferdinand.

As odd as it may sound, Europe and US are not automatically responsible for everything bad that happens in the world.