Europe submits voluntarily

[whichphilosophy]

The problem with this discussion growing to more than 4500 comments and clever meme pictures is that it will never come to a resolution here because of one simple truth, everyone is right.

• Yes, Islam is a barbaric religion preaching violence toward and intolerance for other religions and cultures. A few are
• Yes, 99.9% of Muslims don't commit terrorist acts because Islam preaches peace and tolerance of other religions. Certainly the vast majority but not sure if it is that figure
• Yes, moderate Muslims must do more to reduce the number of terrorist attacks committed by Muslim extremists.Yes where they are aware of it. All citizens must
• Yes, the vast majority of terror attacks in Europe and North America are committed by Muslims.Yes
• Yes, the problem is with radical Islam. Yes
• Yes, the problem is with fundamentalism in the Muslim religion because fundamentalism in any religion or belief system creates problems.Yes
• Yes, the FBI and European security agencies include some bank robberies and crimes against property as terrorism. True
• Yes, murder is a much more serious matter than bank robberies and vandalism. True
• Yes, moderate Muslims are responsible for the majority of the tips to the police that have prevented radical Islamic terrorist attacks.True
• Yes, the right amps up the threat of terrorism because fear generates more conservatives. The ultra right does. There is a problem and we must recognize it
• Yes, the left minimizes the role of Islam as the motivation for the terrorism because of an undying, disproportionate and frankly tiresome dedication to multiculturalism. Multiculturalism worked ok as far as mainly orthodox Jews and Chinese worked where the parties had respect for each others identity. The left tends to be naive on this problem.
• Yes, Europe and North America have never been safer from crime and violence than they are now. With respect to terrorism this does not appear to be the case.
• Yes, border control and airport security are there to make the public feel more secure, they are largely incapable of stopping attacks from dedicated terrorists. As there is virtually no border security within the EU this would not apply Terrorists entering the UK won't carry evidence that they are. Sometimes they are able to be identified as they are on a watch list
• Yes, allowing for more migration of Muslims increases the odds of admitting Muslim terrorists. Yes
• Yes, refusing to accept Muslim refugees, especially women, children and the elderly, because of the actions of the few is inhumane.
• Yes, the US suffers more from its dedication to gun rights in a year than it does in a decade from terrorist attacks. Putting it like that more people die per year from routine medical treatment gone wrong.
• Yes, both sides are mired in self-righteousness and hypocrisy.

Only a few may be that way
The bottom line is we have this problem of radical fundamentalist Islamic terrorism and that we must deal with it. Yes

We must surrender some of our freedoms and rights to allow the police to root out the terrorists. Providing these are effective means of rooting them out.

But more than anything else we must prevent the terrorists from getting what they want. They want us to be afraid and they want us to overreact to the terrorism. As this thread amply proves, so far the terrorists are getting exactly what they want. There is overall no over reaction though there are some fear mongers. One should always be alert and expect the unexpected. Anything is weapon from a pen to a truck or a plane.

And I don't want to be accused of false equivalence or saying that both sides do it equally. The right is much more guilty of giving the terrorists what they want. Refer to the orange clown for proof of this. Trump is reducing the impact of the right's inbred racism by ramping up their xenophobia.

Not to that extreme. There are some fanatics who are already over excited. However it's not xenophobia to restrict illegal immigration. I understand Trump does not object to those who enter legally.

 

[angelo]

They practically all follow the barbaric death cult of islam!

How many of the terrorists came into Europe disguised as refugees fleeing the Syrian Civil War?

Does it really matter how many ? They follow the terrorist, paedophilic prophet Muhammad who teaches through the Koran and hadiths to fight infidels wherever they find them! They are not to befriend Kafirs. They fail to assimilate and terrorism of this kind was unheard of before these hordes invaded Europe. Isn't that enough reason to stop it now before it truly gets out of hand?

 

[whichphilosophy]

View attachment 7618

now Europe needs to worry about Islamic roots...

The Jews were no problem but an asset (blamed for their success) but were the others which were purged during the Spanish inquisition. Joseph de Maistre by today's standards would be a religious fanatic who believed in the full authority of the Pope. It introduced some executions imprisonment, censorship of books and forced conversion which is similar to the Islamic fanatics.

In the view below it seems that getting rid of the Jews seems to have backfired.

http://atheistscholar.org/WorldHistory/TheInquisition.aspx

Spain lost international and sophisticated expertise when the Jews were expelled. Even with American profits, Spain became less prosperous.

 

[repoman]

 

[Trausti]

Brilliant.

 

[angelo]

View attachment 7618

now Europe needs to worry about Islamic roots...

The Jews were no problem but an asset (blamed for their success) but were the others which were purged during the Spanish inquisition. Joseph de Maistre by today's standards would be a religious fanatic who believed in the full authority of the Pope. It introduced some executions imprisonment, censorship of books and forced conversion which is similar to the Islamic fanatics.

In the view below it seems that getting rid of the Jews seems to have backfired.

http://atheistscholar.org/WorldHistory/TheInquisition.aspx

Spain lost international and sophisticated expertise when the Jews were expelled. Even with American profits, Spain became less prosperous.

The Jews, although few in numbers, have contributed to the world much more than any other people in history. Imagine how much more the contribution may have been had they not been persecuted throughout history, and especially in Nazi Germany.

 

[bigfield]

The Jews, although few in numbers, have contributed to the world much more than any other people in history. Imagine how much more the contribution may have been had they not been persecuted throughout history, and especially in Nazi Germany.

It's possible that the persecution gave rise to a Jewish culture of exceptional intellectual achievement. The world is fucked-up like that.

 

[whichphilosophy]

The Jews were no problem but an asset (blamed for their success) but were the others which were purged during the Spanish inquisition. Joseph de Maistre by today's standards would be a religious fanatic who believed in the full authority of the Pope. It introduced some executions imprisonment, censorship of books and forced conversion which is similar to the Islamic fanatics.

In the view below it seems that getting rid of the Jews seems to have backfired.

http://atheistscholar.org/WorldHistory/TheInquisition.aspx

Spain lost international and sophisticated expertise when the Jews were expelled. Even with American profits, Spain became less prosperous.

The Jews, although few in numbers, have contributed to the world much more than any other people in history. Imagine how much more the contribution may have been had they not been persecuted throughout history, and especially in Nazi Germany.

This is true, and often many conspiracy theories blamed them for their successes. Perhaps some of this is also continuing from the Christians blaming them for the death of Christ (if such a person existed). Throughout history Jews were taxed, imprisoned, expelled, forced to convert and still they came up shining. Something in their will to survive as Jews helped this. However there are a lot of non practicing Jews who are also high achievers.

In Germany there were many war heroes from WWI, plus others who despite Germany's poverty in the 1920s and 1930s still managed to survive and had wealth. They were a convenient scapegoat for the Nazis.

There were many partial Jewish Germans (half and quarter) who fought for the German forces as they had integrated hundreds of years ago. Some but not all were removed from the forces. Surprisingly there are estimates of 100,000 or even more who did so.

Goring's own deputy Erlich Milch had a Jewish parent. He was convicted of war crimes.

Here's a real joke. Werner Goldberg who appeared in the Nazi press as an ideal pin up boy for the Wehrmacht and featured on recruitment posters, until it was discovered that his father was Jewish.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werner_Goldberg#/media/File:WernerGoldberg.jpg

I guess now the Jews can now be scapegoated for the rise of Nazism as part of another conspiracy theory.

 

[angelo]

Germany: “Because I am a Muslim”: Media cover-up as Afghan smashes up church
JULY 30, 2016 8:18 PM BY ROBERT SPENCER 31 COMMENTS

And the first thing Western leaders will say is, “No, you did not actually do this because you’re a Muslim. You did this because you’re poor, or disenfranchised, or discriminated against. We need to give you a job and some cash, and all will be well.”

The second thing they will say is, “More migrants. Bring us more!” The mainstream media, by covering up such incidents, aids in the migrant importation enterprise by keeping the public as ignorant as possible about the devastation the Muslim migrants are causing.

Because I am Muslim

“‘Because I am a Muslim’: Media cover-up in Germany as Afghan smashes up church,” Diversity Macht Frei, July 29, 2016:

It happened a week ago, but the police kept quiet about the incident and the church management did not file a complaint, it has only just come out: last Friday a 19-year-old Afghan stormed into the Versöhnungskirche [Church of Reconciliation] at around 7.20 pm in an open community evening in the Eilbek district of Hamburg. He threw chairs and benches around, kicked over a Bible stand, splintered the glass and threw hymn books onto the ground. According to an eye-witness, the church-goes present were very afraid and let him continue his destruction. No wonder, he was wearing swirling Islamic dress, which might have hidden a suicide belt.

The Muslim did not speak during his destructive rage and also had no connections to Salafists, therefore the State Protection department of the state criminal prosecution agency assumes there was no “Islamist” motive.

…Eyewitness Peter H, who sent PI the photo of the Afghan attacker, reports that he asked the Muslim in front of the church why he had done it as he ended his affray. The Afghan then screamed the answer: “Because I am a Muslim!”

 

[repoman]

Remove Kebab

I've been on /pol/ too much recently...

 

[angelo]

One Day soon, that tree will grow enough to a height where it will hang Europe, thanks be to so called Western leaders such as Merkel and the head in the sand politicos in Brussels.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Germany: “Because I am a Muslim”: Media cover-up as Afghan smashes up church
JULY 30, 2016 8:18 PM BY ROBERT SPENCER 31 COMMENTS

And the first thing Western leaders will say is, “No, you did not actually do this because you’re a Muslim. You did this because you’re poor, or disenfranchised, or discriminated against. We need to give you a job and some cash, and all will be well.”

The second thing they will say is, “More migrants. Bring us more!” The mainstream media, by covering up such incidents, aids in the migrant importation enterprise by keeping the public as ignorant as possible about the devastation the Muslim migrants are causing.

Because I am Muslim

“‘Because I am a Muslim’: Media cover-up in Germany as Afghan smashes up church,” Diversity Macht Frei, July 29, 2016:

It happened a week ago, but the police kept quiet about the incident and the church management did not file a complaint, it has only just come out: last Friday a 19-year-old Afghan stormed into the Versöhnungskirche [Church of Reconciliation] at around 7.20 pm in an open community evening in the Eilbek district of Hamburg. He threw chairs and benches around, kicked over a Bible stand, splintered the glass and threw hymn books onto the ground. According to an eye-witness, the church-goes present were very afraid and let him continue his destruction. No wonder, he was wearing swirling Islamic dress, which might have hidden a suicide belt.

The Muslim did not speak during his destructive rage and also had no connections to Salafists, therefore the State Protection department of the state criminal prosecution agency assumes there was no “Islamist” motive.

…Eyewitness Peter H, who sent PI the photo of the Afghan attacker, reports that he asked the Muslim in front of the church why he had done it as he ended his affray. The Afghan then screamed the answer: “Because I am a Muslim!”

In some countries it is automatic deportation and possible imprisonment before.
Due to EU laws which circumvented English ones it took the UK authorities 8 years to deport the terrorist ( Hook) Hamza because of EU regulations which take precedence of English laws.

He left behind a huge family who continue to draw welfare/
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/abu-hamza-deported-from-uk-after-1363430

In Middle Eastern countries, if someone breaks laws and they are not a citizen they get a bum's rush or prison then a bum's rush. They don't care if the host country doesn't want them back.
In the UAE and Qatar where I've worked in the past, if a guest of mine as a visitor broke the law, I would also have been kicked out with them.

In countries like Afghanistan, a person would not be alive if he ransacks a local mosque, unless he has a few gunmen with him. Laws in those regions (usually some taking the law into their own hands) are harsh and Europe is a soft touch.
Britain maybe leaving the EU but it still has to ensure tougher laws against breaches of the law by asylum seekers

 

[angelo]

They may get some tougher laws, but only if the Tory party continue in power.

 

[whichphilosophy]

They may get some tougher laws, but only if the Tory party continue in power.

The Tories failed to control immigration but party due to the fact the EU makes the rules. I think there will be some marginal changes. They may adopt some UKIP policies on immigration which basically tend to propose stricter entry requirements and simplified repatriation (though very costly).
Don't forget all those young men who came alone. Their families will join them in the next couple of years. That will cause a sharp increase. Germany will of course have a bigger issue with housing, schooling and medical facilities.

 

[angelo]

They may get some tougher laws, but only if the Tory party continue in power.

The Tories failed to control immigration but party due to the fact the EU makes the rules. I think there will be some marginal changes. They may adopt some UKIP policies on immigration which basically tend to propose stricter entry requirements and simplified repatriation (though very costly).
Don't forget all those young men who came alone. Their families will join them in the next couple of years. That will cause a sharp increase. Germany will of course have a bigger issue with housing, schooling and medical facilities.

Merkel will be long gone by then.

 

[whichphilosophy]

The Tories failed to control immigration but party due to the fact the EU makes the rules. I think there will be some marginal changes. They may adopt some UKIP policies on immigration which basically tend to propose stricter entry requirements and simplified repatriation (though very costly).
Don't forget all those young men who came alone. Their families will join them in the next couple of years. That will cause a sharp increase. Germany will of course have a bigger issue with housing, schooling and medical facilities.

Merkel will be long gone by then.

Before then it'll be a real laugh if the Austrian Freedom party comes to power. It was actually set up by an ex member of the SS and it successfully voided the last very close election results. Herr Merkler will be there for a few years, but the British need to now focus on sensible immigration policies. It may have to arrange with the French authorities to make the Channel tunnel into a safe zone and ensure there are no rushes of mobs through the checkpoints. The French don't care because the more that sneak into the UK means the less stay in France.

 

[whichphilosophy]

The Tories failed to control immigration but party due to the fact the EU makes the rules. I think there will be some marginal changes. They may adopt some UKIP policies on immigration which basically tend to propose stricter entry requirements and simplified repatriation (though very costly).
Don't forget all those young men who came alone. Their families will join them in the next couple of years. That will cause a sharp increase. Germany will of course have a bigger issue with housing, schooling and medical facilities.

Merkel will be long gone by then.

Before then it'll be a real laugh if the Austrian Freedom party comes to power. It was actually set up by an ex member of the SS and it successfully voided the last very close election results. Herr Merkler will be there for a few years, but the British need to now focus on sensible immigration policies. It may have to arrange with the French authorities to make the Channel tunnel into a safe zone and ensure there are no rushes of mobs through the checkpoints. The French don't care because the more that sneak into the UK means the less stay in France.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Interesting VIDEO form AL JAZERA about immigration in Sweden and the current problems.

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF7472YMyxk[/YOUTUBE]

Taken from the Transcript:
Published on 4 Jul 2016


Sweden's backlash: Why the tide is turning for refugees
We speak to Swedish politicians and citizens to find out what is behind the current backlash against immigration.
Al Jazeera documentary
In the past 10 years, the numbers have taken off and in 2015, nearly 163,000 individuals applied for asylum in Sweden, a nation of 9.8 million people.

Syrians accounted for 51,000 of these asylum seekers, 41,000 came from Afghanistan, 20,000 from Iraq, along with thousands from Eritrea, Somalia and Iran. A combined 4,000 came from Albania and Kosovo.

Today, around 1.6 million people living in Sweden were born in another country - that is 16 per cent of the population.

Many new arrivals are languishing in temporary housing, beggars and homeless live in the streets, and some neighbourhoods have seen an uptick in violence and extremism.

As I've said many times before in this thread, the problem isn't the refugees. It's the hysteria around it. Racist blogs have successfully manage to spread lies about the immigration, that are completely and utterly unsupported by facts. The truth is that crime rates have been unaffected by the refugees coming in. There's been very little problems. The biggest problem is a rise in racists beating up people looking vaguely middle-eastern, or racists trying to burn down refugee shelters.

This is a completely made up and constructed problem. Somewhere along the line the authorities failed in the communication. The racist blogs are trusted more than the people talking the truth.

The beggars in the streets is completely unrelated. Three years ago Romanian gypsies started showing up in large numbers, and are now a common sight on Swedish streets. There is zero connection with the Syrian refugee situation. You'll never find Syrian refugees begging in the streets.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Interesting VIDEO form AL JAZERA about immigration in Sweden and the current problems.

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF7472YMyxk[/YOUTUBE]

Taken from the Transcript:
Published on 4 Jul 2016


Sweden's backlash: Why the tide is turning for refugees
We speak to Swedish politicians and citizens to find out what is behind the current backlash against immigration.
Al Jazeera documentary
In the past 10 years, the numbers have taken off and in 2015, nearly 163,000 individuals applied for asylum in Sweden, a nation of 9.8 million people.

Syrians accounted for 51,000 of these asylum seekers, 41,000 came from Afghanistan, 20,000 from Iraq, along with thousands from Eritrea, Somalia and Iran. A combined 4,000 came from Albania and Kosovo.

Today, around 1.6 million people living in Sweden were born in another country - that is 16 per cent of the population.

Many new arrivals are languishing in temporary housing, beggars and homeless live in the streets, and some neighbourhoods have seen an uptick in violence and extremism.

As I've said many times before in this thread, the problem isn't the refugees. It's the hysteria around it. Racist blogs have successfully manage to spread lies about the immigration, that are completely and utterly unsupported by facts. The truth is that crime rates have been unaffected by the refugees coming in. There's been very little problems. The biggest problem is a rise in racists beating up people looking vaguely middle-eastern, or racists trying to burn down refugee shelters.

This is a completely made up and constructed problem. Somewhere along the line the authorities failed in the communication. The racist blogs are trusted more than the people talking the truth.

The beggars in the streets is completely unrelated. Three years ago Romanian gypsies started showing up in large numbers, and are now a common sight on Swedish streets. There is zero connection with the Syrian refugee situation. You'll never find Syrian refugees begging in the streets.

This was actually an Arabic Channel Aljazeera. The numbers of immigrants will create various problems by way of a small percentile of the overall quantity. There are racists who capitalise on this which are a result of EU open border policies which though idealistic are not practical. The beggars also appear in Italy and the UK. At one time during a period of a few weeks, gangs tried once a week to rob me at Milan station.

One tactic is for a group of women any of them pregnant (or appearing so) in groups to beg for money while someone tries to rob them from behind I caught them each time. One Arab caught one from a group who had just stolen €2,000. cash. The police who patrol there (possibly community police) seem to be oblivious to what is going on.

Unfortunately if they are sent back home they just return again. While we can blame the Romania authorities for not doing enough to end their poverty and enable/encourage them to gain meaningful employment in a poor country, we should have the right to forbid the entry of those who commit offences.

 

[angelo]

Interesting VIDEO form AL JAZERA about immigration in Sweden and the current problems.

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF7472YMyxk[/YOUTUBE]

Taken from the Transcript:
Published on 4 Jul 2016


Sweden's backlash: Why the tide is turning for refugees
We speak to Swedish politicians and citizens to find out what is behind the current backlash against immigration.
Al Jazeera documentary
In the past 10 years, the numbers have taken off and in 2015, nearly 163,000 individuals applied for asylum in Sweden, a nation of 9.8 million people.

Syrians accounted for 51,000 of these asylum seekers, 41,000 came from Afghanistan, 20,000 from Iraq, along with thousands from Eritrea, Somalia and Iran. A combined 4,000 came from Albania and Kosovo.

Today, around 1.6 million people living in Sweden were born in another country - that is 16 per cent of the population.

Many new arrivals are languishing in temporary housing, beggars and homeless live in the streets, and some neighbourhoods have seen an uptick in violence and extremism.

As I've said many times before in this thread, the problem isn't the refugees. It's the hysteria around it. Racist blogs have successfully manage to spread lies about the immigration, that are completely and utterly unsupported by facts. The truth is that crime rates have been unaffected by the refugees coming in. There's been very little problems. The biggest problem is a rise in racists beating up people looking vaguely middle-eastern, or racists trying to burn down refugee shelters.

This is a completely made up and constructed problem. Somewhere along the line the authorities failed in the communication. The racist blogs are trusted more than the people talking the truth.

The beggars in the streets is completely unrelated. Three years ago Romanian gypsies started showing up in large numbers, and are now a common sight on Swedish streets. There is zero connection with the Syrian refugee situation. You'll never find Syrian refugees begging in the streets.

No you won't see Syrians begging in the streets, they're all on government benefits, why would they beg in the streets?