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Fauci Should Be In Prison - Senator Rand Paul

Yes, mask-wearing is scientific.

Um, would mind giving a little summary of what Rand Paul (Senator from Kentucky, Lunatic Party) says in the video?
Actually he gave the little summary in his post. Dur hurr it was a bio-weapon something something China, whining that Trump is being treated unfairly, and demanding that liberals agree with this drivel.
Thank you Ford. I may not agree with your view point.

But at least I have the comfort knowing that there is someone that knows how to read and comprehend an OP.

I was obviously requesting a summary of WHY he was claiming hurr-durr, bio weapons somethig something, etc; i.e., why anyone should even bother to listen to such drivel without prior justification.

Too bad you don’t know how to read or comprehend a post.
 
Yes, mask-wearing is scientific.

Um, would mind giving a little summary of what Rand Paul (Senator from Kentucky, Lunatic Party) says in the video?
Actually he gave the little summary in his post. Dur hurr it was a bio-weapon something something China, whining that Trump is being treated unfairly, and demanding that liberals agree with this drivel.
Thank you Ford. I may not agree with your view point.

But at least I have the comfort knowing that there is someone that knows how to read and comprehend an OP.

I was obviously requesting a summary of WHY he was claiming hurr-durr, bio weapons somethig something, etc; i.e., why anyone should even bother to listen to such drivel without prior justification.

Too bad you don’t know how to read or comprehend a post.
No need to get nasty.
 
Yes, mask-wearing is scientific.

Um, would mind giving a little summary of what Rand Paul (Senator from Kentucky, Lunatic Party) says in the video?
Actually he gave the little summary in his post. Dur hurr it was a bio-weapon something something China, whining that Trump is being treated unfairly, and demanding that liberals agree with this drivel.
Thank you Ford. I may not agree with your view point.

But at least I have the comfort knowing that there is someone that knows how to read and comprehend an OP.

I was obviously requesting a summary of WHY he was claiming hurr-durr, bio weapons somethig something, etc; i.e., why anyone should even bother to listen to such drivel without prior justification.

Too bad you don’t know how to read or comprehend a post.
No need to get nasty.

I was just responding in kind to what he said about me. Reread his post I quoted.
 
Yes, mask-wearing is scientific.

Um, would mind giving a little summary of what Rand Paul (Senator from Kentucky, Lunatic Party) says in the video?
Actually he gave the little summary in his post. Dur hurr it was a bio-weapon something something China, whining that Trump is being treated unfairly, and demanding that liberals agree with this drivel.
Thank you Ford. I may not agree with your view point.

But at least I have the comfort knowing that there is someone that knows how to read and comprehend an OP.
I was obviously requesting a summary of WHY he was claiming hurr-durr, bio weapons somethig something, etc; i.e., why anyone should even bother to listen to such drivel without prior justification.

Too bad you don’t know how to read or comprehend a post.
No need to get nasty.
I don't know. The goalpost shifting pisses me off... from this was a man made virus that got out and killed people, Fauci should be in prison to This was nothing but a government attempt to make the population docile to their rule and Covid-19 wasn't that bad.

One million Americans died from Covid-19. It didn't happen that long ago. And people continue to make shit up.
 
That gain of function research was not supported in Wuhan by the US?
There is all sorts of research going on. Using the term "gain of function" doesn't provide a mulligan to bullshit claims that have had no evidence provided.
Bio weapons research? Yes, there is probably a lot of bio weapons research going on we don't know about. Wouldn't you think that might be a little concerning to you and others to at least look into?

Or is it more comforting to trust the so called scientists who know everything? To drink the government narrative. Easier just to believe a bat in a food market caused this worldwide pandemic.

But the problem with throwing the blanket over our heads is that the same people who probably caused this pandemic are still out there. And more importantly, they have no incentive not to do the same thing again.
 
That gain of function research was not supported in Wuhan by the US?
There is all sorts of research going on. Using the term "gain of function" doesn't provide a mulligan to bullshit claims that have had no evidence provided.
Bio weapons research? Yes, there is probably a lot of bio weapons research going on we don't know about. Wouldn't you think that might be a little concerning to you and others to at least look into?

Or is it more comforting to trust the so called scientists who know everything? To drink the government narrative. Easier just to believe a bat in a food market caused this worldwide pandemic.
So you are going with the false dichotomy. It is a classic fallacy. Voted Fallacy of the Year in 1897, 1923, 1967, and 2004.
But the problem with throwing the blanket over our heads is that the same people who probably caused this pandemic are still out there. And more importantly, they have no incentive not to do the same thing again.
You can feel free to provide information and data to support your position. I already know you feel justified to be suspicious of the system. This was supposed to be about a specific accusation.
 
That gain of function research was not supported in Wuhan by the US?
There is all sorts of research going on. Using the term "gain of function" doesn't provide a mulligan to bullshit claims that have had no evidence provided.
Bio weapons research? Yes, there is probably a lot of bio weapons research going on we don't know about. Wouldn't you think that might be a little concerning to you and others to at least look into?

Or is it more comforting to trust the so called scientists who know everything? To drink the government narrative. Easier just to believe a bat in a food market caused this worldwide pandemic.
So you are going with the false dichotomy. It is a classic fallacy. Voted Fallacy of the Year in 1897, 1923, 1967, and 2004.
But the problem with throwing the blanket over our heads is that the same people who probably caused this pandemic are still out there. And more importantly, they have no incentive not to do the same thing again.
You can feel free to provide information and data to support your position. I already know you feel justified to be suspicious of the system. This was supposed to be about a specific accusation.
Where is the false dichotomy? The virus either originated in nature or it was of man made origin. Those are 2 and only 2 choices that cover where the COVID virus originated.

On the one had there is a lot of support for Paul. Here for example: https://www.congress.gov/117/meeting/house/114270/documents/HHRG-117-GO24-20211201-SD004.pdf


But OTOH there are articles like this: https://www.factcheck.org/2021/05/the-wuhan-lab-and-the-gain-of-function-disagreement/

Perlman told us that he thought Fauci’s response in the May 11 exchange was correct — that no money was given for gain-of-function research. But, he added, there’s a scientific discussion to be had on the benefits and risks of research making recombinant viruses, which involves rearranging or combining genetic material. The politicization of the issue, Perlman said, “doesn’t do anybody good.”

But even those articles are framed making it a judgement call whether or not such research should be going forward. IMO it shouldn't but in any case this shouldn't be dismissed so readily by the public whether bio research should be banned or not.
 
One million Americans died from Covid-19. It didn't happen that long ago. And people continue to make shit up.
Then maybe you can site where Paul was making a false statement.
article said:
“In public he’s saying, ‘Oh, if you say it came from the lab, you’re a conspiracy theorist, you’re crazy, it’s a fringe theory,'” he continued. “But in private, he’s saying … ‘We’re very concerned because the virus appears to be manipulated. And we’re also very concerned because we know they’re doing gain of function research in Wuhan.’”
link

A review of the emails (if you understand science) indicates the suggestion came up, there were many opinions, Fauci insisted that they take the consideration very seriously and determine the veracity of the claim. There was never a consensus it was manipulated. And statements regarding "disproving" the lab theory is sci-talk for making an affirmative proof that manipulation and a lab leak were not true.
article said:
n the days after February 4, the summary document written by Holmes and his colleagues continued to circulate among the scientists and health officials, including Collins and Fauci, as it was revised and reworked. The scientists were now contemplating three main hypotheses for the virus’s origin—two involving a natural spillover event and one involving a lab origin. They hypothesized that it jumped from its original host, likely a bat, directly into humans, where it evolved its pandemic potential; that it spilled from its original host into some intermediate animal host before jumping into humans; or that it was the result of some sort of lab accident involving serial passage. The scientists wrote that “current data are consistent with all three” scenarios.

On February 7, Farrar notified Fauci and Collins that new preliminary data had come in from China concerning coronaviruses found in pangolins, one of the world’s most heavily trafficked mammals. It seemed to excite the scientists: “Reports coming out overnight that Chinese group have pangolin viruses that are 99% similar,” Farrar wrote. “This would be a crucially important finding and if true could be the ‘missing link’ and explain a natural evolutionary link.”

“That will be VERY interesting,” Collins responded. “Does it have the furin cleavage site?”

The pangolin data, it turned out, did not provide an explanation for the scientists’ central concerns about the furin cleavage site, and the viruses isolated from some pangolins were not 99 percent similar to SARS-CoV-2, but the data did show that coronaviruses circulating in pangolins shared other key features with the pandemic virus. This seems to have played an important role in shifting the scientists’ thinking away from the lab hypothesis.

Holmes, who had been described in an earlier e-mail as being “60:40 lab side,” wrote, “Personally, with the pangolin virus possessing 6/6 key sites in the receptor binding domain, I am in favour of the natural evolution theory.”
I lose hours of my life writing emails and checking, rechecking to make certain nothing can be misunderstood by a layman or worse yet, a lawyer. These professionals were talking sci-speak. They took the situation seriously and concluded it seemed natural and wasn't a leak. And people like that asshole from Kentucky are taking their words out of context for political gain. It is disgusting!
 
In case you do not like this source, hear what Rand Paul says from :58 to 3:30



Rand Paul and others have been making the case this pandemic was the result of bio weapons research (gain of function). And that during the pandemic Fauci provably lied to the public; his private emails directly contradicted what he said publicly.

Yes, Rand Paul loves to make shit up.

You are saying that it is pure bull shit that the virus was not man made? That gain of function research was not supported in Wuhan by the US?

Do you have anything that might support that claim?

Actually we don’t know yet where Covid came from. From what I read, it’s 50-50 that it came from a leaky lab. If you are making a positive claim, you need to support it
 
That gain of function research was not supported in Wuhan by the US?
There is all sorts of research going on. Using the term "gain of function" doesn't provide a mulligan to bullshit claims that have had no evidence provided.
Bio weapons research? Yes, there is probably a lot of bio weapons research going on we don't know about. Wouldn't you think that might be a little concerning to you and others to at least look into?

Or is it more comforting to trust the so called scientists who know everything? To drink the government narrative. Easier just to believe a bat in a food market caused this worldwide pandemic.

But the problem with throwing the blanket over our heads is that the same people who probably caused this pandemic are still out there. And more importantly, they have no incentive not to do the same thing again.
Pandemics have naturally occurred throughout history. If you are genuinely interested in this stuff, there is a lot of great information from the consensus of virologists and immunologists out there who discuss all this in great detail, with tons of scientific data to back them up.

I strongly suggest not relying on this type of media for information.

Kids are now dying of measles as a direct result of this type of political showboating.
 
Actually we don’t know yet where Covid came from.
But the consensus amongst actual experts in virology and immunology is that it is zoonotic, and the idea that it is not is fringe at best.
From what I read, it’s 50-50 that it came from a leaky lab.
That is an artefact of the insane journalistic practice of "balance", which is perhaps OK for questions of pure opinion, but is absurd for matters of science.

IMG_1379.jpeg

If you are making a positive claim, you need to support it
Where is your support for the notion that "it’s 50-50 that it came from a leaky lab"? How did you arrive at the numerical result 50-50?
 
Um, would mind giving a little summary of what Rand Paul (Senator from Kentucky, Lunatic Party) says in the video?
On the Jimmy Dore show, no less. Not exactly a place that sane people go to gather factual information.
Who is Jimmy Dore? Not sure I even want to know.

I can help! The short version is no, you don't want to know. Here's the longer version;

Jimmy Dore used to be on the left wing show The Young Turks. The two main achievements he made at the time were 1) sexually harassing Ana Kasparian (something he is proud of to this day), and 2) spitting in the face of Alex Jones (something that he for whatever reason he now denies happened). Then back around 2018-2020 he joined in on the "walk away movement", a movement which which we now know was heavilly astroturfed by far right wing billionaire donors and Russian bots. Basically, Jimmy Dore did what Dave Rubin did; claimed to be left wing until the money got better then "suddenly" had an almost overnight epiphany and switch to full on MAGA.

And in case you are wondering, of course RVonse fell for the Walkaway grift when it happened back in the day.

So simply put - Jimmy Dore, who like Dave Rubin and Candace Owens, was someone who said mean things on the left until they realised they could get more money saying mean things for the right.

You do not have to listen to Jimmy Dore. The exact location of Rand Paul is referenced in my OP.

That begs the question doesn't it? Why can't you find more reliable or credible people making the same assertion? Why can't you succinctly explain why Fauci should be in prison without copy-pasting a dubious video clip and only saying, "please watch this crap"? Why do you consider that to be a meaningful argument?

On a side note, why the fuck couldn't you time stamp the clip yourself? You're basically asking everyone to put in more effort than you to agree with your assertion. Sorry, son. It doesn't work that way.
 
If anyone is interested, this podcast provides a really good deep dive of covid origin by actual experts in the topic (3 virologists who study virus origins).

In short, zoonotic origin much more likely based on the evidence, but lab leak theory not completely insane.

If I had to bet I'd put it at 90% zoonotic, 10% lab leak



It sure says a lot about the state of the world that a high information quality video like this only gets a few thousand views, while conspiracy videos with crackpot information get millions.
 
I listened to about 28 seconds and already the narrator is making stuff up. Yes, mask-wearing is scientific. This was discussed in the COVID thread and right-wingers there cited some big study that actually said that masks were effective to a small degree (even the regular masks) but these right-wingers claimed it said the opposite. That was right-wing spin, not science.
What we have learned about masks is pretty much what we've known all along:

1) Masks are about protecting others from an infected wearer. They aren't much protection for the wearer. To protect yourself you need a respirator and it needs to be properly fit--not every respirator fits every person. I've got a box of them around here that I instantly rejected before I even tried to test the seal because it was so obviously wrong on me.

2) Respirators only work when you actually wear them. While this might seem like a water-is-wet statement the reality is that most infection came when people let down their guard.

Turned off the video at that point.

In regard to the rest of the post...it's very scary when your government and Reich wingers are coming after scientists. These conservolibertarians screaming about Fauci or Hillary needing to be locked up are leading us into a 3rd world Banana Republic.
Scientists say things they don't like. The message is the reality--get everyone to say what you want and it will become so. Thus go after the scientists.
 
In case you do not like this source, hear what Rand Paul says from :58 to 3:30



Rand Paul and others have been making the case this pandemic was the result of bio weapons research (gain of function). And that during the pandemic Fauci provably lied to the public; his private emails directly contradicted what he said publicly.

Yes, Rand Paul loves to make shit up.

You are saying that it is pure bull shit that the virus was not man made? That gain of function research was not supported in Wuhan by the US?

Do you have anything that might support that claim?

1) We have no evidence one way or the other about gain of function research.

2) Even if there was gain of function research that doesn't mean the virus came from the lab.

Remember, we got the Covid vaccines so quickly because they weren't really Covid vaccines in the first place. The mRNA Covid vaccine is really a SARS vaccine with a few edits. They took it as far as they could in animal testing and then put it on the shelf because human testing was not ethical. When Covid came along they took it back off the shelf, did a few edits and had a vaccine candidate the next day--the next 11 months were testing. SARS didn't spread well and caused symptoms before the patient was infectious--the world was able to pounce on it and kill it.

And there is MERS. Way up their in lethality, but fortunately it doesn't spread well between humans and has never been a substantial threat.

And there's the unidentified SARS-like illness in some miners in 2012. 50% lethality but no human-to-human spread.

Three examples that predate the lab you are blaming and they are spread over a large area, also. There are other things which are suspected to be related but without samples being preserved we will almost certainly never know. There's clearly something out there that causes such a disease but is very poor at attacking humans. Occasionally a mutation succeeds in attacking humans. I see no need to invoke a lab in what clearly has happened before naturally.
 
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