Ferguson Live Feed

[Derec]

Fades in comparison to the mistakes Brown committed that helped precipitate Brown's death.

Wilson fired the bullet, so no. That is not true.

He would never have fired the bullet had he not been attacked by Brown. Brown wouldn't have attacked Wilson had he not robbed a store just minutes before.
Sorry, thug life has consequences.

 

[Angry Floof]

The whole thing is bullshit. Not looking forward to the conspiracy theorists mucking up any questions about the case or protests we might have once everyone stops watching looping footage of fires and looting.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

I agree with ksen. The law enforcement class (police and prosecutors) are loathe to act against one of their own. It takes an extreme situation for them to even consider such activity. And when they do ... Mike Nifong spent a whole day in jail for his crimes. One whole fucking day. Bringing an indictment (not even a show trial or a suspended sentence but just an indictment) is more than they want to do to one of their own, even though they can indict anybody at any time. An indictment is simply the prosecutor saying "I accuse you" but passing the buck to a grand jury. And has been shown, grand juries almost always do what the prosecutors say, they are a rubber stamp. The prosecutor didn't want to prosecute a fellow member of his class.

As for the looting, we have protestors pulling looters out of shops and we have police mysteriously absent from wherever the looting is. It's not like the law enforcement cartel has ever used any undercover agent provocateurs.

Really, this is bad news for everyone, as the police are already going out of control. Some might see this as a race issue that encompasses non-police into the elite class, but it really isn't. People of all races that aren't police are in greater danger as a result of this. This is not the open season on black people that some may have hoped for.

Oh, it is open season on black people, but that doesn't negate anything else you have said.

- - - Updated - - -

Wilson fired the bullet, so no. That is not true.

He would never have fired the bullet had he not been attacked by Brown. Brown wouldn't have attacked Wilson had he not robbed a store just minutes before.
Sorry, thug life has consequences.

Derec you wouldn't know thug life if it bit you in ass and said howdy.

 

[Derec]

Derec you wouldn't know thug life if it bit you in ass and said howdy.

I very much doubt it would say "howdy".
But since you appear to fancy yourself knowledgeable about thug life, maybe you can enlighten us.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

What I don't get from some is this idea that breaking the law leads naturally to a death sentence. He wasn't beaten by a cop, he was killed by one.

Wilson fired the bullet, so no. That is not true.

He would never have fired the bullet had he not been attacked by Brown. Brown wouldn't have attacked Wilson had he not robbed a store just minutes before.
Sorry, thug life has consequences.

Brown fucked up royally. That doesn't absolve Wilson's fuck ups. He felt like a child and the guy was Hulk Hogan, yet pursued him, alone, on foot?! Brown didn't appear to pose a threat to others. Let him go, get back up and then get him. Brown is charged for his offenses and has to serve time. Seems like a much more level headed path to take. And no one gets hurt any more than they have.

 

[Angry Floof]

Oh, it is open season on black people, but that doesn't negate anything else you have said.

It's also an existing conflict. Fox News, the KKK, and others have been making sure through fear mongering that racial tension will be easy to exploit.

 

[Derec]

Brown fucked up royally. That doesn't absolve Wilson's fuck ups. He felt like a child and the guy was Hulk Hogan, yet pursued him, alone, on foot?!

Well Brown was a fleeing felon and the police officer (not just a random citizen) was justified in pursuing and confronting him. Waiting for backup would have been too late.
And obviously he felt that being armed he was able to take Brown on. He turned out to be right.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Brown fucked up royally. That doesn't absolve Wilson's fuck ups. He felt like a child and the guy was Hulk Hogan, yet pursued him, alone, on foot?!

Well Brown was a fleeing felon and the police officer (not just a random citizen) was justified in pursuing and confronting him.
Waiting for backup would have been too late.

Too late? Criminals are picked up all the time after the fact. It would not have been too late. The officer put himself in a situation where he felt that deadly force was required. He already noted saying he was well undermanned against Brown, so why in the heck would he follow him on foot then to confront a guy he would be wholely incapable of subduing without violent force?

And obviously he felt that being armed he was able to take Brown on. He turned out to be right.

Yeah. The fact that you feel there is nothing wrong with that is disturbing. The officer put his life needlessly at risk for no purpose and ended up killing the other guy. Brown could have easily been apprehended after the fact. That is a cop fail.

If Brown was armed, Wilson could have been killed. If Brown got in to a real fight, he could have really put the hurt on Wilson.

 

[ksen]

One of the things I don't get, Wilson testified that during the altercation in the vehicle he couldn't reach his mace. What was his excuse for not getting his mace out once Brown started to flee? Or even his taser? Do Ferguson police officers have access to military grade weapons and armored vehicles but not a simple taser?

Even given the worst reading of what might have happened that day Michael Brown did not have to die. His death lays purely on Officer Wilson for failing to utilize the non-lethal tools he had at his disposal.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

One of the things I don't get, Wilson testified that during the altercation in the vehicle he couldn't reach his mace. What was his excuse for not getting his mace out once Brown started to flee? Or even his taser? Do Ferguson police officers have access to military grade weapons and armored vehicles but not a simple taser?

Even given the worst reading of what might have happened that day Michael Brown did not have to die. His death lays purely on Officer Wilson for failing to utilize the non-lethal tools he had at his disposal.

He didn't have a taser on him. Said it was uncomfortable to carry around.

 

[ksen]

One of the things I don't get, Wilson testified that during the altercation in the vehicle he couldn't reach his mace. What was his excuse for not getting his mace out once Brown started to flee? Or even his taser? Do Ferguson police officers have access to military grade weapons and armored vehicles but not a simple taser?

Even given the worst reading of what might have happened that day Michael Brown did not have to die. His death lays purely on Officer Wilson for failing to utilize the non-lethal tools he had at his disposal.

He didn't have a taser on him. Said it was uncomfortable to carry around.

lol, are you fucking kidding me?

Ferguson PD doesn't have requirements to have all your tools available when you go out on patrol? No uniform requirements? If carrying a gun around was uncomfortable would Wilson have been allowed to leave that behind as well?

So basically Michael Brown is dead because of Officer Wilson's comfort level?

This guy just looks worse and worse the more I dig into the story.

And the prosecutor is a bigger and bigger piece of shit for playing out this charade for so many months.

 

[Sabine Grant]

Worth the read :

http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2014/11/us/ferguson-grand-jury-docs/index.html

It certainly sheds some light as to HOW the Grand Jury had to figure out "what to believe". Not an easy task for them. I doubt common citizens can establish the difference between evidence passing muster of scientifically demonstrated as "can only lead to one conclusion" and having to interpret evidence. Allusion here to blood spatter tracing Brown's movement back towards Officer Wilson which of course if the Jury members can only then agree that Brown's movement after having been hit several times was to stop running away and moving back towards the direction of Officer Wilson, it is not evidence that he was "charging" Officer Wilson. The reality here is that it still was a point in favor of Wilson having to convince the Jury that in HIS mind, Brown had become an imminent threat and his fatal shooting was a reasonably expected response to such perceived threat.

It is somewhat similar to how an accused party who resorted to the use of lethal force in a claim of self defense undergoing a SYG Hearing under the ruling of a Judge will need to convince the Judge that the perception of an imminent threat of harm or death was reasonably and genuinely experienced and thus justified the use of lethal force. If successful, such pleading will result in the Judge granting immunity from charges.

IMO, Officer Wilson was successful in convincing the Grand Jury that his experiencing of a threat of imminent harm or death was indeed reasonable and genuine. And it was initially prompted by the struggle and how he experienced it while in the car.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The Wilson case has a noted similarity to Zimmerman's. There was reasonable doubt to suppose that while the decisions he made were stupid and reckless, in the end, he wasn't criminally liable for the death. The reasons in the two cases are obviously a little different as Wilson was an actual officer so is given a lot of leeway. Zimmerman was the benefactor of a gross amount of leeway thanks to the self defense laws and the lack of any witnesses, while Wilson is an Officer and is allow by law to kill people.

In both cases, the guys feared for their lives, yet inserted themselves needlessly deeper into the situation.

 

[Derec]

Too late? Criminals are picked up all the time after the fact. It would not have been too late. The officer put himself in a situation where he felt that deadly force was required. He already noted saying he was well undermanned against Brown, so why in the heck would he follow him on foot then to confront a guy he would be wholely incapable of subduing without violent force?

So cops should retreat or allow suspects to escape if they can't subdue them without "violent force"?

Yeah. The fact that you feel there is nothing wrong with that is disturbing. The officer put his life needlessly at risk for no purpose and ended up killing the other guy.

It is the cop's job to engage suspects, even violent ones. I still think Brown's death is a tragedy that could have been prevented for example by him surrendering after first shots were fired and his hand was wounded. I do not rejoice in Brown's death but unlike you I do recognize that he brought it upon himself. As they say, "play stupid games, win stupid prizes". Fighting with an armed police officer is one of the most stupid games out there.

Brown could have easily been apprehended after the fact. That is a cop fail.

Since I don't think his identity was known at the time it certainly would not have been easy.

If Brown was armed, Wilson could have been killed.

Or if Brown got hold of the officer's gun. Hence Wilson using said gun to avoid that happening.

If Brown got in to a real fight, he could have really put the hurt on Wilson.

Hence the lethal force.

 

[ksen]

IMO, Officer Wilson was successful in convincing the Grand Jury that his experiencing of a threat of imminent harm or death was indeed reasonable and genuine. And it was initially prompted by the struggle and how he experienced it while in the car.

Which further establishes that the prosecutor wasn't even trying to get an indictment since normally all a prosecutor is present enough evidence to establish probable cause, of course they have to want to try to establish probably cause in the first case and it's highly improbable this prosecutor even wanted to do that. Prosecutors normally don't allow the grand jury to see any exculpatory evidence and they certainly don't normally allow the defendant to try and persuade the grand jury.

This grand jury proceeding should have been over and done with within a couple of days. It should not have taken 3 months.

 

[ksen]

I still think Brown's death is a tragedy

lol, no you don't.

I do not rejoice in Brown's death

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

So cops should retreat or allow suspects to escape if they can't subdue them without "violent force"?

Especially if they are alone, yes. Remember, this is also about the Officer's safety. If Brown was armed, Wilson would likely have been killed taking Brown on alone.

Yeah. The fact that you feel there is nothing wrong with that is disturbing. The officer put his life needlessly at risk for no purpose and ended up killing the other guy.

It is the cop's job to engage suspects, even violent ones.

You typically see multiple cops in pull overs, forget about a situation where a suspect has actually put hands on the Officer.

I still think Brown's death is a tragedy that could have been prevented for example by him surrendering after first shots were fired and his hand was wounded.

He would never put his hands on the Officer after that point. The threat merely became theoretical.

I do not rejoice in Brown's death...

You really have not come across in all of your posts having an opinion like that.

...but unlike you I do recognize that he brought it upon himself.

Oddly enough, I haven't even remotely said that Brown isn't culpable for his actions that day.

As they say, "play stupid games, win stupid prizes". Fighting with an armed police officer is one of the most stupid games out there.

As is running after a suspect that you related to looking like a "demon", without any backup.

Brown could have easily been apprehended after the fact. That is a cop fail.

Since I don't think his identity was known at the time it certainly would not have been easy.

6'5", 280 pound black male, age around 18. Would it be that hard?

If Brown was armed, Wilson could have been killed.

Or if Brown got hold of the officer's gun. Hence Wilson using said gun to avoid that happening.

Brown wasn't near enough to the Officer to take the gun, and he certainly wasn't taking the gun while running away, so that isn't applicable.

If Brown got in to a real fight, he could have really put the hurt on Wilson.

Hence the lethal force.

Lethal force is a last resort, not a typical tactic.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

My thought is that prosecutors are able to get an indictment basically 100% of the time . . . unless it is against a police officer. That raises questions for me.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/ferguson-michael-brown-indictment-darren-wilson/

That is significant.

 

[ksen]

Especially if they are alone, yes. Remember, this is also about the Officer's safety. If Brown was armed, Wilson would likely have been killed taking Brown on alone.

Apparently waiting for backup isn't a thing in Ferguson when dealing with a potentially armed (hand going for his waistband) demonic black man.

Lethal force is a last resort, not a typical tactic.

You naive, naive child. <3

 

[dismal]

My thought is that prosecutors are able to get an indictment basically 100% of the time . . . unless it is against a police officer. That raises questions for me.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/ferguson-michael-brown-indictment-darren-wilson/

Under ordinary circumstances a prosecutor wouldn't take a case that bad to a grand jury.

Usually they go because they have a case not because the public demands a spectacle.