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Gaslighting, and why you need to know what it is.

Treedbear

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I saw an interview on CSPAN over the weekend with Amanda Carpenter, the author of the new book "Gaslighting America: Why We Love It When Trump Lies to Us". She's a conservative Never-Trump Republican who's didn't vote in the 2016 election. I haven't gotten the book yet but she seems to have figured out Trump's technique and she says he repeats the same thing all the time. Gaslighting is
Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation that seeks to sow seeds of doubt in a targeted individual or in members of a targeted group, making them question their own memory, perception, and sanity. Using persistent denial, misdirection, contradiction, and lying, it attempts to destabilize the victim and delegitimize the victim's belief.

I found an article in Psychology Today magazine from 2017 by Stephanie A. Sarkis, Ph.D. that explains the techiques involved pretty well. I think it's worth posting here in its entirety. This is really worth studying if we want to save our democracy.
11 Warning Signs of Gaslighting
Gaslighting is a manipulation tactic used to gain power. And it works too well.

Gaslighting is a tactic in which a person or entity, in order to gain more power, makes a victim question their reality. It works much better than you may think. Anyone is susceptible to gaslighting, and it is a common technique of abusers, dictators, narcissists, and cult leaders. It is done slowly, so the victim doesn't realize how much they've been brainwashed. For example, in the movie Gaslight (1944), a man manipulates his wife to the point where she thinks she is losing her mind.

People who gaslight typically use the following techniques:

1. They tell blatant lies.

You know it's an outright lie. Yet they are telling you this lie with a straight face. Why are they so blatant? Because they're setting up a precedent. Once they tell you a huge lie, you're not sure if anything they say is true. Keeping you unsteady and off-kilter is the goal.

2. They deny they ever said something, even though you have proof.

You know they said they would do something; you know you heard it. But they out and out deny it. It makes you start questioning your reality—maybe they never said that thing. And the more they do this, the more you question your reality and start accepting theirs.

3. They use what is near and dear to you as ammunition.

They know how important your kids are to you, and they know how important your identity is to you. So those may be one of the first things they attack. If you have kids, they tell you that you should not have had those children. They will tell you'd be a worthy person if only you didn't have a long list of negative traits. They attack the foundation of your being.

4. They wear you down over time.

This is one of the insidious things about gaslighting—it is done gradually, over time. A lie here, a lie there, a snide comment every so often...and then it starts ramping up. Even the brightest, most self-aware people can be sucked into gaslighting—it is that effective. It's the "frog in the frying pan" analogy: The heat is turned up slowly, so the frog never realizes what's happening to it.

5. Their actions do not match their words.

When dealing with a person or entity that gaslights, look at what they are doing rather than what they are saying. What they are saying means nothing; it is just talk. What they are doing is the issue.
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6. They throw in positive reinforcement to confuse you.

This person or entity that is cutting you down, telling you that you don't have value, is now praising you for something you did. This adds an additional sense of uneasiness. You think, "Well maybe they aren't so bad." Yes, they are. This is a calculated attempt to keep you off-kilter—and again, to question your reality. Also look at what you were praised for; it is probably something that served the gaslighter.

7. They know confusion weakens people.

Gaslighters know that people like having a sense of stability and normalcy. Their goal is to uproot this and make you constantly question everything. And humans' natural tendency is to look to the person or entity that will help you feel more stable—and that happens to be the gaslighter.

8. They project.

They are a drug user or a cheater, yet they are constantly accusing you of that. This is done so often that you start trying to defend yourself, and are distracted from the gaslighter's own behavior.

9. They try to align people against you.

Gaslighters are masters at manipulating and finding the people they know will stand by them no matter what—and they use these people against you. They will make comments such as, "This person knows that you're not right," or "This person knows you're useless too." Keep in mind it does not mean that these people actually said these things. A gaslighter is a constant liar. When the gaslighter uses this tactic it makes you feel like you don't know who to trust or turn to—and that leads you right back to the gaslighter. And that's exactly what they want: Isolation gives them more control.

10. They tell you or others that you are crazy.

This is one of the most effective tools of the gaslighter, because it's dismissive. The gaslighter knows if they question your sanity, people will not believe you when you tell them the gaslighter is abusive or out-of-control. It's a master technique.

11. They tell you everyone else is a liar.

By telling you that everyone else (your family, the media) is a liar, it again makes you question your reality. You've never known someone with the audacity to do this, so they must be telling the truth, right? No. It's a manipulation technique. It makes people turn to the gaslighter for the "correct" information—which isn't correct information at all.

The more you are aware of these techniques, the quicker you can identify them and avoid falling into the gaslighter's trap.

"You've never known someone with the audacity to do this, so they must be telling the truth, right?"

That's why it works. It takes advantage of the good will that others bring to relationships. I think in The Art of the Deal Trump explains that his main advantage in his transactions is a person's sense of fairness. He sees this as a weakness to exploit. He'll build up a sense of trust and then stab you in the back and then reel you back in. Just as Ingrid Bergman had a natural desire to trust her husband. And I do suggest seeing the movie.
 
You're reading way too much into this.

Study after study shows that they voted for Trump because of racism, even if they said it was about economics.

They support Trump because he tells them they are born intellectually superior by virtue of having white skin.

They support Trump because he tells them they are morally superior because they were born to the right parents.

Modern Republican propaganda-peddlers are pretty much the political equivalent of "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best!" The people who fall for the line "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best" are generally going to be the people with the smallest penises.
 
You're reading way too much into this.

Study after study shows that they voted for Trump because of racism, even if they said it was about economics.

They support Trump because he tells them they are born intellectually superior by virtue of having white skin.

They support Trump because he tells them they are morally superior because they were born to the right parents.

Modern Republican propaganda-peddlers are pretty much the political equivalent of "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best!" The people who fall for the line "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best" are generally going to be the people with the smallest penises.

Pardon my directness but that is an extremely shallow explanation of how Trump won the election and why he remains popular among Republicans.
 
Okay. But his supporters aren't confused. Confusion implies an inner process that's trying to make sense of things one doesn't fully understand. What they know is that Trump is POTUS and fuck everyone else.

They don't care what he does, what he says, nor what any consequences will be, because whatever comes out of his mouth is Truth, and whatever consequences result are the other guy's fault because if they would've done what Trump said, then nothing bad would've happened. And that's important to understand. The world belongs to the U.S. and all other nations exist to revere and admire America. Whatever America does is right. You can prove that's not true? Well fuck you and the knowledge-horse you rode in on. What I know is that America is right, and therefore you, Mr. Educated Motherfucker, are wrong.

It's America first, Trump is doing it, and he's doing it for them. It isn't about clarity, it's about tone and attitude. I grew up around people like this. My mom loved Ollie North for the way he spoke. Nevermind that he did super illegal shit and got convicted for it. He wore a Marine uniform and spoke with great strength, and goddammit, he was a hero.

They want a strongman; someone who's gonna tell the rest of the world what's up. Don't ask me how Trump is perceived as being a strong man because I am utterly fucking bewildered by it. But dammit, he's a self made billionaire, and therefore to be admired. Does it matter that he's clearly and provably not self-made? Not just no, but fuck you and your shitty pathetic life, you jealous asshole.

Yeah, Trump gaslights. Everything in the OP fits, but he isn't gaslighting his fans. He's trying to gaslight everyone else and it isn't working. But his fans are fully on board with all of it and not confused about a single thing.
 
You're reading way too much into this.

Study after study shows that they voted for Trump because of racism, even if they said it was about economics.

They support Trump because he tells them they are born intellectually superior by virtue of having white skin.

They support Trump because he tells them they are morally superior because they were born to the right parents.

Modern Republican propaganda-peddlers are pretty much the political equivalent of "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best!" The people who fall for the line "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best" are generally going to be the people with the smallest penises.

Pardon my directness but that is an extremely shallow explanation of how Trump won the election and why he remains popular among Republicans.
how so? it's absolutely accurate, though i would argue incomplete.
aside from pure unadulterated racism there is also:
1. the clinical psychosis of rural republicans where they have this delusion they are actually rich people who just don't have their money yet, so their life-threatening poverty is just a temporary condition that is irrelevant and shouldn't be acknowledged or addressed.
2. the malicious capitalism that simmers within the U.S. that prioritizes corporate excess over the advancement of the populace or health and well-being of the species at large.
3. hundreds of years of systematic breeding programs instituted by religious organizations to ensure a large body of ignorant, fearful sheep that will automatically submit utterly and completely to whomever they are told is the Figure in Authority for their tribal group.

there are basically only 2 viable reasons that anyone in 2016 decided to vote for trump:
personal economic gain,
or
literal physical mental retardation.

religious breeding programs and conservative culture have turned most of the southeastern 1/4th of the US into a cesspool of low-boiling down syndrome, so it makes perfect sense that the big noisy thing that is brightly colored would have been the candidate to get their attention.
 
Speaking to republicans online it's mostly due to 1) a pathological hatred of Hillary (she is literally evil apparently) 2) SCOTUS 3) tax breaks

The main one that comes up is SCOTUS - they were willing to hold their nose if it meant that 'liberal' appointments weren't made.
 
Okay. But his supporters aren't confused. Confusion implies an inner process that's trying to make sense of things one doesn't fully understand. What they know is that Trump is POTUS and fuck everyone else.

They don't care what he does, what he says, nor what any consequences will be, because whatever comes out of his mouth is Truth, and whatever consequences result are the other guy's fault because if they would've done what Trump said, then nothing bad would've happened. And that's important to understand. The world belongs to the U.S. and all other nations exist to revere and admire America. Whatever America does is right. You can prove that's not true? Well fuck you and the knowledge-horse you rode in on. What I know is that America is right, and therefore you, Mr. Educated Motherfucker, are wrong.

It's America first, Trump is doing it, and he's doing it for them. It isn't about clarity, it's about tone and attitude. I grew up around people like this. My mom loved Ollie North for the way he spoke. Nevermind that he did super illegal shit and got convicted for it. He wore a Marine uniform and spoke with great strength, and goddammit, he was a hero.

They want a strongman; someone who's gonna tell the rest of the world what's up. Don't ask me how Trump is perceived as being a strong man because I am utterly fucking bewildered by it. But dammit, he's a self made billionaire, and therefore to be admired. Does it matter that he's clearly and provably not self-made? Not just no, but fuck you and your shitty pathetic life, you jealous asshole.

Yeah, Trump gaslights. Everything in the OP fits, but he isn't gaslighting his fans. He's trying to gaslight everyone else and it isn't working. But his fans are fully on board with all of it and not confused about a single thing.

That's the result of #9:
9. They try to align people against you.

Gaslighters are masters at manipulating and finding the people they know will stand by them no matter what—and they use these people against you. They will make comments such as, "This person knows that you're not right," or "This person knows you're useless too." Keep in mind it does not mean that these people actually said these things. A gaslighter is a constant liar. When the gaslighter uses this tactic it makes you feel like you don't know who to trust or turn to—and that leads you right back to the gaslighter. And that's exactly what they want: Isolation gives them more control.

His fans are certainly confused.
In another thread you posted some quotes from what you said were conservative forums:

...
Comment from a conservative forum:

Wow, it scares me when I would believe a former USSR KGB Col. before I would believe a Democrat. Well, er, understandable, huh?

That's explained here:

Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation that seeks to sow seeds of doubt in a targeted individual or in members of a targeted group, making them question their own memory, perception, and sanity. Using persistent denial, misdirection, contradiction, and lying, it attempts to destabilize the victim and delegitimize the victim's belief.
...
7. They know confusion weakens people.

Gaslighters know that people like having a sense of stability and normalcy. Their goal is to uproot this and make you constantly question everything. And humans' natural tendency is to look to the person or entity that will help you feel more stable—and that happens to be the gaslighter.

...
From a different conservative forum:
Anyone who is trying to pressure Trump or even expecting Trump to pressure Putin on fake election meddling is guilty of treason -- Trump has an opportunity to finally make Russia our ally and you commie Trump haters want to screw all that up with this fake Russia thing?

Trump and Putin should only bring this up as something to share a laugh at -- and high five each other for how libs are so upset over losing the election. Russia and US will be allies -- that is something no other president could have pulled off, but Trump did.

I also agree with Trump that the only reason there was ever any tension between Russia and the US to begin with is because of the ineffectiveness of US politicians over the years (that includes JFK, Nixon, Reagan and especially Obama) -- now we have a president who will tell the libs where to stick it in defense of a true leader like Putin.

Thaaaat's 11:

11. They tell you everyone else is a liar.

By telling you that everyone else (your family, the media) is a liar, it again makes you question your reality. You've never known someone with the audacity to do this, so they must be telling the truth, right? No. It's a manipulation technique. It makes people turn to the gaslighter for the "correct" information—which isn't correct information at all.

It goes against everything the Republican conservatives have preached for decades. Even denigrating Reagan and his evil empire talk. Even Reagan loyalists are in the lib camp!

...
From a third conservative forum:
It's interesting that they think Trump should trust the US intelligence committee after what they've done to him

#8 of course:
8. They project.

They are a drug user or a cheater, yet they are constantly accusing you of that. This is done so often that you start trying to defend yourself, and are distracted from the gaslighter's own behavior.

This people have been played and we have to be willing and able to call Trump on it when it happens rather than just fall back on name calling and racism memes. That just reinforces the effect. You say only his fans have been fooled, but there are plenty of people who have been so overwhelmed with the audacity of Trump and the abandonment of core principles by their moral and ethical leaders that they haven't the strength to muster rational arguments against him. That's the real problem. People have to stop succumbing to their own incredulity!
 
Yeah, Trump gaslights. Everything in the OP fits, but he isn't gaslighting his fans. He's trying to gaslight everyone else and it isn't working. But his fans are fully on board with all of it and not confused about a single thing.

^^^ that

And no one (other than maybe a trumpster) loves being gaslighted/lied to
 
I don't think that gaslighting is just about Trump supporters. They cling to him because of the personality cult and celebrity. It is about persuading those who start out in opposition to him. Gaslighting weakens resistance and opposition. It works really well in social media and with mass media.
 
Listen to the Putin/Trump press conference. (with stuff so crazy that I thought people were making it up when they quoted it)

Then listen to Trump's next press appearance (the would/wouldn't one).

Then listen to his appearance on Hannity's radio program yesterday afternoon.

Put them all together and his game is plain to see.
 
Based on the recent craziness from Rudy last weekend - a good reminder

GASLIGHTERS:

Tell blatant lies with a straight face to keeping people off-balance

Wear you down over time because dealing with liars is exhausting

They know confusion weakens people so they purposely create confusion and make people question reality.

They project their own crimes onto others and force innocents to defend themselves to distract from their own criminality.

They call other people liars (e.g. fake news) to distract from their own Olympic lies and fabrications.

Gaslighting is a form of mental abuse based on a psychopathic need for power and control.

Rudy and Donald are just two Gaslighting Old Psychopaths Making America Great Again.

They both belong in federal prison.
 
You're reading way too much into this.

Study after study shows that they voted for Trump because of racism, even if they said it was about economics.

They support Trump because he tells them they are born intellectually superior by virtue of having white skin.

They support Trump because he tells them they are morally superior because they were born to the right parents.

Modern Republican propaganda-peddlers are pretty much the political equivalent of "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best!" The people who fall for the line "Oh baby, you're the biggest and the best" are generally going to be the people with the smallest penises.

I think that there is some truth to the fact that he does appeal to some people who see him as a 'straight shooter' who 'speaks his mind'---and who doesn't make them feel bad about their own prejudices.

Speaking of prejudices: we all have them.

He doesn't sound that smart or educated-he sounds just like them! and yet he's made millions! Billions! Never mind that he was born with a silver spoon in his crooked little mouth and his wealth may be..illusionary. He makes it look like the dream that 'any boy can be president' is true! It's easy to ignore the fact that he was given everything he has by someone who was...less than scrupulous himself. He's 'real.' Failed marriages? Yep, he's got a couple of those! Allegations of domestic abuse (quietly hushed up)--Well, that's kind of understandable. Lots of cheating/hookers? Who wouldn't if he had the chance? LOVES LOVES LOVES his kids, right???? Does his best for them, right? Is always ready to make a deal! He seems to love all the cheap crap that a lot of lottery winners blow their winnings on: showy clothes, silly luxuries. He never thinks about tomorrows too far down the road and he never things about anybody but himself.

I don't know how they can overlook the fact that he cheats all his contractors, has filed for bankruptcy multiple times (who doesn't have a bankruptcy in their background???). That he cheats people just like them as often as he gets a chance. I don't know why they don't see it. I really, really don't.

He does come across as someone who needs a little saving and don't we all? I mean, who can't relate to that?

Among the better educated and more well to do supporters, he promises low taxes and low regulation and open markets and to squash foreign competition. He obviously has no problems hiring illegals so that's a relief: they can do it as well.

He's (nowadays) anti-abortion and nobody asks how many he's paid for, maybe because he has married a couple of his pregnant mistresses.

Personally, to me, he's always been somewhere along the continuum of who would ever take this joker seriously? and he makes my skin crawl and he's a fucking idiot to now: he's a dangerous, demented idiot.

I think Republicans in power and among their donor class keep him in power so he can help them maintain and shore up their economic advantage. They see him as a useful idiot and he's fulfilling that role admirably. He creates enough of a distraction that most people don't notice that public lands are being sold off or despoiled or polluted or just ruined.

He plays into everyone's fantasy that we are all self made and if we haven't made it, it's because we're too lazy (and maybe genetically inferior).

Plus sexism and racism.
 
Personally, to me, he's always been somewhere along the continuum of who would ever take this joker seriously? and he makes my skin crawl and he's a fucking idiot to now: he's a dangerous, demented idiot.

To me he was a joker who made me want to puke long before he entered the campaign. By the time he was nominated, he was the dangerous, demented idiot you describe.
I am still in wonder at the apparent reality that people exist who can look at and listen to that waste of protoplasm for more than ten seconds, and not know with absolute certainainty that he's a lowlife scumbag.
 
I don't think that gaslighting is just about Trump supporters.


Of course it isn't. It was explained well in that article. And as much as some would like to believe their own "side" doesn't do it, that would be a lie they've accepted. 1/3 women are raped in college don't you know.
 
I don't think that gaslighting is just about Trump supporters.


Of course it isn't. It was explained well in that article. And as much as some would like to believe their own "side" doesn't do it, that would be a lie they've accepted. 1/3 women are raped in college don't you know.

And here we have our own gaslighter.
 
I don't think that gaslighting is just about Trump supporters.


Of course it isn't. It was explained well in that article. And as much as some would like to believe their own "side" doesn't do it, that would be a lie they've accepted. 1/3 women are raped in college don't you know.

Now they've gone from 1/4 to 1/3??

Even the 1/4 was bogus data--they were counting cases where the woman didn't want sex but consented for other reasons (say, to keep a boyfriend) as rape.

Reality: Actual rape reports to the police are lower for women in college than for women of the same age not in college.
 
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